Psalm 83....help with understanding

Discussion in 'Isaiah 17 / Psalm 83' started by TruthBJesus, Jan 3, 2019.

  1. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    Well, we might not have long to wait and going back to what Jesus said,

    Matthew 24:34 King James Version (KJV)
    34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

    The generation that shall not pass is going into their 71st year this May since Israel again became a nation.

    Somewhere in the very near future the Psalm 83 war has to take place along with the rapture, let that sink in for awhile.

    Also, the antichrist has to rise to power in order to confirm the covenant as found in Daniel 9:27

    What is not found between Daniel 9:26 and Daniel 9:27 is the age of grace or the church age.

    The time frame gets increasingly smaller as time progresses.
     
  2. Jonathan

    Jonathan Well-Known Member

    I do not know the answer to this question. But, I often wonder, as some teachers have suggested, is if Psalm 83 has already happened in the 20th Century, specifically the wars that Israel had to fight with her neighbors to assure her existence. I'm just now looking up at Greg64's comment so I guess I am not alone. Truth be told, though I don't know.
     
  3. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    Maybe this short video by Hal Lindsey will help,

     
  4. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    The Middle East conflict in 6 minutes

     
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  5. Trust&Obey

    Trust&Obey Member

    Ohioan. Interesting video. Around the 7 1/2 minute mark Hal says that he believes the rapture will happen between the Psalm 83 war and the Ezekiel 38-39 war (if I'm understanding correctly.) Since the rapture is imminent and a signless event, I question this speculation. Also, when I clicked on this video to see how long ago it was posted it said 2013 (it was not directly posted by Hal, so it could be even older.) Saudi Arabia, for instance, seems less inclined today to attack Israel, due to their common enemy Iran. However, we know things can change.

    The 1948 Arab - Israeli War - Led by Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq. Contingents also came from Saudi Arabia and Yemen.

    The Six Day War - 1967. Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Iraq.

    Yom Kippur War - 1973. Egypt and Syria. Others: Jordan, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, Morocco, Cuba.

    When you add Tents of Edom (S. Jordan and Palestinian Refugees, who were Jordanian), Philistia (Gaza Strip-Hamas) it seems that you have all the players necessary for Psalm 83 to already be fulfilled.
     
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  6. Almost Heaven

    Almost Heaven Well-Known Member

    If it even is a prophecy, I believe it has already been fulfilled. I am not convinced it is prophecy. Bill Salus certainly has made a good deal of money promoting this theory though.
     
  7. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    I do not believe the rapture will occur between the Psalm 83 and the Ezek. 38-39 wars but shortly before the destruction of Damascus of Isaiah 17.

    There still has to be a period of time between the Psalm 83 and Ezek. 38-39 wars as the inner ring such as those named in Psalm 83 are not present with those named in the Ezek. 38-39 war.

    I can understand your concern about Saudi Arabia, but can only take God's word for it in Psalm 83

    The Psalm war will enable though, a peace covenant to be confirmed by the ac with the many. Daniel 9:27

    It will only be after that covenant is in effect that Israel will feel at peace and safety in order for the Gog Magog invasion of Israel. Ezekiel 38:11
     
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  8. greg64

    greg64 Well-Known Member

    I gave several arguments against Psalm 83 being a future prophetic event up thread and won't repeat those in detail again, but will summarize by saying I think it reads more like an imprecatory prayer and that it if is a prophecy I believe it's already fulfilled. Looking to scripture, though, another key reason I think so is from the words of Jesus directly in Luke 21:24:

    To me, this doesn't allow the decisive military victory many people expect when considering Ezekiel 38:11. Instead, I'll go with the current modern country with challenges, but enjoying unequaled blessings currently including a booming economy, record number of visitors https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Record-number-of-tourists-visit-Israel-in-2018-572186, continuous scientific advancements and discoveries, and significant (and recent) oil and gas discoveries. In short, as secure as they can be in today's world with the Ezekiel cast of characters (most notably in terms of it's present threat Iran) right on their northern border where God's Word says they will be.

    Back to Luke, when are the times of the Gentiles fulfilled? I think Zechariah 12:2-3 and Revelation 11:2 have something to say about that. Not until Jesus returns, but I do believe we're into the transition period that leads up to it.

    Regarding the peace deal, why would Israel need it if all potential enemies were already defeated? They could just do what they want with no significant local opposition. For that reason, I think Jerusalem will remain very much an issue, even after Ezekiel 38. The outcome of that battle will give Israel more leverage, but they'll make (or confirm/make stronger a previous deal) with the wrong person and pay for it 3.5 years later. This makes more logical sense if they still have the more moderate Arab states around them in a fragile state of peace.
     
