I have always been saved

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
I have always been saved

Once when I was sharing salvation on the streets I cam across a Catholic and asked him the question I usually start with of “Do you know what Jesus did for you?” With a smile and proud expression he stated that yes he did and was a good Catholic. At this point I figured that he was saved and just thought I would continue the conversation for a bit. So I asked him when he got saved and figured I would follow-up with how that happened. To my surprise, his answer was “I have always been saved, as I have always believed.”

This was so unexpected for me that I was not sure what to say next. So I then asked him if there was some point that he accepted what Jesus did for him. Again he stated “No, I just have always believed.” At this point it was clear that if I pressed further that I would be challenging his statement and inferring that he was a liar. So as not to get into an argument with him, I just said God bless you and let him alone.

So do you think this guy was saved? I could be wrong, but I don’t. You cannot have always been saved, just like you cannot have always been married. There needs to be a point in your life that you believe and accept what Jesus has done for you. I am not saying that you have to remember the date, but you should at least remember the experience. While this guy may believe, it would appear that he has never accepted God’s free gift.

Let’s look at a passage in James that is misunderstood by many.

Jas 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
Jas 2:22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
Jas 2:23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Jas 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
Jas 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Now let’s focus on James 2:20 below.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

First of all James was really using his point to stir up into action saved believers who claimed to have strong walking (not salvation) faith. His point being that if their walking faith was truly strong, then they would be doing something with it. He did refer to salvation faith which also requires a work, but the work in the grace age is only acceptance. So let’s ask a question this way to try and make the point more clear.

Which of the two guys in my example below would you say are saved?
Guy one says “Yes I do believe in God and Jesus, but have never accepted him as my Savior.”
Guy two says “Yes I do believe in God and Jesus, and accepted him as my Savior when I was 25.”

Hopefully you would understand that guy one is not saved and guy two is, assuming he was sincere. So when James says that “faith without works is dead” this is what he means.

Walking faith is dead without some type of evidence or works.
Saving faith is dead without sincere acceptance.

While is it clear from the Bible that salvation is a FREE GIFT, you still need to not just believe in the gift, but also accept it in order to possess it!
One could say that anyone that truly believes will also accept the gift!

Goodboy
 

Pat

Active Member
I have always been saved

Once when I was sharing salvation on the streets I cam across a Catholic and asked him the question I usually start with of “Do you know what Jesus did for you?” With a smile and proud expression he stated that yes he did and was a good Catholic. At this point I figured that he was saved and just thought I would continue the conversation for a bit. So I asked him when he got saved and figured I would follow-up with how that happened. To my surprise, his answer was “I have always been saved, as I have always believed.”

This was so unexpected for me that I was not sure what to say next. So I then asked him if there was some point that he accepted what Jesus did for him. Again he stated “No, I just have always believed.” At this point it was clear that if I pressed further that I would be challenging his statement and inferring that he was a liar. So as not to get into an argument with him, I just said God bless you and let him alone.

So do you think this guy was saved? I could be wrong, but I don’t. You cannot have always been saved, just like you cannot have always been married. There needs to be a point in your life that you believe and accept what Jesus has done for you. I am not saying that you have to remember the date, but you should at least remember the experience. While this guy may believe, it would appear that he has never accepted God’s free gift.

Let’s look at a passage in James that is misunderstood by many.

Jas 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
Jas 2:22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
Jas 2:23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Jas 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
Jas 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Now let’s focus on James 2:20 below.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

First of all James was really using his point to stir up into action saved believers who claimed to have strong walking (not salvation) faith. His point being that if their walking faith was truly strong, then they would be doing something with it. He did refer to salvation faith which also requires a work, but the work in the grace age is only acceptance. So let’s ask a question this way to try and make the point more clear.

Which of the two guys in my example below would you say are saved?
Guy one says “Yes I do believe in God and Jesus, but have never accepted him as my Savior.”
Guy two says “Yes I do believe in God and Jesus, and accepted him as my Savior when I was 25.”

Hopefully you would understand that guy one is not saved and guy two is, assuming he was sincere. So when James says that “faith without works is dead” this is what he means.

Walking faith is dead without some type of evidence or works.
Saving faith is dead without sincere acceptance.

While is it clear from the Bible that salvation is a FREE GIFT, you still need to not just believe in the gift, but also accept it in order to possess it!
One could say that anyone that truly believes will also accept the gift!

Goodboy
Your post reminded me of an old 2 minute warning addressing this issue. Here it is:
ARE YOU A BELIEVER?

