Catholics praying to Mary and the saints yet still claim to be Christians

Jaybird

Well-Known Member
I thought I'd add what Jack Kelly says about that Matthew 12 passage:

https://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/blasphemy-of-the-holy-spirit-2/


Q
In Matthew 12: 30-32 Jesus is talking to the Jews, explaining a sin that cannot be forgiven. I understand all sins were forgiven at the cross, but in verse 32b he mentions “the age to come”. I assume that age to be the Kingdom Age as being the next age to come for the Jews. Am I correct in this thinking? And if so what does this mean for the Jews?

A
Matt. 12:30-32 was directed toward the Pharisees who watched with their own eyes while Jesus performed miracles of various kinds. They refused to believe He was the Messiah their own scriptures had foretold so they attributed His miracles to the only other supernatural force they knew, the devil (Matt. 12:24). In other words, they didn’t do this out of ignorance but out of malicious intent.

When He took on human form, Jesus set aside His God-like power and performed His miracles through the power of the Holy Spirit, so these Pharisees were blaspheming the Holy Spirit. By saying they would not be forgiven in this age or the age to come Jesus was saying that by their deliberate unbelief they had sealed their eternal destiny.

Many Jews of the Lord’s time, and since, have come to faith in Him and had their sins forgiven. A significant number of Pharisees were included among them. It’s only those who knowingly blasphemed the Holy Spirit by attributing His miraculous work to Satan who were eternally condemned. All others have their lifetime on Earth to decide whether to accept the Lord’s death as payment for their sins and be saved, just like the Gentiles.

By the way, since Church age believers have the Holy Spirit sealed within us, it’s impossible for us to commit this sin, consciously or unconsciously. For example, some Corinthians accused other believers of cursing Jesus while speaking in tongues, but Paul in effect told them it was impossible because of the Holy Spirit’s presence within them. (1 Cor. 12:3) The same would hold true for us. For our age, the unforgivable sin is to reject the pardon Jesus purchased for us with His life. Doing so puts us outside of God’s forgiveness because the death of His Son is the only remedy He has provided for our sin problem.
I agree 100%. All praise to Christ Jesus THE propitiation for our sins!!!

Colossians 3:11: "Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all."

JESUS is THE only answer!!!!! Praise his most holy name!!!!!!!!!!
 

SkyRider

Well-Known Member
Revelation 21:27And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoeverworketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb’s book of life.

This verse implies some sins can be forgiven in the afterlife.
Hebrews 9:27 warns us: “…It is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment”.

One is given a whole lifetime on Earth in a physical body to get right with God - accept Jesus Christ as God's only means of salvation - but once you leave this realm and move on to the next, there remains no possibility of getting right with God. Your eternal fate has been determined. Presently, a person dying without Christ - without having all of their sins atoned for by Him - enters into a place of torment to await their turn to stand before Jesus at the Great White Throne judgment, to then be cast into the Lake of Fire. While awaiting this ultimate pronouncement, there is no means available to purge away any sins. One forfeits that possibility at the moment of death. A horrible decision has been made to put off getting right with God while on this side of eternity - thinking that another possibility exists to clean up one's life later - then the split second that they pass on into eternity, the realization that they have erred in their reasoning envelopes them as they are now in a continual state of suffering. No timeouts, no exit plans, no second chances and certainly no purgatory. Jesus would have told us if there were; He never did. Instead, He gave us the story of Lazarus and the rich man - read up on that one! The rich man wanted someone to go back and warn his brothers of the mistake he made.

That is what we are attempting to do here: warn you of the unscriptural Roman Catholic teaching of a second opportunity to get right with God. It doesn't exist. God's Word doesn't reveal such a place. God is not a liar. He is the ultimate Truth: “I am the Way, the Truth and the Life; no one comes to the Father but by me” John 14:6

If God doesn't mention it in His Word, then the place does not exist. It is a lie from the enemy: don't worry about how you live now, you'll get another chance to clean up yourself. No! It is false and demonic. God's plan from before the foundation of the world was that He would put on human flesh and subject Himself to an excruciating death on the cross to cover the cost of all our sins. If God's death on the cross couldn't pay for all your sins, how could you as a mere creation of His do for yourself what He couldn't accomplish by His suffering?? It is impossible. It is a deeply flawed doctrine of the popes.

They are liars and tools of the enemy.

Don't make a stupid mistake and trust in them instead of Christ for your salvation.

“It is appointed once to die, then after this the judgment”.
 

Chris

Administrator
Staff member
I’m just explaining the belief, so you are properly understanding what Catholics believe. Catholics believe if you go to Purgatory, you are going to heaven and that’s the only destination. It’s not a second chance. It’s just that you have to be perfect before you can enter heaven. It’s all through the Old Testament, but I’m only using the new. So you have to be purified before going to heaven. Revelation 21:27And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoeverworketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb’s book of life.

If Catholics don't trust solely in the COMPLETED work of Jesus on the Cross, then they are lost. Purgatory doesn't even exist. So, if they are counting on purgatory to take away their sins they will be really disappointed when they find out there is no such thing and the end up somewhere that is not Heaven. :eek

That is why we aim to help Catholics see the truth about salvation that can only be found in Jesus Christ.

This verse implies some sins can be forgiven in the afterlife.

