Just because you believe something, doesn't make it true

Pat

Well-Known Member
WHAT mATTERS - Belief Doesn’t Make It True​

The recent passing of celebrities Betty White, and Bob Saget has caused their followers to focus on man’s mortality and the afterlife. Just before Bob Saget died, he said this about Betty White; “Well, if things work out by Betty’s design— in the afterlife, they are reunited (her and her third husband, Allen Ludden.) I don’t know what happens when we die, but if Betty says you get to be with the love of your life, then I happily defer to Betty on this.” If Betty and Bob knew the Bible as well as their script lines, there wouldn’t be any confusion or speculation about their afterlife, and where and with whom it will be spent.

Betty seemed to be a wonderful, fun-loving, TV comedian. Bob Saget, host of “America’s Funniest Videos” concluded that she would be happy in heaven with her third husband because she believed that she would be happy in heaven with him. He even put his own personal trust of the afterlife in her beliefs (“I defer to Betty on this.”) But just because someone believes in something, does not mean their beliefs, or wishes will come true, no matter how much they believe it. The assurance of the fulfillment of any hope is based on the faithfulness of the one who makes the promises. Religions and religious people make all kinds of promises of what will happen after death. But there is only one promise maker who cannot and will not lie, the faithful, God almighty, creator of the universe and all that are in it. We don’t have to guess. He has already told us in His Word, the Bible, what awaits us after death and what to do to get there. In the case of hell after death, He said we don’t have to do anything. We will go there without even trying. However, in the case of going to heaven after death, He sets a very high standard. Faith. He said we must believe that He did it all for salvation when Jesus paid for our sins by His death on the cross, followed by a 3-day burial, and then conquering death by coming alive again. He said if anyone believes this good news, they would be guaranteed a place in heaven for eternity with Him. But many who are reading or hearing this message right now won’t believe the Gospel and will try to get to heaven by believing something else. They won’t get there, guaranteed by God.

Belief in something, no matter how wonderful, doesn’t make it true. What matters is not, “Do you believe in Him?” but, what matters is, “Do you believe Him?” He’s speaking. Are you listening?
 

Lastcall

Well-Known Member
Belief in something, no matter how wonderful, doesn’t make it true. What matters is not, “Do you believe in Him?” but, what matters is, “Do you believe Him?” He’s speaking. Are you listening?
Good post, but Im not sure there is a difference in the above. Both the bolded above are in the scripture, and both should equally matter - if there is a difference.
 

Pat

Well-Known Member
Thanks Andy for the insight and chance to clarify. As believers, we all believe IN God and that is not a bad thing. I was trying to emphasize to un-believers Who frequently claim to believe IN God (doesn't everybody?) but the real issue is do they believe God/ i.e. what He says about man's condition without Jesus and what to do to be saved. I came from a RC background and for 22 years believed IN God but it wasn't until I was challenged to read the Gospels praying to know the truth, that God revealed my lost state to me and cried out to him to save me. I didn't know much at that point but only that I was lost, I couldn't save myself, and that Jesus paid for my sins, was buried and rose again. Yes, I still believed IN Him but more importantly I believed what He said. Thankfully He did save me 47 years ago and now I'm ready to go see Him face to face.
 

Pat

Well-Known Member
Good post, but Im not sure there is a difference in the above. Both the bolded above are in the scripture, and both should equally matter - if there is a difference.
And it is a good reminder to us now as believers to be listening TODAY for His voice. He is still speaking, are we still listening? "Today if ye will hear his voice..."Heb 3. and "My sheep hear my voice and I know them and they follow me." John10
 

Lastcall

Well-Known Member
Thanks Andy for the insight and chance to clarify. As believers, we all believe IN God and that is not a bad thing. I was trying to emphasize to un-believers Who frequently claim to believe IN God (doesn't everybody?) but the real issue is do they believe God/ i.e. what He says about man's condition without Jesus and what to do to be saved. I came from a RC background and for 22 years believed IN God but it wasn't until I was challenged to read the Gospels praying to know the truth, that God revealed my lost state to me and cried out to him to save me. I didn't know much at that point but only that I was lost, I couldn't save myself, and that Jesus paid for my sins, was buried and rose again. Yes, I still believed IN Him but more importantly I believed what He said. Thankfully He did save me 47 years ago and now I'm ready to go see Him face to face.