"Are you a believer?" If you ask that question, and the person asked says "Yes I am", do you now share a common faith with them? Maybe, maybe not. The answer you get will depend on THEIR definition of "believer".

For instance, ask someone in Roswell, New Mexico (near the alleged 1947 UFO crash site) and their definition of believer might lead them to think you are asking about believing in UFO's.
Ask someone at a political rally and their definition of believer might lead them to think you are asking about believing in the featured candidate or their political agenda.

Do you see a problem? Yes? Then let's change the question to, "Are you a believer in Jesus?"

Ask religious people, such as the 2 people at your door with a Watchtower magazine, or your good Mormon neighbor, or even the person who sits next to you at church every Sunday and they will probably say "Yes I am." But are they all “Christians"? It depends on what definition of “Christian” we’re going by.

Now do you see a problem? You see, we're asking them according to OUR definitions, but they are answering according to THEIRS, so we might come away from those conversations with wrong conclusions about whether they are saved or not.

Keeping that in mind, instead of debating definitions, we will never go wrong by just sharing our testimony, which should include the Biblical definition of the Gospel by which we are saved. We can then ask them if they believe that same Gospel which simply is: (*)

1.) Jesus died on the cross paying for the sins of the world.
2.) Jesus was buried proving His death.
3.) Jesus rose from the dead 3 days later and is now alive.
4.) God promises to give that same eternal life to whosoever believes this good news.
 

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
1.) Jesus died on the cross paying for the sins of the world.
2.) Jesus was buried proving His death.
3.) Jesus rose from the dead 3 days later and is now alive.
4.) God promises to give that same eternal life to whosoever believes this good news.
Good post, but I would add one other point.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

5.) Jesus is Lord, meaning he is God.

Jehovah Witnesses believe 1 through 4 above, but not 5. They believe in a different Jesus who was the Angel Michael.
 
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Mikedexion

Well-Known Member
God knows the heart of this person and whether or not his name is written in the Book of Life. I don't.
This point is so crucial. I shared the gospel with my neighbor one day and he says he believed that Jesus Christ died for the sins of the world even his, was buried, and rose again.. He said he believes... but no change of character, no fruits of the spirit.

I too in a Jehovah's witness family for over 30 years always believed Jesus Christ died for the sins of the world and was resurrected ... but I did not confess that with my heart and ask him to be my Lord until about 2 years ago. I believe THAT was when I was saved because I admitted I'm a sinner and needed to ask the Lord to forgive me and invited him into my heart, Which is why I like Romans 10:9-10

If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

That is a combination of belief and a work right there. Same situation with the thief on the cross, he could have believed and said nothing, but he said:

“Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”
Then he said, “Jesus, Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom.


James to me is saying faith and the works of the spirit go together, seems to be the same message. Some people see the word "works" and get triggered. But there are three types of works.
Works of the Law = cannot save
Works of the flesh = cannot save
Works of the spirit = proves your saved.
 
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Goodboy

Well-Known Member
This point is so crucial. I shared the gospel with my neighbor one day and he says he believed that Jesus Christ died for the sins of the world even his, was buried, and rose again.. He said he believes... but no change of character, no fruits of the spirit.

I too in a Jehovah's witness family for over 30 years always believed Jesus Christ died for the sins of the world and was resurrected ... but I did not confess that with my heart and ask him to be my Lord until about 2 years ago. I believe THAT was when I was saved because I admitted I'm a sinner and needed to ask the Lord to forgive me and invited him into my heart, Which is why I like Romans 10:9-10

If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

That is a combination of belief and a work right there. Same situation with the thief on the cross, he could have believed and said nothing, but he said:

“Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”
Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.


James to me is saying faith and the works of the spirit go together, seems to be the same message. Some people see the word "works" and get triggered. But there are three types of works.
Works of the Law = cannot save
Works of the flesh = cannot save
Works of the spirit = proves your saved.
Mike Dexion, I'm not sure if I agree with your post or not. I definitely agree with most of it, but I am concerned with two of the things you said which are as follows.

1. "He said he believes... but no change of character, no fruits of the spirit."
Are you saying that he is not saved because you have seen no change in him? If so, how do you know if he has changed inwardly (his heart) which is what God looks at. Or maybe he is backsliden, but had gotton saved at some point.

2. "Works of the spirit = proves your saved."
Proves you are saved to who? The proof that you are saved should be sincere believe in and acceptance of what Jesus did for us. There is no other proof required.

I am not quite sure that I am understanding what you say it takes to be saved. There are many who say it just takes belief and acceptance which is correct, but later say someone is not saved because they don't do something or do something they should not. You and I may be on the same page, but as I said there are two things you stated that seem to imply that there is more required other than belief and acceptance.

