Rick Warren builds bridge to Muslims (and then will later deny it and complain...

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
Rick Warren builds bridge to Muslims


CARLOS DELGADO, FOR THE REGISTER
By JIM HINCH / FOR THE REGISTER

The Rev. Rick Warren, pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest and one of America's most influential Christian leaders, has embarked on an effort to heal divisions between evangelical Christians and Muslims by partnering with Southern California mosques and proposing a set of theological principles that includes acknowledging that Christians and Muslims worship the same God.



The effort, informally dubbed King's Way, caps years of outreach between Warren and Muslims. Warren has broken Ramadan fasts at a Mission Viejo mosque, met Muslim leaders abroad and addressed 8,000 Muslims at a national convention in Washington D.C.




Saddleback worshippers have invited Muslims to Christmas dinner and played interfaith soccer at a picnic in Irvine attended by more than 300 people. (The game pitted pastors and imams against teens from both faiths. The teens won.)


The effort by a prominent Christian leader to bridge what polls show is a deep rift between Muslims and evangelical Christians culminated in December at a dinner at Saddleback attended by 300 Muslims and members of Saddleback's congregation.




At the dinner, Abraham Meulenberg, a Saddleback pastor in charge of interfaith outreach, and Jihad Turk, director of religious affairs at a mosque in Los Angeles, introduced King's Way as "a path to end the 1,400 years of misunderstanding between Muslims and Christians."


The men presented a document they co-authored outlining points of agreement between Islam and Christianity. The document affirms that Christians and Muslims believe in "one God" and share two central commandments: "love of God" and "love of neighbor." The document also commits both faiths to three goals: Making friends with one another, building peace and working on shared social service projects. The document quotes side-by-side verses from the Bible and the Koran to illustrate its claims.


"We agreed we wouldn't try to evangelize each other," said Turk. "We'd witness to each other but it would be out of 'Love Thy Neighbor,' not focused on conversion."


Saddleback representatives declined to make Warren available for comment. Tom Holladay, associate senior pastor at Saddleback, said the outreach to Muslims is part of Saddleback's PEACE Plan, a wide-ranging effort to solve major world problems by mobilizing governments, businesses and faith communities.



"This is us serving our own community with Muslims here in Orange County," said Holladay. "We realize we don't agree about everything and we're very open about that. ... You just recognize the differences and recognize the points where you can work together."



Warren has faced criticism from some evangelicals for his outreach to Muslims. Late last year, he issued a statement flatly denying rumors that he promulgates what critics term "Chrislam," a merging of Islam and Christianity.


The "rumor is 100 percent false," Warren wrote at Pastors.com, a website he founded that provides practical advice to church leaders. "My life and ministry are built on the truth that Jesus is the only way, and our inerrant Bible is our only true authority."



Polls show that evangelicals are 30 percent more likely than other Christians to hold a negative view of Islam, according to the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. Polls also show that evangelicals overwhelmingly favor converting Muslims to Christianity and are more likely to believe that Islam encourages violence.
Warren has repeatedly encouraged evangelicals to set aside such views, arguing that Christians are obliged to treat everyone with love and respect, regardless of faith.



"I don't know if you have noticed this, but God likes variety," Warren told an audience of 8,000 Muslims at a Washington, D.C. convention in 2009, according to a transcript published by the religion news website beliefnet. "People of all beliefs (can) be, and discuss, and, yes, even disagree, without demeaning or debasing each other."



Warren's outreach to Muslims stems directly from his church's location in multiethnic Orange County, home to 170,000 Muslims.


For 12 years Warren has lived next door to Yasser Barakat, a Muslim from Syria who worships at a Mission Viejo mosque four miles down the road from Saddleback. The Trabuco Canyon neighbors were friends for years before Barakat realized he lived next door to a world-famous Christian pastor.


When Barakat discovered who Warren was, he invited his neighbor to learn more about Islam. "I was talking to him over the fence," Barakat said. "I said, 'Rick, why don't you go to Syria with me? He said, 'Sure, let's talk about it. Let's do it.' "



Warren traveled with Barakat to Syria in 2006, and Warren and his wife, Kay, began attending Iftar meals at the Mission Viejo mosque. Iftar is the evening meal Muslims eat after fasting all day during the holy month of Ramadan. Invitations followed to address Muslim conferences in Long Beach, Washington, D.C., and elsewhere.