Probably just semantics on our 2 points, but the below are a few out of many verses that apply to my point.

John 1:12 ESV / 5 helpful votes​

But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,

John 7:39

Now this he said about the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were to receive, for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

John 3:16-18

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
 

Pat

Well-Known Member
Probably just semantics on our 2 points, but the below are a few out of many verses that apply to my point.

John 1:12 ESV / 5 helpful votes​

But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,

John 7:39

Now this he said about the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were to receive, for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

John 3:16-18

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
Yep. No argument from me. Just a different viewpoint. Blessings.
 

Everlasting Life

Through Faith in Jesus
Great post Pat, thank you. :)


He said we must believe that He did it all for salvation when Jesus paid for our sins by His death on the cross, followed by a 3-day burial, and then conquering death by coming alive again. He said if anyone believes this good news, they would be guaranteed a place in heaven for eternity with Him.

Praise God! :nod

I've always appreciated the analogy to what our response to Jesus is like......one who's got a paid for, one way ticket to get on a train. All that's needed is the ticket but in the case of Jesus, He paid for that ticket for us, we just need to get the ticket....respond in faith that He's paid the price for that ticket and accept that ticket i.e. place our faith in Jesus and His work on the cross in full payment for our sins and a wide opened up path of Salvation and to Heaven, resulting in Eternal Life. What a great deal!!!

When I've presented my ticket for a train, the Ticketmaster has never asked me, "Are you a good person?" or "How many good things have you done compared to bad things?" The only thing that the Ticketmaster is concerned about is, "Do you have a ticket?" If I don't have a ticket no amount of stating all the 'good' things I've done in my life will sway that Ticketmaster to let me on the train. No amount of work, favors, or self-punishment will earn a place on the train. I just need one, paid for ticket, period. In addition, when I present that paid for ticket, the Ticketmaster doesn't turn me away by asking about all the sinful things I've done or ask me, "Well, how many bad things have you done in your life....I need to consider this before punching your ticket?" Nope! That ticket is 100% permanently paid for, in my hand and I can have complete assurance of getting to my destination.


It's by faith alone, in Christ alone, by His wonderful, merciful, abundant and loving Grace alone that saves. That's the only sure ticket to heaven.
 

lamonte

Well-Known Member
Betty White seems like a nice person by human standards. I have read a lot about Betty White life and watch and listen to her for 50 years, there is no mention of Christ. I hope she is with Christ but there is no evidence.

Most evangelism I here today, tell people that God love them and except Jesus as your Savior. Then the speaker asked them to take Jesus into their heart and pray after me this prayer.

There is no true evangelism without the doctrine of sin, and without an understanding of what sin is. I think that a Gospel which merely says, “come to Jesus,” and offer him as a friend, and offer a marvelous new life, without Conviction of sin, is not New Testament Gospel. Sadly, we have moved away from “true Gospel” by preaching a gospel of grace without first convincing men that they are transgressors of Gods law.

We cannot come to Christ to be justified until we have first seen we are dead in Adam “sinners”, we are guilty before Holy God and His judgment is before us. Then John 3:16, will really mean something to them.
 

Everlasting Life

Through Faith in Jesus
Betty White seems like a nice person by human standards. I have read a lot about Betty White life and watch and listen to her for 50 years, there is no mention of Christ. I hope she is with Christ but there is no evidence.

Most evangelism I here today, tell people that God love them and except Jesus as your Savior. Then the speaker asked them to take Jesus into their heart and pray after me this prayer.

There is no true evangelism without the doctrine of sin, and without an understanding of what sin is. I think that a Gospel which merely says, “come to Jesus,” and offer him as a friend, and offer a marvelous new life, without Conviction of sin, is not New Testament Gospel. Sadly, we have moved away from “true Gospel” by preaching a gospel of grace without first convincing men that they are transgressors of Gods law.

