Lordship Salvation: The Latest Works Based Salvation Plan

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
No problem, brother. I probably did so as you were writing your last post.

Anyway, let me put this in emphatic form:

I absolutely agree that nothing I have stated validates Lordship Salvation! Because I will never validate any false teaching! And Lordship Salvation is false teaching! It is NOT the Gospel of Jesus Christ! It is "another gospel".

OK, there. That's done.

I stand on my last two posts taken together. And you, my precious brother, as a beloved child of the Most High God are entitled to believe whatever you feel honors Him and fulfills His will in calling as many as possible into the Kingdom of His dear Son. :bighug
If you agree that Lordship Salvation is not valid, then I am not sure what it is we are debating. I must be misunderstanding some of the things you have posted, because it sounded like you agree with it to me. In any case, I guess there is no need to take this any further.

Love you brother! :)
 

mattfivefour

Administrator
Staff member
Brother, I apologize if you think I twisted your words, I just tried to respond to them as you wrote them. I think the problem here is that we often write things knowing what we mean but do not see how others may take them. Your words spoke a certain thing to me as, apparently, so do mine to you. So let's end this discussion with an agreement that WORKS DO NOT SAVE and that LORDSHIP SALVATION IS A FALSE GOSPEL. I love you in Christ, brother. :hug
 

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
So if you have read through this thread I mentioned that my Sunday school teacher believes in and teaches Predestination for salvation. He also stated that he believes in Lordship Salvation, but has not taught that to the class as of yet.

I asked my Pastor his view on Predestination for salvation a few weeks ago and he stated that he does not believe that. Today I asked my Pastor his view on Lordship Salvation and he stated that one must believe that Jesus is Lord, but as far as submitting to him as Lord, that comes after salvation. So my Pastor and I agree on both points.

I was planing on telling my Pastor what the Sunday school teacher was teaching, but I decided to hold off as while the Sunday school teacher believes in Lordship Salvation, he has not yet taught it to the class. I really don't care what the Sunday school teacher believes personally, I am only concerned with what he is teaching.
 

Everlasting Life

Through Faith in Jesus
....cautiously tiptoeing into this thread.....

I came across this passage, Titus 2:11 recently which I think is a wonderfully simple and clarifying verse about Salvation and all who God would like to see saved. That salvation is offered and made available to all people, all mankind. I think that this passage also supports Jesus instructions to preach the Gospel to all nations for the reason being:

For the grace of God has been revealed, bringing salvation to all people.

Titus 2:11

To me this shows the intentions and generosity of God in providing for the Salvation of the whole world for all who repent (change mind) and place their faith in Jesus Christ. This tells me that Salvation is offered to all people without constraint or limit through repentance (change of mind) and faith in Jesus Christ. After all, isn't this the time of the grace of God?


As I've been reading this thread I can't help but to think that Justification (salvation) and Sanctification (growing in the Lord after Salvation) is often conflated in certain christian circles.

It seems to me that the order of Justification and Sanctification is laid out in Titus 2. First 2:11 - Justification (salvation), then vs 12-14 - Sanctification (growing in the Lord after Salvation, a process over a lifetime but salvation is not dependent on). And how do I look forward to Glorification when my body is changed and being with Jesus Christ in heaven!

I understand that as a result of salvation, which is through faith in Jesus Christ (and by the power, strength and capacity of the immediate indwelt Holy Spirit within us, not by our own power) we enter into a sanctification, lifelong process (which may be micro-steps for some and macro-steps for others) where:

.......we are instructed to turn from godless living and sinful pleasures. We should live in this evil world with wisdom, righteousness, and devotion to God, while we look forward with hope to that wonderful day when the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, will be revealed. He gave his life to free us from every kind of sin, to cleanse us, and to make us his very own people, totally committed to doing good deeds. Titus 2:12-14

I grew up in a religious entity that espoused people turning from sin (on their own power), then placing faith in Jesus Christ and His Work on the cross. It was very much a works based, put the cart before the horse kind of thing. And, there was no sense of assurance of salvation or permanent position in Christ that the bible speaks of when one repents (change of mind) and places their faith in Jesus Christ's work on the cross on their behalf. What a horrible, worrying burden that was!

Upon reading Galatians where it talks about finding favor with God based on faith, that burden was so wonderfully lifted from my shoulders. Praise God!! I felt free and enabled by God to do good works, take off sin and put on Christ likeness......here a little there a little as God's work in my life is manifested.



