Trumps plan to open America

Cindy S.

When he comes, will he find faith? Luke 18:8
I watch daily.

There will be tracking. They didn’t elaborate on how.

Also..there was no further elaboration on if a hot pocket was located, how it would be dealt with or managed.

They also indicated that Govs control dates.

I hesitate, not out of fear of the virus, but, because of man. We tend to get power hungry and mess things up. There’s already been many rights violated.

I did wonder if these pop up hospitals were designed for something else, honestly. So much work and effort, and nurses/med professionals are being laid off in droves in so many places. Things just don’t add up.
When did the first surveillance camera pop up?
They've been tracking us for years...
 

Cindy S.

When he comes, will he find faith? Luke 18:8
The people will revolt if they push it much further. Their power is already cracking in several places.

I watched the briefing but didn’t have time to come on last night. Our governor held a briefing and pretty much said nothing. A few days ago he said April 24 or 26th the order should be lifted. He hasn’t said anything further since then.

What I do see are lots of people out and about. Our street is getting busier than it was. People have tried to stay home here but it’s to the point if they don’t work, they don’t eat. No one has received checks here that I’ve heard of.

The plan itself seems ok. I didn’t see any mandatory papers, vaccines or chipping in order to go back to work or school. I don’t like the idea of being monitored though and will push back if forced on myself. I’m a grownup, I don’t need a nanny to tell me to stay home if I’m sick.
They can't do much more monitoring than they already do with surveillance cameras. Unless people get chipped, it's probably just monitoring data of hotspots if they turn up. Our sheriff's already said they're not going to enforce the lockdown.
 

RobinMc

Well-Known Member
On Tucker Carlson last nite, he had a professor, expert in something, that surprisingly was not liberal, who said (and I had read it previously) the Sweden had not put in place any restrictions, except on nursing facilities, and that their death rate, per capita was almost exactly the same as ours. they showed film of people eating, shopping, doing everything people do. He also said Norway, that had shut down almost everything, actually had a higher rate of infection and a slightly lower death rate. You will never hear this on the national news, other than Fox, but it really said something to me. I believe all the reaction has been preplanned over kill. My friends and I have started calling and emailing our governor and representatives demanding that things be opened up!
 

Kenny

Well-Known Member
On Tucker Carlson last nite, he had a professor, expert in something, that surprisingly was not liberal, who said (and I had read it previously) the Sweden had not put in place any restrictions, except on nursing facilities, and that their death rate, per capita was almost exactly the same as ours. they showed film of people eating, shopping, doing everything people do. He also said Norway, that had shut down almost everything, actually had a higher rate of infection and a slightly lower death rate. You will never hear this on the national news, other than Fox, but it really said something to me. I believe all the reaction has been preplanned over kill. My friends and I have started calling and emailing our governor and representatives demanding that things be opened up!
Rather than preplanned over kill, I would think our officials were being cautious. JMHO :)
 

ozaprah

Well-Known Member
On Tucker Carlson last nite, he had a professor, expert in something, that surprisingly was not liberal, who said (and I had read it previously) the Sweden had not put in place any restrictions, except on nursing facilities, and that their death rate, per capita was almost exactly the same as ours. they showed film of people eating, shopping, doing everything people do. He also said Norway, that had shut down almost everything, actually had a higher rate of infection and a slightly lower death rate. You will never hear this on the national news, other than Fox, but it really said something to me. I believe all the reaction has been preplanned over kill. My friends and I have started calling and emailing our governor and representatives demanding that things be opened up!

Easy to check.
Sweden: Population 10.23 mil 13216 cases 1400 deaths Case fatality ratio: 10.59% Incidence per 100000: 130 Deaths per 100000: 13
Norway: Population 5.368 mil 6937 cases 161 deaths Case fatality ratio: 2.32% Incidence per 100000: 127 Deaths per 100000: 2.9

So, roughly same number of cases per capita (if testing rates in each country are equivalent) but 4x the death rate. I wouldn't call that a slightly lower death rate. Lock down seems to work with regards to death rates by locking down and not exposing the vulnerable.
The question is can you open up the economy and still manage to keep these vulnerable sheltered.

Found an interesting commentary on Sweden:
https://www.project-syndicate.org/c...model-proves-lethal-by-hans-bergstrom-2020-04
 

Ghoti Ichthus

Pray so they do not serve alone. Ephesians 6:10-20
Easy to check.
Sweden: Population 10.23 mil 13216 cases 1400 deaths Case fatality ratio: 10.59% Incidence per 100000: 130 Deaths per 100000: 13
Norway: Population 5.368 mil 6937 cases 161 deaths Case fatality ratio: 2.32% Incidence per 100000: 127 Deaths per 100000: 2.9

So, roughly same number of cases per capita (if testing rates in each country are equivalent) but 4x the death rate. I wouldn't call that a slightly lower death rate. Lock down seems to work with regards to death rates by locking down and not exposing the vulnerable.
The question is can you open up the economy and still manage to keep these vulnerable sheltered.

Found an interesting commentary on Sweden:
https://www.project-syndicate.org/c...model-proves-lethal-by-hans-bergstrom-2020-04
Since most of the deaths seem to be in long-term-care facilities, sheltering a good number of vulnerable would be easy. The problem is caretakers bringing it in. It may be that caretakers in such facilities need to be isolated along with the elderly until the plague is done. That opens up a whole new can of worms. Or maybe caretakers need to be live-ins like live-in nannies, and isolate when stuff like this comes aound (including flu, etc.). Or each room/suite in such places absolutely must have it's own ventilation system and airlock/decon entry for caretakers.

The other alternative is permanently closing down all the long-term care facilities and having elderly live with their families, as they used to do.