We cannot come to Christ to be justified until we have first seen we are dead in Adam “sinners”, we are guilty before Holy God and His judgment is before us. Then John 3:16, will really mean something to them.


Good reminder lamonte.......
 

lightofmylife

Blessed Hope-Prepare To Fly!
There are many religions a lot of cults. We have to stick to what the :biblesays which is we are saved by accepting :fish the gift of salvation. I am the way, the truth, and the life no man cometh unto the Father but by me. There are not many ways Only One Jesus! :praying many choose Jesus today is the day of salvation! It is too late after you take your last breath. Don't put it off!
 

Chaz R.

Member
There are many religions a lot of cults. We have to stick to what the :biblesays which is we are saved by accepting :fish the gift of salvation. I am the way, the truth, and the life no man cometh unto the Father but by me. There are not many ways Only One Jesus! :praying many choose Jesus today is the day of salvation! It is too late after you take your last breath. Don't put it off!
Doctrine Matters
 

Spartan Sprinter 1

Formerly known as Shaun
Great post Pat, thank you. :)




Praise God! :nod

I've always appreciated the analogy to what our response to Jesus is like......one who's got a paid for, one way ticket to get on a train. All that's needed is the ticket but in the case of Jesus, He paid for that ticket for us, we just need to get the ticket....respond in faith that He's paid the price for that ticket and accept that ticket i.e. place our faith in Jesus and His work on the cross in full payment for our sins and a wide opened up path of Salvation and to Heaven, resulting in Eternal Life. What a great deal!!!

When I've presented my ticket for a train, the Ticketmaster has never asked me, "Are you a good person?" or "How many good things have you done compared to bad things?" The only thing that the Ticketmaster is concerned about is, "Do you have a ticket?" If I don't have a ticket no amount of stating all the 'good' things I've done in my life will sway that Ticketmaster to let me on the train. No amount of work, favors, or self-punishment will earn a place on the train. I just need one, paid for ticket, period. In addition, when I present that paid for ticket, the Ticketmaster doesn't turn me away by asking about all the sinful things I've done or ask me, "Well, how many bad things have you done in your life....I need to consider this before punching your ticket?" Nope! That ticket is 100% permanently paid for, in my hand and I can have complete assurance of getting to my destination.


It's by faith alone, in Christ alone, by His wonderful, merciful, abundant and loving Grace alone that saves. That's the only sure ticket to heaven.
I like that one, great analogy
 

ChrisT

Active Member
Thanks Andy for the insight and chance to clarify. As believers, we all believe IN God and that is not a bad thing. I was trying to emphasize to un-believers Who frequently claim to believe IN God (doesn't everybody?) but the real issue is do they believe God/ i.e. what He says about man's condition without Jesus and what to do to be saved. I came from a RC background and for 22 years believed IN God but it wasn't until I was challenged to read the Gospels praying to know the truth, that God revealed my lost state to me and cried out to him to save me. I didn't know much at that point but only that I was lost, I couldn't save myself, and that Jesus paid for my sins, was buried and rose again. Yes, I still believed IN Him but more importantly I believed what He said. Thankfully He did save me 47 years ago and now I'm ready to go see Him face to face.
Like the cut of your jib man, this was really well said. I didn't really understand either, but you explained it crystal clear. And it's nice when somebody's not defensive or playing semantics lol.

It's also an important distinction to make because, even outside of other false religions, there's a growing tide in Christianity where people believe in God (i.e. His existence), but pick and choose what to believe He has said about Himself, our origins, our condition and our ultimate destiny (saved or not). Or at the very least, they don't believe we have any way of knowing any of it. This is particularly important when it comes to salvation, namely justification. I call it the issue of the penitent heart.

It stands to reason that, for anybody to accept Christ as saviour, the Spirit must convict you of the following:
- You are a sinner, as is everybody else
- God is perfect and is incompatible with sin to the point that He cannot exist in its presence, nor it in His presence
- Therefore God's fundamental incompatibility with sin means sin must be vanquished
- We cannot stand before a Perfect God on our own merits and achieve salvation
- Therefore we need a saviour
- Jesus Christ is that saviour, and He is LORD. Without Him, none can attain salvation.