Would you please help me to understand what it is you believe regarding salvation? Thanks! :)
 

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
I too in a Jehovah's witness family for over 30 years always believed Jesus Christ died for the sins of the world and was resurrected ... but I did not confess that with my heart and ask him to be my Lord until about 2 years ago. I believe THAT was when I was saved because I admitted I'm a sinner and needed to ask the Lord to forgive me and invited him into my heart, Which is why I like Romans 10:9-10
Jehovah's Witness believe in a different Jesus. The Jesus they believe in was the Angel Michael. That strange Jesus can't save anyone.
 

Andy C

Well-Known Member
Mike Dexion, I'm not sure if I agree with your post or not. I definitely agree with most of it, but I am concerned with two of the things you said which are as follows.

1. "He said he believes... but no change of character, no fruits of the spirit."
Are you saying that he is not saved because you have seen no change in him? If so, how do you know if he has changed inwardly (his heart) which is what God looks at. Or maybe he is backsliden, but had gotton saved at some point.

2. "Works of the spirit = proves your saved."
Proves you are saved to who? The proof that you are saved should be sincere believe in and acceptance of what Jesus did for us. There is no other proof required.

I am not quite sure that I am understanding what you say it takes to be saved. There are many who say it just takes belief and acceptance which is correct, but later say someone is not saved because they don't do something or do something they should not. You and I may be on the same page, but as I said there are two things you stated that seem to imply that there is more required other than belief and acceptance.

Would you please help me to understand what it is you believe regarding salvation? Thanks! :)
I agree with your counter points. Plus, how would someone evaluate proof? Is there a scale that if there are too many outward displays of sins, then that person cant be saved? What about the one who clearly displays the fruit of their salvation, but occasionally, behind locked doors, views porn? By the definition given in a previous post, this person would be saved by looking at outward appearances.

It can only be belief in Him as your Savior for salvation, how else could it be anything else?

Some Christians are quick to judge others based on their observed behaviors, but judge themselves based on their good intentions.
 

Mikedexion

Well-Known Member
Jehovah's Witness believe in a different Jesus. The Jesus they believe in was the Angel Michael. That strange Jesus can't save anyone.
7th Day Adventists also believe that Jesus was known as Michael the Archangel, and at the same time they believe Jesus is the second person of the trinity, both fully God and fully man... Go figure that one.

Anyway I'm not talking about behavior, the word behavior to me seems like "carnal performance" I'm specifically talking about continuing to sin as if you don't care about God anymore than the day before. Someone who says they believe but keeps on sinning deliberately was never saved, this is in-line with Paul telling us to test ourselves whether we are in the faith or if we failed the test.

How do I know my neighbor did not just say he believed to end the conversation?
How do we know Barack Obama isn't a believer? He was recorded on tape saying he believes Jesus is the Lord.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2011/09/27/140836664/obama-to-heckler-i-agree-jesus-christ-is-the-lord
 

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
7th Day Adventists also believe that Jesus was known as Michael the Archangel, and at the same time they believe Jesus is the second person of the trinity, both fully God and fully man... Go figure that one.
Did not know that about 7th Day Adventists. So you say they believe that Jesus is God, man and Michael the Archangel.
Who comes up with these things? :0_O
 

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
Anyway I'm not talking about behavior, the word behavior to me seems like "carnal performance" I'm specifically talking about continuing to sin as if you don't care about God anymore than the day before. Someone who says they believe but keeps on sinning deliberately was never saved, this is in-line with Paul telling us to test ourselves whether we are in the faith or if we failed the test.

How do I know my neighbor did not just say he believed to end the conversation?
How do we know Barack Obama isn't a believer? He was recorded on tape saying he believes Jesus is the Lord.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2011/09/27/140836664/obama-to-heckler-i-agree-jesus-christ-is-the-lord
You say "I'm not talking about behavior" and then say "I'm specifically talking about continuing to sin". I would say that sinning fits under the category of behavior. I am still kind of confused as to what you are trying to say.

You're right, you don't know why your neighbor responded the way he did as you don't know his heart. You really don't need to know why he said what he said, unless you want to judge him. As Tall Timbers stated "God knows" and he is the only one who needs to know.

Do I think Barack Obama is a believer? My guess would be no, but he could be. I think many of us would be totally surprised if God were to show us who we will see in Heaven. What is really hard for us to understand is that to God there are only two categories. You are either perfectly good or you are a sinner. Any sin no matter how small puts one in the category of sinner. Meaning to God, we are just as bad as Hitler when it comes to salvation.