:armor :pray :bible :pray :amen :knight

:bible Ephesians 6:10-20
 

ozaprah

Well-Known Member
Since most of the deaths seem to be in long-term-care facilities, sheltering a good number of vulnerable would be easy. The problem is caretakers bringing it in.
Worldwide in general yes. However the US is having a particular problem with younger people dying of COVID in comparison to the rest of the world. Worldwide deaths under 65yo by COVID account to about 3% of COVID deaths. In New York it's 28%. Poor metabolic health is catching up with the Western World, the US in particular.
So defining who is 'vulnerable' is the difficult metric.
 

Ghoti Ichthus

Pray so they do not serve alone. Ephesians 6:10-20
In Minnesota, about 97 pecent of the cases of COVID19 are in 20 through over 65 year-olds, People over 65 accounted for 30 pecent of the cases, but make up only 15 percent of the population. Fifteen percent of cases have been in long-tem care facilities (having over 10 beds) and another four percent in assisted living.
.
So far, all of the deaths have been people 56-100 years old. Every a.m. on the (really early morning) news they give the new death count and say how many were in long-term care facilities (with more than 10 beds). As of April 15th, 65 of the 87 (74. 7 pecent) Minnesota COVID19 deaths have been in long-term care facilities (with over 10 beds).

Differing fom other states, in Minnesota, African Americans are both less likely to be infected with or die from COVID19 than Whites.

https://www.health.state.mn.us/diseases/coronavirus/situation.html#ageg1

https://www.mncompass.org/trends/insights/2017-05-30-older-adults

https://www.minnpost.com/health/202...ths-so-far-tied-to-long-term-care-facilities/

Since the virus can be spread via fecal matter, I wonder if (male) homosexuality or heterosexual anal sex are risk factors. I also wonder about population density (apartments with common doors, doorknobs/handles, floors, laundries, trash chutes, etc.). There is evidence COVID19 can remain on floors and shoes for polonged periods and can be spread via defective plumbing

https://www.health.com/condition/infectious-diseases/coronavirus-fecal-transmission

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200414/cdc-covid-19-can-spread-13-feet-travel-on-shoes

https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus-covid19-virus-faeces-urine-155051554.html

Of course, it would be politically incorrect to do a study correlating apartment living or homosexuality with COVID infection :mad

Anyone remember Gay Related Immune Deficiency (GRID), later called AIDS, and now known as HIV-positive?

Sodom and Gomorrah... :eek

[vomiting emoticon]

[repent emoticon]
:pray :pray :amen :amen Hurry up, Jesus! :rapture


:armor :pray :bible :pray :amen :knight

:bible Ephesians 6:10-20
 
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Beautiful Feet

Well-Known Member
I know some folks here believe that we should never have shut down the country; I am curious from that standpoint what would you do with places like New York City? The fact that Samaritan Purse had to build a field hospital demonstrates that this disease can clog up the hospital system and the fact that mass graves are being dug shows that it (Covid) can plow through a lot of lives quickly. Would you guys suggest keeping New York City completely open and working through the midst of this? I am curious. I promise I won't argue about it. I just would like to see this side of the argument completely presented.
 

Cindy S.

When he comes, will he find faith? Luke 18:8
I know some folks here believe that we should never have shut down the country; I am curious from that standpoint what would you do with places like New York City? The fact that Samaritan Purse had to build a field hospital demonstrates that this disease can clog up the hospital system and the fact that mass graves are being dug shows that it (Covid) can plow through a lot of lives quickly. Would you guys suggest keeping New York City completely open and working through the midst of this? I am curious. I promise I won't argue about it. I just would like to see this side of the argument completely presented.
It would have been cheaper to require everyone to wear a mask in public IMO.
Locking us down has done more damage than good.
The virus is still out there "they" say.
If they can force us to wear seatbelts...
 

Tall Timbers

Imperfect but forgiven
I know some folks here believe that we should never have shut down the country; I am curious from that standpoint what would you do with places like New York City? The fact that Samaritan Purse had to build a field hospital demonstrates that this disease can clog up the hospital system and the fact that mass graves are being dug shows that it (Covid) can plow through a lot of lives quickly. Would you guys suggest keeping New York City completely open and working through the midst of this? I am curious. I promise I won't argue about it. I just would like to see this side of the argument completely presented.
,

Request that people wear masks, practice social distancing, stay home as much as individuals feel is reasonable, definitely stay home if they're sick, and encourage any who consider themselves among the more vulnerable to social isolate as much as they can.
 

lightofmylife

Blessed Hope-Prepare To Fly!
It would have been cheaper to require everyone to wear a mask in public IMO.
Locking us down has done more damage than good.
The virus is still out there "they" say.
If they can force us to wear seatbelts...
Our law here is if you get caught not wearing your seatbelt click it or ticket. They would need some enforcers, if you don't wear a mask they will fine you! If people thought they would have to pay money out, they just might wear a mask.
 

Flyfisher

Well-Known Member
The whole problem is we don’t know what the true infection rate is. There are more and more studies that show many are infected but never show signs. That brings the death rate down. I have seen from 1 in 10 to 1 in 20 of infected is actually diagnosed. Another said an 85 x infection rate I believe. What I find interesting is that we don’t believe the MSM (fake news) on other stuff but somehow everyone is believing them now. Is the virus real yes. Can it be bad for some people yes. But then again the flu poses the same thing every year depending on what strain is prevalent. So what we should have done is social distancing, those who can work from home should. Look up effectiveness of different type of masks against viruses. Except for N95 you will see that they are almost worthless. Only thing they might help is when an infected person is coughing or sneezing in public. It will help some in keeping the virus particles from dispersing in a larger area because it slows it down as it passes through the mask.
 
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