Nikki Haley: Israel shouldn't wait for US green light to hit Iran

Chris

Administrator
Staff member
Nikki Haley: Israel shouldn't wait for US green light to hit Iran
'If Israel makes that decision, it should not wait for an American green light,' says former UN Amb. Nikki Haley.
Arutz Sheva Staff , Nov 06 , 2021
Nikki Haley.

Nikki Haley, former US Ambassador to the United Nations, has warned Israel not to rely on the US to stop Iran. "If Israel makes the grave decision that its security depends on removing that threat, it should not wait for an American green light," she said Saturday at the Republican Jewish Coalition's annual leadership meeting. "In matters of life and death, it is better to be strong and criticized than weak and ignored."

She added, "If a politician supports the disastrous Iran deal, opposes moving the American embassy to Jerusalem, and is embraced by anti-Semites who support the [Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions] movement, then a pro-Israel group should have absolutely nothing to do with him or her."

more.............. https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/316421
 

athenasius

Well-Known Member
Nikki Haley: Israel shouldn't wait for US green light to hit Iran
'If Israel makes that decision, it should not wait for an American green light,' says former UN Amb. Nikki Haley.
Arutz Sheva Staff , Nov 06 , 2021
Nikki Haley.

Nikki Haley, former US Ambassador to the United Nations, has warned Israel not to rely on the US to stop Iran. "If Israel makes the grave decision that its security depends on removing that threat, it should not wait for an American green light," she said Saturday at the Republican Jewish Coalition's annual leadership meeting. "In matters of life and death, it is better to be strong and criticized than weak and ignored."

She added, "If a politician supports the disastrous Iran deal, opposes moving the American embassy to Jerusalem, and is embraced by anti-Semites who support the [Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions] movement, then a pro-Israel group should have absolutely nothing to do with him or her."

more.............. https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/316421
She's right!

But it's looking like the leaders in Israel are waking up to the reality that it wasn't Benjamin Netanyahu that was Israel's biggest threat, it's Iran.
 

Belle of Grace

Longing for Home
Amen to the OP.
Not sure about that. As you know, we go to God's Word to see what He has arranged for Israel, since they're His chosen people. Nowhere do I see it written that Israel is going to take out Iran. Quite the opposite, in fact. The Gog Magog War is about God's victory over Israel's enemy invaders, not Israel's power over Iran.
Perhaps someone on here can help me understand why some folks are saying that this is a good thing that Israel is planning to do. I like Nikki Haley, too, but I'm not sure she's read much in the book of Daniel. Please feel free to correct me, if I'm missing something here. :hmmm
 

Tall Timbers

Imperfect but forgiven
Not sure about that. As you know, we go to God's Word to see what He has arranged for Israel, since they're His chosen people. Nowhere do I see it written that Israel is going to take out Iran. Quite the opposite, in fact. The Gog Magog War is about God's victory over Israel's enemy invaders, not Israel's power over Iran.
Perhaps someone on here can help me understand why some folks are saying that this is a good thing that Israel is planning to do. I like Nikki Haley, too, but I'm not sure she's read much in the book of Daniel. Please feel free to correct me, if I'm missing something here. :hmmm

I have mixed feelings about Haley. My amen is that Israel needn't get permission from or advise the USA if they're going to do something. Nothing will happen without the Lord allowing it...
 

athenasius

Well-Known Member
Not sure about that. As you know, we go to God's Word to see what He has arranged for Israel, since they're His chosen people. Nowhere do I see it written that Israel is going to take out Iran. Quite the opposite, in fact. The Gog Magog War is about God's victory over Israel's enemy invaders, not Israel's power over Iran.
Perhaps someone on here can help me understand why some folks are saying that this is a good thing that Israel is planning to do. I like Nikki Haley, too, but I'm not sure she's read much in the book of Daniel. Please feel free to correct me, if I'm missing something here. :hmmm
There are 2 aspects to this, geopolitical-- in the realm of nations acting and reacting that set the stage for prophetic events

--and the other aspect which is the prophetic.

Nikki Haley is stating the obvious geopolitical truth which is that Iran is a threat to Israel's existence and in normal geo politics, they need to respond or die.

In another sense, she is clearly stating that Israel CANNOT rely on any other nation to defend them. They've had America in their corner more or less and grown comfortable with that. It's a terrible weakness. In that message, she may be relaying what God is saying to them in a way they can hear. Don't rely on Egypt or America.