"We understand that to some people in the religious community these events may be difficult to swallow," said Yassir Fazaga, imam at the Mission Viejo mosque.


"But I believe that we have to begin somewhere and just begin to reach out and be accessible to people when they ask about who we are."
Gwynne Guibord, an ordained Episcopal priest and co-founder of a Los Angeles outreach group that fosters relationships between churches and mosques nationwide, said Saddleback's effort is unprecedented.


"I'm not aware of any other evangelical church reaching out to the Muslim community," she said.
Guibord said that when she and Jihad Turk co-founded the Christian-Muslim Consultative Group in 2006, they sent invitations to mosques, the Catholic archdiocese and a variety of mainline Protestant denominations throughout Southern California, but not to evangelical churches.



"I think that many evangelicals feel a mandate to convert people to Christianity," Guibord said. Because the Consultative Group was founded to respond to increasing antagonism between the two faiths, "we would not have made headway" if one side was trying to convert the other, she said. Now, she said, it might be possible to include evangelicals in her group's work.



Turk said the relationship between Saddleback and Muslims, though still in its infancy, has already produced results. "People (at the December dinner) were talking about the bonds they've formed and they were crying," he said. Both sides realized they shared misconceptions about each other's faith.
"We did a quiz at the Christmas dinner," Turk said, "asking basic questions about Islam or Christianity with the scriptures, the Koran or the Bible. And both sides were missing it.... It's an education for everyone."


Barakat said he continues to know Warren as a man who literally loves his neighbor. Barakat said his children could always count on Warren to buy the candy or magazine subscriptions they sold door-to-door for school fundraisers. The Warrens have hosted Barakat's family at a Christmas dinner, he said.
"He calls me his Muslim brother," Barakat said. "It all started with a friendship."



Rick Warren builds bridge to Muslims | muslims, warren, saddleback - Life - The Orange County Register
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
want to bet he whines later and "denies" it

rick gets huffy when jack van impe calls him out on his tv show



you see folks, rick warren complains from time to time on twitter about van impe and rick's chrislam "lie" as rick calls it


(anyone who says rick warren is a bridger is almost instantly called a liar by rick warren on twitter and elsewhere)
 

SteveJM

Well-Known Member
want to bet he whines later and "denies" it

rick gets huffy when jack van impe calls him out on his tv show



you see folks, rick warren complains from time to time on twitter about van impe and rick's chrislam "lie" as rick calls it


(anyone who says rick warren is a bridger is almost instantly called a liar by rick warren on twitter and elsewhere)
To his credit, Jack Van Impe has been calling out several prominent religious leaders, political figures, and TV personalities. He's also been speaking out, as you share, against Chrislam. I'm on his mailing list and his latest issue of Perhaps Today was pretty good. He stood up to TBN when they refused to broadcast his shows where he named names of ministry leaders who are compromising God's Word. Dr. Van Impe has made some missteps along the way and I still don't understand his cozy relationship with the RCC, but I do feel that, I hope that, as time goes by he will make corrections where they need to be made. In my opinion, he should be in our prayers.
 

followerofjesus

Slave of Christ
Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? What harmony is there between Christ and Belial? Or what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever? What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said:

“I will live with them
and walk among them,
and I will be their God,
and they will be my people.”

Therefore,

“Come out from them
and be separate,
says the Lord.
Touch no unclean thing,
and I will receive you.”

2 Corinthians 6:14-17
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
Rick Warren doesn't play fair because he is crafty and we know where craftiness comes from...
u are so right


likely john piper as well as james macdonald I would bet will help also spin warren's latest problems/controversy

since piper like macdonald 100 percent supports Warren no matter what he says or does
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
Controversy Over An Article About Rick Warren's Efforts to Bring Muslims, Christians Together
Posted by Christine Pack


According to our article posted just a few hours ago, Rick Warren, megachurch pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, CA, is currently working to build a "bridge" (through a document called "King's Way") between Christians and Muslims by claiming that the two faiths worship the same God.