If you pick or choose what God says about those things, it's an attempt to mentally discern a spiritual truth. And the Church is littered with moral relativism and a fear to proclaim the monopoly Christ has on salvation because they don't believe what God says. Sure, they believe in Him, they just don't believe Him (or that the Bible accurate represents His will).
 

finite68

Member
WHAT mATTERS - Belief Doesn’t Make It True​

The recent passing of celebrities Betty White, and Bob Saget has caused their followers to focus on man’s mortality and the afterlife. Just before Bob Saget died, he said this about Betty White; “Well, if things work out by Betty’s design— in the afterlife, they are reunited (her and her third husband, Allen Ludden.) I don’t know what happens when we die, but if Betty says you get to be with the love of your life, then I happily defer to Betty on this.” If Betty and Bob knew the Bible as well as their script lines, there wouldn’t be any confusion or speculation about their afterlife, and where and with whom it will be spent.

Betty seemed to be a wonderful, fun-loving, TV comedian. Bob Saget, host of “America’s Funniest Videos” concluded that she would be happy in heaven with her third husband because she believed that she would be happy in heaven with him. He even put his own personal trust of the afterlife in her beliefs (“I defer to Betty on this.”) But just because someone believes in something, does not mean their beliefs, or wishes will come true, no matter how much they believe it. The assurance of the fulfillment of any hope is based on the faithfulness of the one who makes the promises. Religions and religious people make all kinds of promises of what will happen after death. But there is only one promise maker who cannot and will not lie, the faithful, God almighty, creator of the universe and all that are in it. We don’t have to guess. He has already told us in His Word, the Bible, what awaits us after death and what to do to get there. In the case of hell after death, He said we don’t have to do anything. We will go there without even trying. However, in the case of going to heaven after death, He sets a very high standard. Faith. He said we must believe that He did it all for salvation when Jesus paid for our sins by His death on the cross, followed by a 3-day burial, and then conquering death by coming alive again. He said if anyone believes this good news, they would be guaranteed a place in heaven for eternity with Him. But many who are reading or hearing this message right now won’t believe the Gospel and will try to get to heaven by believing something else. They won’t get there, guaranteed by God.

Belief in something, no matter how wonderful, doesn’t make it true. What matters is not, “Do you believe in Him?” but, what matters is, “Do you believe Him?” He’s speaking. Are you listening?
This really all boils down to pride doesn't it. I mean it's always been hard, since being saved, to think of my loved one's that passed, not believing in Christ and their only salvation being in Him. But pride was Lucifer's downfall, along with the angels that followed him, and if we aren't believing on the one, true God what else can there be for us except a place where God is not, which when I think of a place with no God, and His beautiful creation, than that looks like hell to me <weeping>

Are there any comforting verses at all about God coming to a person, even in a coma before dying, that can be saved? This kills me to think about, but I understand if someone just rejects Him even then. I suppose there are people that would do that though :(
 

mattfivefour

Well-Known Member
Are there any comforting verses at all about God coming to a person, even in a coma before dying, that can be saved? This kills me to think about, but I understand if someone just rejects Him even then. I suppose there are people that would do that though.
You might find some comfort in these verses:

Ezekiel 33:11-- " 'As surely as I live,' declares the Lord GOD, 'I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked should turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'"

2 Peter 3:9-- "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance."

These verses tell us that God will do all He can to save a soul that He has created. The decision to reject God is made in spite of God's efforts. It is a terrible thing to see someone die without Christ. But I am assured by the very nature of God Himself that it was their own decision. Therefore I may be heartbroken by their foolishness, but I can rejoice in the knowledge that God is just and that worldly attachments will be utterly gone once I reach Heaven.
 

finite68

Member
You might find some comfort in these verses:

Ezekiel 33:11-- " 'As surely as I live,' declares the Lord GOD, 'I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked should turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'"