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  9. Batfan7

    Batfan7 Well-Known Member

    The more I look at thus, the more I lean towards agreement that this Psalm may not be a prophecy for a future war. I wouldn't completely discount the possibility, but I don't think I'll necessarily expect it to happen.

    It seems like one of the main arguments for this Psalm to be a literal future war is the expectation that the Ezek. War requires a previous subduing of the surrounding Arab nations both for peace of mind within Israel and to prevent these Arabs from being part of the Ezek conflict. The first part - if the Ezek war requires a complete end to all conflict and even the end of all threat of conflict...then it is probably not going to happen any time soon! Even after military defeat, none if the Arab nations will complacently accept Israel victory. They would seethe and issue grumbling threats and plot Israel's future demise. So, outside of the Middle East being completely free of all Islamic nations, I don't think the safety before the Ezek war must refer to perfect peace, but rather the confidence in Israel's security. Which today I'd say Israel feels. And the second argument, that a Psalm 83 war must happen first in order to prevent other nations from joining in on the conflict doesn't hold water to me. If Russia attacked tomorrow, they wouldn't first invite Palestine to join in, theyd just go for it. And I know I'm drawing from current conditions here to say this, but from where they are sitting in Syria, Russia would only really need to coordinate with Iran and Turkey because they too are in the area and have mingled military forces.

    I could be totally wrong of course, and may be placing too great an emphasis on current events, but if I read Psalm 83 without hearing commentary about it being a future conflict, I wouldn't draw that conclusion, so I kind of lean towards it being unnecessary as a future event.

    My 2 cents.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2019
  10. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    From Lamb and Lion ministry,

    http://christinprophecy.org/articles/the-wars-of-the-end-times/

    The Next Prophetic War
    Most prophetic scholars have long believed that the next great end time war will be the War of Gog & Magog that is described in Ezekiel 38 and 39. This, for example is the stated position of Joel Rosenberg in his popular book, Epicenter. This war will start when Russia invades Israel with certain specified allies, all of whom are Muslim nations today.

    But I seriously doubt that the conflict described in Ezekiel 38 and 39 will be the next war of end time Bible prophecy. There are two reasons why I feel this way.

    First, there is a condition for the war of Ezekiel 38 and 39 that has not been met. Three times in Ezekiel 38 — in verses 8, 11, and 14 — it states that the war described in that chapter will not occur until the people of Israel are living “securely” in “unwalled villages.”

    Israel is not living in security today. It is bombarded daily by missiles from Gaza, and it is constantly under the threat of missile attacks from Hezbollah in Lebanon. There is also the ever present threat of terrorist attacks, a threat that has forced Israel to construct a 400 mile long wall down the center of the country. In short, it is laughable today to even think of the Jewish people of Israel as living “securely” in “unwalled villages.”

    Read @ http://christinprophecy.org/articles/the-wars-of-the-end-times/
     
  11. Batfan7

    Batfan7 Well-Known Member

    I think this is just something we'll have to wait and see what happens.
     
  12. Steve53

    Steve53 Well-Known Member

    Maranatha!
     
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  13. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    Possibly, from heaven's vantage point.
     
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  14. Batfan7

    Batfan7 Well-Known Member

    I'd be good with that!
     
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  15. greg64

    greg64 Well-Known Member

    Interesting timing... JD Farag in his mid-week series is going through the Psalms and last week's topic was (you guessed it!) Psalm 83. Without being dogmatic (and also covering the various views we've already discussed), he put forth an idea I hadn't heard before or considered -- primary/initial fulfillment was in 2 Chronicles 20. Interesting take on this subject...
     
  16. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    The Tower of Syene

    You will be able to see the scripture reference to this later in the article,

    "Part of this prophecy beginning in verse one was filled during the Babylonian captivity, but when this prophecy was written, the Tower of Syene did not exist, that is until now. The rest of the fulfillment will happen in the last days. The tower was built around 1967 and resides next to Egypt’s Aswan Dam and can be seen highlighted in yellow below."

    [​IMG]

    This may very well be why Egypt is not mentioned in the Ezekiel 38 and 39 war, but is a casualty in the Psalm 83 war. Read the article for yourself though, for I think scripture leans in that direction.


    https://lookingforthatblessedhope.com/tag/tower-of-syene/

    .thou didst break…….
    Posted on April 7, 2015
    4
    Back in the summer of 2014 during the Israeli/Hamas conflict, Egypt’s head of government Al-Sisi, publicly announced a role in “protecting” Israel’s southern border. Egypt had offered to help Israel by closing off the Rafah Border Crossing to the Egyptian Sinai Peninsula in order to keep military arms and supplies away from Hamas.