The "King's Way" document, which is the foundation for these bridge building efforts, is not yet publicly available, but a December 2011 meeting at Saddleback Church has been documented here. From the article by Jim Hinch of the Orange County Register:

"The Rev. Rick Warren, pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest and one of America's most influential Christian leaders, has embarked on an effort to heal divisions between evangelical Christians and Muslims by partnering with Southern California mosques and proposing a set of theological principles that includes acknowledging that Christians and Muslims worship the same God." (online source)


After this article appeared, Pastor Warren commented on the article in the comments section, claiming that there were errors in the Orange County article:





After Warren's comment, we amended our article to add the following:



NOTE: Pastor Rick Warren recently stated in the comments section of the above article that the article contained many inaccuracies, but did not elaborate further.

I will be happy to publish any statements from Rick Warren/Saddleback detailing the "multiple errors - factually and theologically" that are contained in the sourced article.
But then a few hours later, the writer of the article (Jim Hinch), also commented on the article:




(Thank you to a Facebook friend for pointing me to Jim Hinch's response to Rick Warren's comment.)


Sola Sisters: Controversy Over An Article About Rick Warren's Efforts to Bring Muslims, Christians Together
 

OnceWasLost

Super Moderator
Here is iron clad proof of ricks disease. If you are convinced of the atoning message of The Cross, all the "bridge building" must eventually lead to "convert". Either he has a view that all roads lead there or he is unconcerned about the inevitable damnation of their soul.

I would love to ask slick rick a question. Do you believe a muslim will be saved if he dies as a muslim?

If He answers yes, then, Houston, we have a problem. If he answers no, then, Houston, we have another problem, because rick will not given them what they need (the only True Way of salvation) just to pursue some kingdom building madness that leads to a different kingdom all together.

He has so much blood on his hands. :tsk:
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
Monday, February 27, 2012

Does Rick Warren Still Get Dr. John Piper's "Stamp of Approval?"
Posted by Christine Pack


Many of us know by now that, in 2010, Dr. John Piper (author of Desiring God and pastor of Bethlehem Baptist Church) gave his "stamp of approval" to Rick Warren by having Warren be a keynote speaker at Dr. Piper's annual Desiring God conference.


This was an event that caught many in evangelicalism off guard and resulted in a flurry of articles and blog posts over a number of months.


The problem with Dr. Piper welcoming Rick Warren into the fold is that Dr. Piper has long been known as a champion and protector of the purity of the gospel message. He has served as a trusted church leader to whom many turned in an effort to get sound, biblical teaching. This is no small thing in today's church community which is moving increasingly away from expositional teaching in favor of watered down, topical style preaching.


So when Dr. Piper asked Rick Warren to be a keynote speaker at Desiring God's annual conference, it was perceived by many to be analogous to the shepherd throwing open the gate to the sheep-fold and welcoming in the wolf, rather than protecting his flock from the wolf.



“Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the church of God, which he bought with his own blood. I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock.


Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. So be on your guard!


Remember that for three years I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears.”Acts 20:28-31
But now there is a new issue.


According to Erin Benziger's recent article "Historic Interfaith Document" was "One Year in the Making," Rick Warren's Saddleback Church has been working on co-authoring a Muslim-Christian interfaith document ("King's Way") with the Islamic Center of Southern California (ICSC).


According to Benziger's article, this document has been "one year in the making," and openly states that "The first step in the plan identifies the belief in one God." So now I'm wondering what John Piper thinks about this Muslim-Christian interfaith document being drafted by his friend, Rick Warren?


For the record, Dr. Piper has historically been very clear about his stance on Islam. In fact, shortly after another recent interfaith document (A Common Word) was released, he gave a strong video statement (below) in response to it. (Please note that Rick Warren signed the Common Word document.) Dr. Piper also expressed his disappointment that a friend of his had signed A Common Word. It appears that at the time A Common Word came out (2008),

John Piper was willing to give his friend Rick Warren the benefit of the doubt, in that two years later he invited Rick Warren (one of the Common Word signers) to be a keynote speaker for him at his 2010 Desiring God conference.