The predestination idea that God created people to destine them to hell I think is put to rest by this passage below and shows the very generous and good intentions of God towards all mankind:

The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent. 2 Peter 3:9

Here's the Amplified version:

The Lord does not delay [as though He were unable to act] and is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is [extraordinarily] patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.


If I'm understanding scripture correctly (and I always welcome correction and growth in understanding) God has predestined places or destinations (with God or separate from God - Heaven or Hell) for individual people depending on their personal decision and choice made in regards to placing faith in Jesus Christ, with God Himself greatly desiring that all people come to repentance. Either choice, based on free will, will lead to either place.

ETA: Came across this passage today as well and thought of this thread. I think this really shows the heart of God towards mankind:

“Do you think that I like to see wicked people die? says the Sovereign Lord. Of course not! I want them to turn from their wicked ways and live."

Ezekiel 18:23
 
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PhilR

Well-Known Member
Good post Everlasting Life. You mention "repent", which has to be the most misused word in Christendom.. Repent in the NT Greek simply means to change ones mind or have a different mind. The moment a person comes to faith in the saving work of Christ he has repented; they have changed their minds from unbelief or wrong belief to believing the free gift of salvation God has provided thru his Son. This word repent has been twisted around for ages from its original meaning in Scripture.
Also, I think Lordship or (loadship salvation) is a false gospel. ( Gal 1: 6-9). We are to believe the gospel that Paul taught to be saved, (1 Cor 15 : 1 -4) and not John MacArthur' s "The Gospel According to Jesus" which is a false gospel requiring faith plus working your way to heaven.
 

Everlasting Life

Through Faith in Jesus
Good post Everlasting Life. You mention "repent", which has to be the most misused word in Christendom.. Repent in the NT Greek simply means to change ones mind or have a different mind.
Thank you PhilR, and really, I have to thank so many here and in other places that have taught well. In essence, it's really a summary of that and I hope reflective of God's Word. :) And, I am so thankful to God for His help in providing spiritual clarity as He does.

I was thinking about the word repentance today and felt the need to share that my own change of mind was born not out of a frivolous "I'm just going to go this way or change direction" kind of thinking but rather from a deep realization of how wrong the path I found myself on was, a sorrow, regret and contrition in regards to sin and it's effects in mine and other's lives. I suppose that in turn was born out of the convicting of the Holy Spirit and realization of my position before God. When face with the truth of the predicament I was in, how much more did I leap to the freedom of the Gospel, the wonderful Good News that God, in His mercy provided a way of mercy, cleansing, salvation and joy through faith in Jesus Christ.

It is true that God looks at the heart, from where all other things flow and when there is Godly repentance in the heart, He sees and takes care of all the rest.

So, all I can be is so very thankful for His love in doing this and trust in His work in my life to bring me safely home. :)

Now all glory to God, who is able to keep you from falling away and will bring you with great joy into his glorious presence without a single fault. Jude 1:24
 

lightofmylife

Blessed Hope-Prepare To Fly!
Thank you PhilR, and really, I have to thank so many here and in other places that have taught well. In essence, it's really a summary of that and I hope reflective of God's Word. :) And, I am so thankful to God for His help in providing spiritual clarity as He does.

I was thinking about the word repentance today and felt the need to share that my own change of mind was born not out of a frivolous "I'm just going to go this way or change direction" kind of thinking but rather from a deep realization of how wrong the path I found myself on was, a sorrow, regret and contrition in regards to sin and it's effects in mine and other's lives. I suppose that in turn was born out of the convicting of the Holy Spirit and realization of my position before God. When face with the truth of the predicament I was in, how much more did I leap to the freedom of the Gospel, the wonderful Good News that God, in His mercy provided a way of mercy, cleansing, salvation and joy through faith in Jesus Christ.

It is true that God looks at the heart, from where all other things flow and when there is Godly repentance in the heart, He sees and takes care of all the rest.

So, all I can be is so very thankful for His love in doing this and trust in His work in my life to bring me safely home. :)

Now all glory to God, who is able to keep you from falling away and will bring you with great joy into his glorious presence without a single fault. Jude 1:24
We can't do anything to earn the free gift of salvation to be good enough. Jesus paid our sin debt in full past, present, and future. It Is Finished!
 

PhilR

Well-Known Member
We can't do anything to earn the free gift of salvation to be good enough. Jesus paid our sin debt in full past, present, and future. It Is Finished!
Amen, you are so right! God thru his Son offers us this gift of eternal salvation that can never be lost, the moment we receive this gift by believing the good news that Christ died for all our sins and rose from the dead our salvation is finished and accepted in the eyes of God. There is nothing more we can add or possibly do, Christ has done it all for us.
 
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