    But now, an article released April 6th from Arutz Sheva says ‘Egypt is Preparing for War with Israel’. The information comes from Noha Hashad, an Egyptian pro-Israeli nuclear scientist who escaped Egypt after years of torture. She claims the Egyptian military buildup in the Sinai Peninsula to fight “terrorist” that reside there is really just a front to cover up a plan to attack Israel.

    Speaking to Israel Hayom‘s Emily Amrousi from her new home in Haifa, Hashad was asked to give her take about Egypt’s actions in Sinai, where the Egyptian army has been fighting radical groups such as Ansar Bayt al-Maqdis, a group that recently swore allegiance to Islamic State (ISIS).

    “That’s all for show,” appraised Hashad. “In the race for the presidency, Ansar Bayt al-Maqdis supported (President Abdel Fattah) al-Sisi, who isn’t really fighting them.”

    The nuclear scientist warned “Egypt is preparing for war with Israel. It armed and trained Hamas in Gaza. Whoever knows Arabic can hear the heads of Egyptian military intelligence talk about wide canals that open up between Israel and Egypt that will be used at the appropriate time.”

    The warning echoes appraisals by Col. (res.) Dr. Shaul Shay, former deputy head of the Israel National Security Council, who wrote in Israel Defense last December that the “Badr 2014” military maneuver, its largest in decades, was meant to prepare for “a potential conflict with Israel.”

    Egypt has been imposing a massive buffer zone inside Gaza on the southern border with the Sinai, evicting thousands of locals and creating a presence within the Hamas stronghold.

    Last February the Nile state sealed a $2 billion arms deal with Russia, and just last Tuesday US President Barack Obama unfroze American military aid that had been suspended in the violent coup that put al-Sisi in power in July, 2013.

    What does the Bible have to say about this? There is a prophecy in Ezekiel that mentions Egypt’s betrayal against Israel.

    6 And all the inhabitants of Egypt shall know that I am the Lord, because they have been a staff of reed to the house of Israel. 7 When they took hold of thee by thy hand, thou didst break, and rend all their shoulder: and when they leaned upon thee, thou brakest, and madest all their loins to be at a stand. 8 Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I will bring a sword upon thee, and cut off man and beast out of thee. 9 And the land of Egypt shall be desolate and waste; and they shall know that I am the Lord: because he hath said, The river is mine, and I have made it. 10 Behold, therefore I am against thee, and against thy rivers, and I will make the land of Egypt utterly waste and desolate, from the tower of Syene even unto the border of Ethiopia. No foot of man shall pass through it, nor foot of beast shall pass through it, neither shall it be inhabited forty years. Ezekiel 29:6-11

    Part of this prophecy beginning in verse one was filled during the Babylonian captivity, but when this prophecy was written, the Tower of Syene did not exist, that is until now. The rest of the fulfillment will happen in the last days. The tower was built around 1967 and resides next to Egypt’s Aswan Dam and can be seen highlighted in yellow below.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]What could cause the damage foretold in Ezekiel and why are the Egyptians scattered among the nations as verse 12 says? If Israel is threatened by Egypt, all it would take is a Israeli nuclear air strike against the dam. The Aswan Dam holds back the enormous Lake Nasser, 340 miles long and 22 miles wide at its widest point. The 40 years of Egypt’s desolation prophesied will continue into the millennium.

    Let’s not forget the recent consensus by the Arab League to form a united Arab army all at the request of Abdel Fattah Saeed Hussein Khalil el-Sisi, the sixth and current President of Egypt
     
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  17. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    I read an article from Dave Hodges The Common Sense Show which was posted on the Rapture Ready News site from 3/13 which was called, "The World has never been closer to World War 3"

    In the article it states that Secretary of State Mike Pompeo has recalled its American delegation from Venezuela,
    as reported by RT.

    Usually when an action like that is taken, it means that an imminent military confrontation is about to take place, especially as it has been reported that 5000 U.S. Marines have landed in the neighboring country of Colombia.

    It was in the related development events part of the article that the assertion is made that Syria has made threats against Israel which could lead to Isaiah 17 taking place.

    If you wish, you can read the article itself, and that is just to make this board aware of ongoing events that are probably never going to be reported else where. Info was taken from that story and I am just trying to pass it along.
     
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