But now in light of this new interfaith document aimed at uniting Christians and Muslims ("King's Way"),


the question must be asked: does Dr. Piper still give Rick Warren his "stamp of approval?"

[YOU TUBE VIDEO]rTY-9FY13kw[/YOU TUBE VIDEO]
 

SteveJM

Well-Known Member
Here is iron clad proof of ricks disease. If you are convinced of the atoning message of The Cross, all the "bridge building" must eventually lead to "convert". Either he has a view that all roads lead there or he is unconcerned about the inevitable damnation of their soul.

I would love to ask slick rick a question. Do you believe a muslim will be saved if he dies as a muslim?

If He answers yes, then, Houston, we have a problem. If he answers no, then, Houston, we have another problem, because rick will not given them what they need (the only True Way of salvation) just to pursue some kingdom building madness that leads to a different kingdom all together.

He has so much blood on his hands. :tsk:
Would Rick Warren even answer that question with a yes or no? It's interesting that there is a Rick Warren listed on the 2012 members roster for the Council on Foreign Relations, and, from several online sources, he admits to being a member. I don't know if that's true or not, does anyone here at the Forums know for sure?
 

OnceWasLost

Super Moderator
Would Rick Warren even answer that question with a yes or no? It's interesting that there is a Rick Warren listed on the 2012 members roster for the Council on Foreign Relations, and, from several online sources, he admits to being a member. I don't know if that's true or not, does anyone here at the Forums know for sure?
It's my understanding he is, and it gives him a platform for the PEACE plan to be spread through the UN, NGO programs. He is the pied piper of the 'christian" arm of the one world religion soon to be foisted on humanity by the AC.
 

SteveJM

Well-Known Member
It's my understanding he is, and it gives him a platform for the PEACE plan to be spread through the UN, NGO programs. He is the pied piper of the 'christian" arm of the one world religion soon to be foisted on humanity by the AC.
Thanks, OnceWasLost, for your answer. Rick, his books, and "ministries," need to be avoided like the plague that they are, and I would be very concerned with any author, preacher, anyone, that endorses him. Do you have a link to a very good expose on Rick Warren, one that you would recommend for sharing with those who are blindly supporting him? I have a preacher friend that I would like to help in that regard. Thanks.
 

OnceWasLost

Super Moderator
Thanks, OnceWasLost, for your answer. Rick, his books, and "ministries," need to be avoided like the plague that they are, and I would be very concerned with any author, preacher, anyone, that endorses him. Do you have a link to a very good expose on Rick Warren, one that you would recommend for sharing with those who are blindly supporting him? I have a preacher friend that I would like to help in that regard. Thanks.
**********: Deceived on Purpose (9780966707137): Warren B. Smith: Books

Warren is a person I am blessed to call friend.

Google Warren Smith and rick warren there will be articles galore that Warren has written.
 

OnceWasLost

Super Moderator
Thanks, I think I'll start with his book, A "Wonderful" Deception: The Further New Age Implications of the Emerging Purpose Driven Movement .
That book was going to be an appendix of 10 chapters or so to Deceived on Purpose, but it morphed into a whole new book.
 

OnceWasLost

Super Moderator
February 27, 2012

Do Muslims & Christians Believe in the Same God?


• OC Register Story Claims that Folks at Saddleback Believe Muslims & Christians Believe in the Same God.

• Sermon Review: What Do You Say On A Cross? by Mark Kelsey, C3, Oxford Falls


Fighting for the Faith: Do Muslims & Christians Believe in the Same God?
If true, and I have no reason to believe it's not, then it is further proof of people eating from a diseased tree. rick and the purpose driven movement is a disease and the people eating its fruit are dying spiritually from their consumption of it.
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
A Messianic Jewish leader says it's a tragedy that mega-church pastor Rick Warren is ignoring the Great Commission as he reaches out to Muslims in southern California.





The Orange County Register reports that Warren, senior pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, California, is part of an effort called "King's Way" that is attempting to build a bridge between evangelical Christians and Muslims.