Just like when they thought in Jeremiah's day that Egypt might be a good refuge from the Babylonian invasions. Oddly enough today again Egypt is their friend. God has a prophecy for Egypt involving the Tower of Syene (and a whole nother rabbit trail) in which He deals with Egypt for her faithlessness in abandoning Israel time and time again. It isn't the same one as the one in Jeremiah below where Egypt gets in trouble with Elam.

Politicians can read the Bible, understand it (or parts of it anyway) but they still have to act in ways to benefit their country or point out home truths to the blinded "woke" leadership of both the USA and Israel. Do or die. Those ways end up dovetailing perfectly with prophecy regardless of the leader's Bible knowledge.

And there is an aspect of timing and presumption too.

Because nobody has a time table to know when these events happen, nations and their leaders must act according to the information they currently have. If they are Biblically literate they may understand how the big picture will unfold over time, but they don't know when or what the trigger events are etc.

They can't decide that now is the moment to stand and see God deliver them, because they might be facing another Gaza war, or a Lebanon war or any of the many wars they have had to fight-- in order to exist. It's interesting to me that God gives them the Promised Land, but they had to go in and take it, back in Joshua's day and even today. Seems that God allows the battles to train the people to turn to Him. And it's the same trouble spots, Gaza, the north towards Mt Hermon, Jericho. Giants of old and terrorists of today don't give up without a fight.

As with Gog Magog and finally Armageddon, God is using these battles for existence, and the 7 years of Tribulation to get their eyes on Him as their Saviour and Lord and God.

At some point here Gog Magog happens and the bit in Jeremiah that talks about Elam (and Ezekiel too) being scattered to the 4 winds as a result of something they do.

Does the Elam event happen during the Gog Magog war? Before it? Is it connected to Isaiah 17? Is Isaiah 17 connected to Gog Magog as pershaps a trigger event?

those are things I've been puzzling over for years now, even though I think I see connections, I'm not sure which one fits where. It's like a giant jigsaw puzzle.

IF Elam is the ignition point, it could well be a strike from Israel into the south west coastline of Iran (that is where Elam was, it stretched up into modern day Iraq a little bit too on the eastern edge of the border with Iraq.

Jeremiah 49 talks about Elam AND Damascus both. Then there are passages that parallel this one, Isaiah 17 of course with Damascus, but Elam shows up in Ezekiel 32 as well. It's the last half starting at vs 17-- there is a break in the narrative where Ezekiel describes a new vision starting at vs 17. What is striking is that whatever Elam was up to, along with the others, it has to do with Terror that they caused in the land of the living. Over and over God has Ezekiel repeat that phrase, it must be important. (I first got onto this via Bill Salus, but I've studied it ever since-- still not sure the how and when but I am sure that either Elam is hit alongside Damascus leaving enough of Iran's might to go in with Gog Magog or we are seeing a close up detail of what happens to Iran during the Gog Magog event.

I'm going to pull the Elam stuff up because IF this is modern day, and I think it is, there is a possibility that something happens, Damascus starts something, Israel finishes it at great cost to Northern Israel, and possibly Iran launches missiles from the area of Elam. Israel or God or both respond. If this is the trigger event for Gog Magog, then possibly Iran is weakened by the blow to the Elam area, but sees the opportunity to go in with Russia and Turkey to invade Israel and loot and kill to even the score.

The way Isaiah 17 reads, it sounds like the IDF (children of Israel) are able to respond but in the case of Gog Magog, the Israelis are caught unawares and quite possibly feeling like they've defeated their enemies, and it's time to rest and recuperate. God and only God comes to their defence.

Breaking the bow, the foremost of their might as Bill Salus says might fit with their missile launchers (the Bow of Elam)

The question needs asking, who are the foes of Elam (Iran) that want to kill them.

This might also be a Saudi strike onto the shores of Iran in the area of Elam.

Because I'm not convinced Israel wants to kill them. They just want them to stop being a threat. Big difference in motivation.

Yet God devastates the area of Elam in full view of those who hate them. Ezekiel might shed more light if the passages are connected. In Ezekiel it's because of Terror that Elam (modern day south western Iran) causes in the land of the living.

I can't think of a closer view than that of the Saudi's who hate Iran and want them dead. Right across the gulf from them. Looking over to the other side of the sea that divides them. So it might be referencing the Saudi's if it's today and if that is them. But it maybe not.

Jeremiah 49:34-39 NIV
34 This is the word of the Lord that came to Jeremiah the prophet concerning Elam, early in the reign of Zedekiah king of Judah:
35 This is what the Lord Almighty says:

“See, I will break the bow of Elam,
the mainstay of their might.