Here is the point in bold... Any sin would keep us out of Heaven, so Christ died for all sin, all sin, all sin, all sin. Did I say he died for all sin, I think I did. So sin cannot keep us out of Heaven before, during or after salvation.

I state it this way to make myself clear, not to scold you or anything like that. :hug
 

Andy C

Well-Known Member
You say "I'm not talking about behavior" and then say "I'm specifically talking about continuing to sin". I would say that sinning fits under the category of behavior. I am still kind of confused as to what you are trying to say.

You're right, you don't know why your neighbor responded the way he did as you don't know his heart. You really don't need to know why he said what he said, unless you want to judge him. As Tall Timbers stated "God knows" and he is the only one who needs to know.

Do I think Barack Obama is a believer? My guess would be no, but he could be. I think many of us would be totally surprised if God were to show us who we will see in Heaven. What is really hard for us to understand is that to God there are only two categories. You are either perfectly good or you are a sinner. Any sin no matter how small puts one in the category of sinner. Meaning to God, we are just as bad as Hitler when it comes to salvation.

Here is the point in bold... Any sin would keep us out of Heaven, so Christ died for all sin, all sin, all sin, all sin. Did I say he died for all sin, I think I did. So sin cannot keep us out of Heaven before, during or after salvation.

I state it this way to make myself clear, not to scold you or anything like that. :hug
As usual, well said, completely agree.
 

Popcornfish

Active Member
As to the gentleman described in the OP. Yes, I believe he has always believed because he said so. Those who are in Christ are in relationship with the greatest creator and holy spirit anywhere at all. The closest people to God are newborns. And some newborns are still deeply linked even when they grow older and the veils of this subjective reality start to fall over their consciousness. I think the man the OP described was one such person. They've always believed because they've always known God from the moment they entered the world He made for them.

Or, they could have been someone that in order to politely distance themselves from Proselytizing simply said they have always believed, so as to make any further pursuit impossible.

One never knows does one? When we preach on the street we bring the words of God to anyone passing by. However, this is the age of the Internet. Anyone who is called to seek God are able to do so in the privacy of their own home. And churches in all towns and cities also provide opportunity.

I use to work outside many years ago. On a break I was sitting under my favorite oak shade tree when a woman approached. She was Pentecostal turns out. I was reading a book at the time that wasn't Christian oriented and she thought to avail herself of the opportunity to approach me having seen its cover after she'd parked nearby.
"You know, you'll search and search but that book will never save your soul." She said.
I thought it rude to imagine on site that I was not saved. And to this day I find people who from time to time walk on posted property to my door so as to ask if I've heard the good news of Jesus Christ equally so. How dare someone imagine people they see are not saved.
God knows the heart. He calls whom he will to himself. What testimony would I give to that truth in his own scripture were I to approach perfect strangers at any time and with my question, have you heard....equally inform them that they have to in some way account to me in their answer because I in my approach presume they're damned.

Go forth and deliver the good news to all nations.
We have that capacity now in greater avenues of teaching than in the time of the Apostles. When even they never did such a thing as I described.
They went from town to town and preached the good news. They weren't told by the Messiah to ask people on the village street, or knock on a hut door, if they've heard the good news.
They simply went about and preached the gospel and whomever heard and was led to stop and listen did.

There's no excuse for anyone in a civilized country to not hear about Jesus if they choose to learn.
In truth, we as Christians are likely to be the only Bible someone see's . My duty is to live the truth of God in Christ. Lead by example.
 

Goodboy

Well-Known Member
As to the gentleman described in the OP. Yes, I believe he has always believed because he said so. Those who are in Christ are in relationship with the greatest creator and holy spirit anywhere at all. The closest people to God are newborns. And some newborns are still deeply linked even when they grow older and the veils of this subjective reality start to fall over their consciousness. I think the man the OP described was one such person. They've always believed because they've always known God from the moment they entered the world He made for them.

Or, they could have been someone that in order to politely distance themselves from Proselytizing simply said they have always believed, so as to make any further pursuit impossible.

One never knows does one? When we preach on the street we bring the words of God to anyone passing by. However, this is the age of the Internet. Anyone who is called to seek God are able to do so in the privacy of their own home. And churches in all towns and cities also provide opportunity.