Warren says he wants to heal divisions by partnering with area mosques through a proposed set of principles that includes acknowledging that Christians and Muslims worship the same God.

King's Way is also committed to building friendships with members of the other faith, without either group proselytizing the other, as the focus is not on conversion but on loving thy neighbor (Matthew 22:39).






But Jan Markell, founder and director of Olive Tree Ministries, wonders how the Christian leader can overlook the Great Commission, which calls on Christians to "go and make disciples of all nations" (Matthew 28:16-20).

"Why and when did we get a pass on sharing our faith, on witnessing?" she wonders. "You can be a friend to a Muslim all the way into hell -- and that's where these Muslims are going, for Pete's sake. They're headed straight for hell, and Rick Warren could do something about that by sharing the gospel with them."



Markell says King's Way is part of the Church of Laodicea in Revelation 3.

"This is just more of the church that has lost its direction, that is not tending to the sheep properly," she decides.


The Olive Tree Ministries founder concludes that it is a tragedy that at this late hour, Warren is not telling lost Muslims that Christ is the only bridge to eternal life.



Late last year, Warren flatly denied rumors he said were "100-percent false" that he promotes a Christian-Islam mixture identified as "Chrislam." He stated at that time: "My life and ministry are built on the truth that Jesus is the only way, and our inerrant Bible is our only true authority."




Rick Warren: Christians, Muslims worship same God (OneNewsNow.com)
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
When Apostasy Runs Amok

By Jan Markell

Olive Tree Ministries with Jan Markell

March 1, 2012



Join Us On Facebook!


In the early days of all things "purpose driven," I didn't say much. I was, admittedly, skeptical. I had a hunch churches might experience the promised growth thanks to the movement behind "purpose driven," the seeker-sensitive movement; however, it might not be a healthy growth. But as the years moved on, I started hearing about wreckage. Calls and e-mails told me that beloved congregations were caving to all things unsound and even unscriptural. Members were told that the ends justified the means. In other words, numbers trumped everything.



So, I began to watch Pastor Warren more carefully. When he praised the freedom in Syria in 2006, I just shuddered. When he spoke to the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA) and withheld the gospel, I reacted again. ISNA is a front for the Muslim Brotherhood. When he told Alan Colmes to "give Jesus a try for 60 days," I came close to writing him off.



When Rick began featuring occultic "New Agers" in his church sanctuary in January 2011, I further realized that "America's Pastor" wasn't as sound as he had been portrayed. Rick allowed a year-long effort at fitness to headquarter out of Saddleback Church and concluded the event by cheering that Saddleback members lost 250,000 pounds. Rick, some souls might have been lost during that time because Drs. Amen, Hymen and Oz represent the dark side of the world, not the light of Jesus. These men are secularists. At one time, Dr. Oz even had a link on his Web site that took you to a place where you could learn how to talk to the dead.



But Rick did it again coming out of the shoot into 2012 and I am being a bit outspoken about this. He's leading an effort to heal divisions between Christians and Muslims by partnering with Southern California mosques. He is proposing theological principles that include acknowledging Christians and Muslims worship the same God.



A Saddleback Church spokesman says this effort "is a path to end the 1,400 years of misunderstanding between Muslims and Christians." The root of this madness goes back to "A Christian Response to a Common Word Between Us and You" This was a joint effort between Muslims and Christians to deepen dialogue and relations at the Yale Center for Faith and Culture. Pastor Warren was one of the signers, along with hundreds of other Christian leaders. They also acknowledged that neither Muslim nor Christian would try to evangelize each other. Just like that, evangelism evaporates in the minds of major Christian leaders. We've got to all get along! Rodney King, you would be proud of us!



One of the statements of this "Common Word" effort was that religious peace would bring world peace. No, the return of Christ will bring world peace. Evangelical signers of this document should have known better.



I stand with Joseph Farah on this issue. He states, "If you compare the personality of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob -- the Christian and Hebrew God -- with Allah, Islam's god, the contrast could not be more stark. The Hebrew-Christian God is characterized by love. The Islamic god is characterized by war and vengeance. The Hebrew-Christian God provides a clear path to redemption and personal salvation in a fallen world -- through repentance. The Islamic god provides only one certain path to personal salvation -- martyrdom. The Hebrew-Christian God elevates the status of women. The Islamic god does the opposite.