36 I will bring against Elam the four winds

from the four quarters of heaven;
I will scatter them to the four winds,
and there will not be a nation
where Elam’s exiles do not go.

37 I will shatter Elam before their foes,
before those who want to kill them;

I will bring disaster on them,
even my fierce anger,”
declares the Lord.
“I will pursue them with the sword
until I have made an end of them.

38 I will set my throne in Elam
and destroy her king and officials,”
declares the Lord.

39 “Yet I will restore the fortunes of Elam
in days to come,”
declares the Lord.

Now here's Ezekiel on the subject. I've been fascinated at WHO goes down into the graves alongside Elam. Even Egypt. But it's definitely got something to do with terror that Elam and the others cause in the land of the living. The modern nations included besides Egypt (who seems to get sucked into this war in some way)

Assyria (northern Syria-- near the places mentioned in Jeremiah's comments on the fall of Damascus)
Meschek and Tubal -- I'm thinking modern day Turkey
Jordan -- but not all of it, just Edom
The princes of the north-- unspecified but I have wondered about Russia except she isn't sponsoring Terror right now and all the rest of these are. So it could be just generalized points north, leaders of nations who've joined in terror, again points at Turkey
The Sidonians are basically Lebanon of today. Not all of it, but the area around Sidon.

All are sponsors of terrorists, even Jordan to a degree. Egypt seems to be dragged in, because they take comfort in the dead of all the others. I've wondered if this might point to the wars of the Antichrist during the Tribulation as an alternate time frame.


Ezekiel 32:17-32 NIV

Egypt’s Descent Into the Realm of the Dead​

17 In the twelfth year, on the fifteenth day of the month, the word of the Lord came to me: 18 “Son of man, wail for the hordes of Egypt and consign to the earth below both her and the daughters of mighty nations, along with those who go down to the pit. 19 Say to them, ‘Are you more favored than others? Go down and be laid among the uncircumcised.’ 20 They will fall among those killed by the sword. The sword is drawn; let her be dragged off with all her hordes. 21 From within the realm of the dead the mighty leaders will say of Egypt and her allies, ‘They have come down and they lie with the uncircumcised, with those killed by the sword.’


22 “Assyria is there with her whole army; she is surrounded by the graves of all her slain, all who have fallen by the sword. 23 Their graves are in the depths of the pit and her army lies around her grave. All who had spread terror in the land of the living are slain, fallen by the sword.


24 “Elam is there, with all her hordes around her grave. All of them are slain, fallen by the sword. All who had spread terror in the land of the living went down uncircumcised to the earth below. They bear their shame with those who go down to the pit. 25 A bed is made for her among the slain, with all her hordes around her grave. All of them are uncircumcised, killed by the sword. Because their terror had spread in the land of the living, they bear their shame with those who go down to the pit; they are laid among the slain.


26 “Meshek and Tubal are there, with all their hordes around their graves. All of them are uncircumcised, killed by the sword because they spread their terror in the land of the living. 27 But they do not lie with the fallen warriors of old, who went down to the realm of the dead with their weapons of war—their swords placed under their heads and their shields resting on their bones—though these warriors also had terrorized the land of the living.


28 “You too, Pharaoh, will be broken and will lie among the uncircumcised, with those killed by the sword.


29 “Edom is there, her kings and all her princes; despite their power, they are laid with those killed by the sword. They lie with the uncircumcised, with those who go down to the pit.


30 “All the princes of the north and all the Sidonians are there; they went down with the slain in disgrace despite the terror caused by their power. They lie uncircumcised with those killed by the sword and bear their shame with those who go down to the pit.


31 “Pharaoh—he and all his army—will see them and he will be consoled for all his hordes that were killed by the sword, declares the Sovereign Lord. 32 Although I had him spread terror in the land of the living, Pharaoh and all his hordes will be laid among the uncircumcised, with those killed by the sword, declares the Sovereign Lord.”
 
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Andy C

Well-Known Member
Not sure about that. As you know, we go to God's Word to see what He has arranged for Israel, since they're His chosen people. Nowhere do I see it written that Israel is going to take out Iran. Quite the opposite, in fact. The Gog Magog War is about God's victory over Israel's enemy invaders, not Israel's power over Iran.
Perhaps someone on here can help me understand why some folks are saying that this is a good thing that Israel is planning to do. I like Nikki Haley, too, but I'm not sure she's read much in the book of Daniel. Please feel free to correct me, if I'm missing something here. :hmmm
Israel taking out Irans nuclear capability could be one of the triggers leading to Ezekiel 38.
 