I use to work outside many years ago. On a break I was sitting under my favorite oak shade tree when a woman approached. She was Pentecostal turns out. I was reading a book at the time that wasn't Christian oriented and she thought to avail herself of the opportunity to approach me having seen its cover after she'd parked nearby.
"You know, you'll search and search but that book will never save your soul." She said.
I thought it rude to imagine on site that I was not saved. And to this day I find people who from time to time walk on posted property to my door so as to ask if I've heard the good news of Jesus Christ equally so. How dare someone imagine people they see are not saved.
God knows the heart. He calls whom he will to himself. What testimony would I give to that truth in his own scripture were I to approach perfect strangers at any time and with my question, have you heard....equally inform them that they have to in some way account to me in their answer because I in my approach presume they're damned.

Go forth and deliver the good news to all nations.
We have that capacity now in greater avenues of teaching than in the time of the Apostles. When even they never did such a thing as I described.
They went from town to town and preached the good news. They weren't told by the Messiah to ask people on the village street, or knock on a hut door, if they've heard the good news.
They simply went about and preached the gospel and whomever heard and was led to stop and listen did.

There's no excuse for anyone in a civilized country to not hear about Jesus if they choose to learn.
In truth, we as Christians are likely to be the only Bible someone see's . My duty is to live the truth of God in Christ. Lead by example.
Interesting....

Do you believe that all children will be saved? They are saved because they have not yet reached the age of (more like the point of) accountability. Meaning they have not yet started deciding for themselves what to believe. So to explain further, I believed in the tooth fairy because my parents told me she existed. I also believed in Jesus for the same reason, because my parents told me he existed. However when I began to decide for myself what to believe, I no longer believed in the tooth fairy or Jesus. So while I could be wrong, I don't think anyone can have always believed. They may have began believing because of their parents and later believed because they chose to. When they choose to, that is when they were saved.

As far as spreading the Gospel. Believe or not there are people in the US that don't know about Jesus. The daughter of my niece knew nothing about the Gospel when she came to visit and she was around 14. There is also a much larger group that don't know that salvation is a free gift. In fact, I was one of them and got saved at 28 when someone told me that it was a free gift.
 
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GotGrace

Well-Known Member
Your post reminded me of an old 2 minute warning addressing this issue. Here it is:
ARE YOU A BELIEVER?

"Are you a believer?" If you ask that question, and the person asked says "Yes I am", do you now share a common faith with them? Maybe, maybe not. The answer you get will depend on THEIR definition of "believer".

For instance, ask someone in Roswell, New Mexico (near the alleged 1947 UFO crash site) and their definition of believer might lead them to think you are asking about believing in UFO's.
Ask someone at a political rally and their definition of believer might lead them to think you are asking about believing in the featured candidate or their political agenda.

Do you see a problem? Yes? Then let's change the question to, "Are you a believer in Jesus?"

Ask religious people, such as the 2 people at your door with a Watchtower magazine, or your good Mormon neighbor, or even the person who sits next to you at church every Sunday and they will probably say "Yes I am." But are they all “Christians"? It depends on what definition of “Christian” we’re going by.

Now do you see a problem? You see, we're asking them according to OUR definitions, but they are answering according to THEIRS, so we might come away from those conversations with wrong conclusions about whether they are saved or not.

Keeping that in mind, instead of debating definitions, we will never go wrong by just sharing our testimony, which should include the Biblical definition of the Gospel by which we are saved. We can then ask them if they believe that same Gospel which simply is: (*)

1.) Jesus died on the cross paying for the sins of the world.
2.) Jesus was buried proving His death.
3.) Jesus rose from the dead 3 days later and is now alive.
4.) God promises to give that same eternal life to whosoever believes this good news.
Amen
 

Mikedexion

Well-Known Member
You say "I'm not talking about behavior" and then say "I'm specifically talking about continuing to sin". I would say that sinning fits under the category of behavior. I am still kind of confused as to what you are trying to say.

You're right, you don't know why your neighbor responded the way he did as you don't know his heart. You really don't need to know why he said what he said, unless you want to judge him. As Tall Timbers stated "God knows" and he is the only one who needs to know.

Do I think Barack Obama is a believer? My guess would be no, but he could be. I think many of us would be totally surprised if God were to show us who we will see in Heaven. What is really hard for us to understand is that to God there are only two categories. You are either perfectly good or you are a sinner. Any sin no matter how small puts one in the category of sinner. Meaning to God, we are just as bad as Hitler when it comes to salvation.

Here is the point in bold... Any sin would keep us out of Heaven, so Christ died for all sin, all sin, all sin, all sin. Did I say he died for all sin, I think I did. So sin cannot keep us out of Heaven before, during or after salvation.

I state it this way to make myself clear, not to scold you or anything like that. :hug
Well I will disagree peacefully on that one and will let God be the judge :)
 
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