If/Why? Sabbath

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mattfivefour

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I think I can see Lighthopes question.
Everyone is responding with a description of the significance of the Sabbath day and the fact that we now rest in our Sabbath.
But I think, to rephrase Lighthopes question, I hope correctly, is when did the change occur in the prohibition of working on the Sabbath so that Jesus was justified in breaking the Sabbath?

My answer to that question, which is not based on scripture but is simply a possible answer, is that Jesus was justified because He represented the Sabbath rest and as our Sabbath rest the work prohibition didn't apply to Him.

Or

Just the presence of Jesus in history at that time created our Sabbath rest both for us and for Him.

We should ask the Holy Spirit for guidance on this one.
I think that is very close, Dan. The fact is that the OT Sabbath pointed to the rest in Christ and, since He was now here, the type was fulfilled and no longer held any sway. Since Biblical types (the pictures of specific things to come) only exist to point to the antitypes (the reality), when an antitype arrives it ALWAYS replaces the type.
 
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GoldenEagle

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I think that is very close, Dan. The fact is that the OT Sabbath pointed to the rest in Christ and, since He was now here, the type was fulfilled and no longer held any sway. Since Biblical types (the pictures of specific things to come) only exist to point to the antitypes (the reality), when an antitype arrives it ALWAYS replaces the type.
Is it true that Jesus fulfilled the law as a Jew up to the point of His ministry beginning? And at this point in time, during His 3.5yr ministry was/is the True antitype?
 
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mattfivefour

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He fulfilled the law till the last moment of breath on this earth. To not have fulfilled even the minutest point of the law would have disqualified Him from being the true Messiah. For even the slightest deviation from the perfect keeping of the Law at all times and in all ways would have made Him a sinner and He would have died for His own sins and been, thus, unable to die for anyone else's. Besides, when we think about it, as God He was not about to break His own Word. In fact, He couldn't because His Word is settled forever and He does not change.

He was—in Heaven—the antitype (the fulfillment of the type, in theological terms) from the foundation of the world; but on earth this fulfillment did not occur until He had finished His Father's work while working His Father's will (John 4:34). When He said, "It is finished," it was (John 19:30): the way to God's Presence was now opened up to all human beings (Matthew 27:51), not just to the High Priest (himself a type of Christ) who could only enter in one time a year to make atonement for the sins of the people.
 

Lighthope

Member
To provide some closure to this, I posted the question on another forum and got a direct answer.

I'll post it here for the curious.

"It was to forcibly illustrate a point."

There was some more discourse after that, but that was the crux of the answer.

Here was my reply.

That's an answer! May or may not agree with it. I'll have to ponder it.

So cheers to everyone who took the time to reply.
 

mattfivefour

Administrator
Staff member
To provide some closure to this, I posted the question on another forum and got a direct answer.

I'll post it here for the curious.

"It was to forcibly illustrate a point."

There was some more discourse after that, but that was the crux of the answer.

Here was my reply.

That's an answer! May or may not agree with it. I'll have to ponder it.

So cheers to everyone who took the time to reply.
Really? "It was to forcibly illustrate a point." You view that as an answer to your original question which was--
"If the Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath, why did God proscribe such a harsh penalty (death) for breaking it?"
And the response you found answered that was ""It was to forcibly illustrate a point"? But then what was the actual point it illustrated so forcibly, if the Sabbath was made for man? The very first reply you received in this thread included the words, "The punishment by death of a Sabbath breaker confirms the significance and importance that God placed on the Sabbath." In other words, God was forcibly making a point. Different words, but the same response. Yet, you do not see that?
 

Steve53

Well-Known Member
Agree.

A bit disappointed how the thread imploded after so many tried to give good and solid answers.
Sadly, I was afraid of that from the very first post. The question asked, and variants of same, are straight from the atheist talking points handbook - specifically the chapter covering supposed Bible "contradictions."

If atheists, agnostics and secularist humanists were as intellectually sincere as they claim to be, they would study the Word for themselves instead of playing silly "gotcha" games with B.A.Christians under the guise of desiring to "learn" while simultaneously rejecting the answers offered in response to their queries.

And again, it's very telling indeed that our questions regarding Christ were studiously avoided.

I've never had a true Brother or Sister in Christ refuse to answer or otherwise ignore questions regarding who Christ is to them or how it was that they came to the foot of the cross in faith and repentance.
 

athenasius

Well-Known Member
Lighthope, don't take offense please but are you on the "Spectrum"? Some of your questions, thought patterns and reasoning just make me curious?
This crossed my mind a few days ago too when I was reading through.
Mine too. Because if he is, that irritation of trying to find out "exactly" and understand completely is really difficult and very irritating to go thru. and yes Erin, it's why some of my posts are so long and involved. I'm trying to answer to the level of detail I require and it's why I always enjoy your posts. A lot of my family is either autistic or Asberger's. I'm pretty high on the scale when I did a couple of tests,--95% but I've never gotten diagnosed, and likely won't. Billiefan once said something about that too, and I really appreciated his input here even more.
 

Erin

Well-Known Member
LightHope, the Lord keeps bringing you to my mind and I will be honest I'm not sure why. Maybe you have questions or aren't sure about something, maybe something is confusing, posibly contradicting. While the believers on this site don't know everything, I know that anyone of us would be willing to help you, you just have to reach out....... (I will be praying for you)
 
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