Andy C

Well-Known Member
There are 2 aspects to this, geopolitical-- in the realm of nations acting and reacting that set the stage for prophetic events

--and the other aspect which is the prophetic.

Nikki Haley is stating the obvious geopolitical truth which is that Iran is a threat to Israel's existence and in normal geo politics, they need to respond or die.

In another sense, she is clearly stating that Israel CANNOT rely on any other nation to defend them. They've had America in their corner more or less and grown comfortable with that. It's a terrible weakness. In that message, she may be relaying what God is saying to them in a way they can hear. Don't rely on Egypt or America.

Just like when they thought in Jeremiah's day that Egypt might be a good refuge from the Babylonian invasions. Oddly enough today again Egypt is their friend. God has a prophecy for Egypt involving the Tower of Syene (and a whole nother rabbit trail) in which He deals with Egypt for her faithlessness in abandoning Israel time and time again. It isn't the same one as the one in Jeremiah below where Egypt gets in trouble with Elam.

Politicians can read the Bible, understand it (or parts of it anyway) but they still have to act in ways to benefit their country or point out home truths to the blinded "woke" leadership of both the USA and Israel. Do or die. Those ways end up dovetailing perfectly with prophecy regardless of the leader's Bible knowledge.

And there is an aspect of timing and presumption too.

Because nobody has a time table to know when these events happen, nations and their leaders must act according to the information they currently have. If they are Biblically literate they may understand how the big picture will unfold over time, but they don't know when or what the trigger events are etc.

They can't decide that now is the moment to stand and see God deliver them, because they might be facing another Gaza war, or a Lebanon war or any of the many wars they have had to fight-- in order to exist. It's interesting to me that God gives them the Promised Land, but they had to go in and take it, back in Joshua's day and even today. Seems that God allows the battles to train the people to turn to Him. And it's the same trouble spots, Gaza, the north towards Mt Hermon, Jericho. Giants of old and terrorists of today don't give up without a fight.

As with Gog Magog and finally Armageddon, God is using these battles for existence, and the 7 years of Tribulation to get their eyes on Him as their Saviour and Lord and God.

At some point here Gog Magog happens and the bit in Jeremiah that talks about Elam (and Ezekiel too) being scattered to the 4 winds as a result of something they do.

Does the Elam event happen during the Gog Magog war? Before it? Is it connected to Isaiah 17? Is Isaiah 17 connected to Gog Magog as pershaps a trigger event?

those are things I've been puzzling over for years now, even though I think I see connections, I'm not sure which one fits where. It's like a giant jigsaw puzzle.

IF Elam is the ignition point, it could well be a strike from Israel into the south west coastline of Iran (that is where Elam was, it stretched up into modern day Iraq a little bit too on the eastern edge of the border with Iraq.

Jeremiah 49 talks about Elam AND Damascus both. Then there are passages that parallel this one, Isaiah 17 of course with Damascus, but Elam shows up in Ezekiel 32 as well. It's the last half starting at vs 17-- there is a break in the narrative where Ezekiel describes a new vision starting at vs 17. What is striking is that whatever Elam was up to, along with the others, it has to do with Terror that they caused in the land of the living. Over and over God has Ezekiel repeat that phrase, it must be important. (I first got onto this via Bill Salus, but I've studied it ever since-- still not sure the how and when but I am sure that either Elam is hit alongside Damascus leaving enough of Iran's might to go in with Gog Magog or we are seeing a close up detail of what happens to Iran during the Gog Magog event.

I'm going to pull the Elam stuff up because IF this is modern day, and I think it is, there is a possibility that something happens, Damascus starts something, Israel finishes it at great cost to Northern Israel, and possibly Iran launches missiles from the area of Elam. Israel or God or both respond. If this is the trigger event for Gog Magog, then possibly Iran is weakened by the blow to the Elam area, but sees the opportunity to go in with Russia and Turkey to invade Israel and loot and kill to even the score.

The way Isaiah 17 reads, it sounds like the IDF (children of Israel) are able to respond but in the case of Gog Magog, the Israelis are caught unawares and quite possibly feeling like they've defeated their enemies, and it's time to rest and recuperate. God and only God comes to their defence.

Breaking the bow, the foremost of their might as Bill Salus says might fit with their missile launchers (the Bow of Elam)

The question needs asking, who are the foes of Elam (Iran) that want to kill them.

This might also be a Saudi strike onto the shores of Iran in the area of Elam.

Because I'm not convinced Israel wants to kill them. They just want them to stop being a threat. Big difference in motivation.

Yet God devastates the area of Elam in full view of those who hate them. Ezekiel might shed more light if the passages are connected. In Ezekiel it's because of Terror that Elam (modern day south western Iran) causes in the land of the living.