2 Peter 3:9-- "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance."

These verses tell us that God will do all He can to save a soul that He has created. The decision to reject God is made in spite of God's efforts. It is a terrible thing to see someone die without Christ. But I am assured by the very nature of God Himself that it was their own decision. Therefore I may be heartbroken by their foolishness, but I can rejoice in the knowledge that God is just and that worldly attachments will be utterly gone once I reach Heaven.
Those were a comfort Matt, thanks so much :) That's why to Bible is not a "one time read" and then off to gather dust on a shelf. I need to be in it every day to be reminded, and learn something new too, as I always do. I think "I read that chapter, I know I did, but never saw that before" ;)
 

lightofmylife

Blessed Hope-Prepare To Fly!
You might find some comfort in these verses:

Ezekiel 33:11-- " 'As surely as I live,' declares the Lord GOD, 'I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked should turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'"

2 Peter 3:9-- "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance."

These verses tell us that God will do all He can to save a soul that He has created. The decision to reject God is made in spite of God's efforts. It is a terrible thing to see someone die without Christ. But I am assured by the very nature of God Himself that it was their own decision. Therefore I may be heartbroken by their foolishness, but I can rejoice in the knowledge that God is just and that worldly attachments will be utterly gone once I reach Heaven.
People do have the free will to accept or reject :fish It comes down to some people have pride and will not humble themselves. Some wait too late, and they die. None of us know when our last day on earth will be if we should die. I say if because there will be those who won't die. They will still be alive and remain when :fish comes back.
 

alisani

Well-Known Member
This really all boils down to pride doesn't it. I mean it's always been hard, since being saved, to think of my loved one's that passed, not believing in Christ and their only salvation being in Him. But pride was Lucifer's downfall, along with the angels that followed him, and if we aren't believing on the one, true God what else can there be for us except a place where God is not, which when I think of a place with no God, and His beautiful creation, than that looks like hell to me <weeping>

Are there any comforting verses at all about God coming to a person, even in a coma before dying, that can be saved? This kills me to think about, but I understand if someone just rejects Him even then. I suppose there are people that would do that though :(
Job 33 is a comfort too

v24 to be gracious to him and say, "Spare him from going down to the pit, I have found a ransom for him". Then his flesh is renewed like a child's, it is restored as in the days of his youth. He prays to God and finds favor with Him, He sees God's face and shouts for joy; he is restored by God to his righteous state.

v29 God does all these things to a man-twice, even three times to turn back his soul from the pit that the light of life may shine on him.

God promises to make everything beautiful in its time. His mercies are new every morning. His love and faithfulness cannot be measured. And time. What is time to the one who was, and is and is to come, the Alpha and Omega? We are prisoners of hope, as the scripture says, and we are told that hope NEVER disappoints. We are told the rapture of millions will take place in the blink of an eye. So just imagine what he can do, even as one draws their last breath.
 

Neonap

Well-Known Member
I remember when I was Lost, being brought up Catholic and then becoming Muslim during my later teenage years and early adulthood. I remember how I desperately wanted to find God, to connect with Him and to have a relationship with the Creator of everything that we see. Atheism never made sense to me, never will because to deny God is to deny His obvious handiwork for the humble eyes to see.

During my time of being a Muslim, I wholeheartedly believed in Islam. It was the only religion that made sense to me above the eastern religions and I thought I had finally found the truth. I know now without a doubt tnat if I had died back then, no matter how much I believed in Islam; I would of ended up in Hell. The heart is deceitful and I thank God He brought me out of that delusion I was in.

Religion whether it's Islam or Catholicism, acknowledge the existence of God, to try to live a "moral" and "upright" life and there are some good and truth contained in these religions but the truth is none of these things will be enough to allow you into Heaven. Good deeds nor being highly religious will not save you from Hell. Many people fall into this category, decieved by their "goodness" and own good works.

The truth of the matter is that we all are sinners in need of a Savior. We cannot save ourselves and Jesus is the only Way, the only Truth and the only Life. The gospel is offensive to the self righteous but frees the sick and those who know they need a cure which is only found in Jesus Christ. Religion never saves, only Jesus saves.
 
Last edited:

Kerbluey

Well-Known Member
It’s too late, but Betty and Bob believe now. The longer I live the more grateful I am for being taught the truth. Eternity is a mighty long time. I hate this life on earth. How awful it would be to feel this way for all of eternity.
 
Top