"The Hebrew-Christian God encourages followers to be a light to the whole world. The Islamic god encourages jihad on the non-Islamic world and, ultimately and unambiguously, calls for the death of unconverted Christians and Jews."



Farah concludes, "Into this breech, Warren seeks common theological ground. It would be easier to find common theological ground between Christians and atheists than Christians and Muslims."



What becomes immediately apparent is that while making friends with Muslims is certainly an admirable goal, Warren has prioritized the three goals of making friends, building peace and working together on shared social service projects over and above the commandment of Jesus to baptize and make disciples of the whole world.



Author Joel Richardson says that rather than obeying the Great Commission and creating disciples of the Jesus of the Bible, Warren is "building a Tower of Babel that leads to nowhere."


Richardson concludes, "I would agree in that when Christian groups join together with other groups that have such fundamentally divergent goals and doctrines, the danger is always compromise. Throughout the Old Testament, the commandment of God to the Israelites was to never enter into agreements, covenants or marriages with the surrounding peoples, lest the Israelites would find themselves led away to worship other gods. In such a postmodern culture, these concepts may sound amazingly intolerant, but the wisdom of the Lord's prescription against treaties and partnerships is seen in Warren's agreement not to evangelize his Muslim 'friends' and co-laborers for mutual social causes."



The ultimate hope of Christianity is the Lord's return. Islam awaits a Mahdi who would eradicate Christianity. Thus, I agree with Richardson's conclusion: "If Warren was pursuing friendships for the purpose of evangelism, I would openly stand with him in this goal. But I think it is clear that Warren is pursuing an agenda far more in line with the spirit of the age than with the goals of the early Christian Church."



Being a critic of Rick Warren costs one plenty! I have lost friends and other loved ones because I have not always been supportive of all things purpose-driven, or market-driven church growth. Do I think Rick loves God and is serving Him to the best of his ability? Yes. I just think "Peace Plans" and global initiatives don't belong in the house of God. Cozying up to Mullahs and uttering words they want to hear produces nothing but a laughing Mullah. Such agendas morph into ideas and plans that are counter productive to God's ultimate call on the church.


What we can agree upon is that Pastor Rick Warren needs our prayers. While he vehemently denies that he is involved in the Chrislam movement, actions speak louder than words.


When Apostasy Runs Amok
 

billiefan2000

Well-Known Member
related:

Chrislam: When common ground becomes shaky ground
Posted by Christine Pack



Christian apologist and talk show host Chris Rosebrough (Fighting For The Faith) was recently the featured guest on Stand Up For The Truth radio show. http://standupforthetruth.com/


From the Stand Up For The Truth website: http://standupforthetruth.com/

"We know that the God of the Bible is not the same god of the Qur’an. Yahweh of the Bible became flesh 2,000 years ago to be that perfect lamb, the Son, the atonement for our sins. The Jesus we believe in is God. But Allah of the Qur’an did not have a son.


There was no atonement, no hope of a Messiah, and no grace for sinners.


The Christian God and the Muslim Allah cannot be one and the same. And yet there are a growing number of Christians and Muslims who are combining the faith–syncretizing the two into one.


That’s called Chrislam, and it is heresy.



This week the Orange County Register reported in an article that leadership of Pastor Rick Warren’s Saddleback Church believe that Muslims and Christians believe in the same God. Is the article accurate? Is that truly what these leaders believe?


Our guest today has communicated with Rick Warren twice in the past few days, and it’s as close as anyone has gotten to America’s Pastor to hear in his own words what is going on.




Chris Rosebrough is host of a daily two-hour internet radio program, Fighting For The Faith, heard around the world on Pirate Christian Radio,

a broadcast group he started in his hometown of Indianapolis.


Chris is at the forefront of those contending for the truth of God’s Word."
Listen to the show in its entirety here.


http://standupforthetruth.com/files/2012/02/SUFT_2-29-12.mp3
 
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