I can't think of a closer view than that of the Saudi's who hate Iran and want them dead. Right across the gulf from them. Looking over to the other side of the sea that divides them. So it might be referencing the Saudi's if it's today and if that is them. But it maybe not.

Jeremiah 49:34-39 NIV
34 This is the word of the Lord that came to Jeremiah the prophet concerning Elam, early in the reign of Zedekiah king of Judah:
35 This is what the Lord Almighty says:

“See, I will break the bow of Elam,
the mainstay of their might.

36 I will bring against Elam the four winds

from the four quarters of heaven;
I will scatter them to the four winds,
and there will not be a nation
where Elam’s exiles do not go.

37 I will shatter Elam before their foes,
before those who want to kill them;

I will bring disaster on them,
even my fierce anger,”
declares the Lord.
“I will pursue them with the sword
until I have made an end of them.

38 I will set my throne in Elam
and destroy her king and officials,”
declares the Lord.

39 “Yet I will restore the fortunes of Elam
in days to come,”
declares the Lord.

Now here's Ezekiel on the subject. I've been fascinated at WHO goes down into the graves alongside Elam. Even Egypt. But it's definitely got something to do with terror that Elam and the others cause in the land of the living. The modern nations included besides Egypt (who seems to get sucked into this war in some way)

Assyria (northern Syria-- near the places mentioned in Jeremiah's comments on the fall of Damascus)
Meschek and Tubal -- I'm thinking modern day Turkey
Jordan -- but not all of it, just Edom
The princes of the north-- unspecified but I have wondered about Russia except she isn't sponsoring Terror right now and all the rest of these are. So it could be just generalized points north, leaders of nations who've joined in terror, again points at Turkey
The Sidonians are basically Lebanon of today. Not all of it, but the area around Sidon.

All are sponsors of terrorists, even Jordan to a degree. Egypt seems to be dragged in, because they take comfort in the dead of all the others. I've wondered if this might point to the wars of the Antichrist during the Tribulation as an alternate time frame.


Ezekiel 32:17-32 NIV

Egypt’s Descent Into the Realm of the Dead​

17 In the twelfth year, on the fifteenth day of the month, the word of the Lord came to me: 18 “Son of man, wail for the hordes of Egypt and consign to the earth below both her and the daughters of mighty nations, along with those who go down to the pit. 19 Say to them, ‘Are you more favored than others? Go down and be laid among the uncircumcised.’ 20 They will fall among those killed by the sword. The sword is drawn; let her be dragged off with all her hordes. 21 From within the realm of the dead the mighty leaders will say of Egypt and her allies, ‘They have come down and they lie with the uncircumcised, with those killed by the sword.’


22 “Assyria is there with her whole army; she is surrounded by the graves of all her slain, all who have fallen by the sword. 23 Their graves are in the depths of the pit and her army lies around her grave. All who had spread terror in the land of the living are slain, fallen by the sword.


24 “Elam is there, with all her hordes around her grave. All of them are slain, fallen by the sword. All who had spread terror in the land of the living went down uncircumcised to the earth below. They bear their shame with those who go down to the pit. 25 A bed is made for her among the slain, with all her hordes around her grave. All of them are uncircumcised, killed by the sword. Because their terror had spread in the land of the living, they bear their shame with those who go down to the pit; they are laid among the slain.


26 “Meshek and Tubal are there, with all their hordes around their graves. All of them are uncircumcised, killed by the sword because they spread their terror in the land of the living. 27 But they do not lie with the fallen warriors of old, who went down to the realm of the dead with their weapons of war—their swords placed under their heads and their shields resting on their bones—though these warriors also had terrorized the land of the living.


28 “You too, Pharaoh, will be broken and will lie among the uncircumcised, with those killed by the sword.


29 “Edom is there, her kings and all her princes; despite their power, they are laid with those killed by the sword. They lie with the uncircumcised, with those who go down to the pit.


30 “All the princes of the north and all the Sidonians are there; they went down with the slain in disgrace despite the terror caused by their power. They lie uncircumcised with those killed by the sword and bear their shame with those who go down to the pit.


31 “Pharaoh—he and all his army—will see them and he will be consoled for all his hordes that were killed by the sword, declares the Sovereign Lord. 32 Although I had him spread terror in the land of the living, Pharaoh and all his hordes will be laid among the uncircumcised, with those killed by the sword, declares the Sovereign Lord.”
Yes, what she said. :biggrinYou used more words than I will all day, but spot on sister.
 
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