Matthew 12:31Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 12:32And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

No, that is not what that verse implies. If some one does not accept the COMPLETED work of Jesus on the Cross before they die, the moment they take their last breath their eternal destiny will be decided. And they will have made that choice themselves. Your sins MUST be accounted for before you die. There's only one way to Heaven and that is through Jesus. All other roads lead to destruction.

You have to remember that a lot of the Catholic Church, both Eastern and Western still have a lot of the ideas that came from Judiaism, which makes sense as the first Christians were mostly Jewish People.

Zachariah 13:9. And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

The RCC and Judaism are both wrong with their "ideas" any way you slice it. Neither trust solely in the COMPLETED work of Jesus Christ. If you get that wrong, nothing else really matters. Which is why we witness to both of them to tell them the Good News of Jesus Christ. :thumbup
 

Bethlehem57

Well-Known Member
Lightofmylife, you are welcome. I am now in a Calvary Chapel as well, but the Holy Spirit "slapped me in the face" one day and gave me the hunger to read the Bible like "UntilThe WholeWorldHears" noted above. It is my experience that God truly draws those he predestined towards the knowledge of his truth. It's just not something you can come to through logic or reasoning. The smartest people in the world can't even figure that out! I am proof of this as we all are proof of this. One day soon I'll post my real testimony to how I got saved. All we can do is praise God that he illuminated us with the knowledge of his Son!
Love Calvary Chapel! DH and I attend.
 

Armor of Light

Praising my Savior all the day long!
Why do Catholics insist on trying to change the minds of born again, bible believing , Jesus loving believers, it confounds me. I used to be RCC, when I was saved I left that pig pen process of good works ,tradition and repetitive prayer which our Father in heaven detests, no way I would go back to that messy belief system. Christ alone, our cornerstone that is all you need, and it is the only way for remission of your sins, period, end of story, "It is Finished" spoken from the lips of our glorious precious loving savior himself. It gets tiresome to read responses on this forum from RCC patrons who try to influence our thinking, and most of the time when they are answered with the truth or are corrected there is no response from them. I do pray all those stuck in the dark grasp of RCC gobbeldygook for their minds and hearts to be open to the real gospel and that they too be set completely free from that RCC nonsense before it's too late. Once you leave here your destination is decided by the decision you made to accept Jesus and the gift of salvation or not to accept, period.
 

Jaybird

Well-Known Member
The want to change our minds because the priests, bishops, cardinals and pope tell them that the RCC dogmas are the only truth and everyone else is wrong.

1Corinthians 2:14-16:

"The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned."

1CO 12:3: "Therefore I want you to understand that no one speaking in the Spirit of God ever says “Jesus is accursed!” and no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except in the Holy Spirit."

They don't have the Spirit of Truth in their hearts. I also left the RCC. Thank God I saw the light!
 

RestInHim

Well-Known Member
I'm familiar with Scripture saying we are not to pray/talk or summon the dead. I know someone who is Catholic and is saying that we can because Moses and Elijah spoke to Jesus. I don't know what else to share with her, she also believes in Replacement Theology. :pray With the war going on with Israel we are seeing more of this coming out into the open.

(Luke 9: 29-31) "Now about eight days after these sayings he took with him Peter and John and James and went up on the mountain to pray. And as he was praying, the appearance of his face was altered, and his clothing became dazzling white. And behold, two men were talking with him, Moses and Elijah, who appeared in glory and spoke of his departure, which he was about to accomplish at Jerusalem."
 

heisable2

Well-Known Member
Because they are not encouraged to read their bibles.. therefore they don't and are biblically illiterate.. which means..they don't know any better...
So right...I was RCC and had a Bible in high school. I took it out for class no more than 6 times. The only Bible reading was the epistle and gospel. The church never gave you the whole story. So biblically illiterate is a correct statement.

I am the one who asked the question about praying to Mary and saints. I was asking for a friend because what I told her flew over her head.

I've been born again for 49 years. I volunteer for a RCC thrift store. One day a nun came in and questioned why I was no longer a RCC. She later said she'd pray for me to come to come back to RCC. I said "Don't bother". I know the truth.
 

nick3220

Member
I'm not Catholic, and I don't agree with many of their teachings. But I do think there are saved Catholics that believe in the atoning death and the resurrection of Jesus. A misguided believer is still saved.
 

Chris

Administrator
Staff member
I'm not Catholic, and I don't agree with many of their teachings. But I do think there are saved Catholics that believe in the atoning death and the resurrection of Jesus. A misguided believer is still saved.

Yes, there will be some believers who are in the cults but that haven't bought the lies of their cult. They will have trusted in the biblical Jesus and not the one invented by their cult. We need to pray for all believers to come out of the cults. :pray

Praying that Catholics, Mormons, JWs, etc. see the TRUE Jesus and come to Him before it is too late. :pray
 

Baby Yoda

Watchman
Because they are not encouraged to read their bibles.. therefore they don't and are biblically illiterate.. which means..they don't know any better...

So true. We were given Bibles at age 13 confirmation ceremonies, but they were never in the pews and we never read them, even in classes.
 

Bethlehem57

Well-Known Member
I got saved 21 yrs ago at a Calvary Chapel., and never went back to a Catholic church.
I was radically changed ( from day one) The Holy Spirit gave me a hunger to read the word of God, I couldn't put it down. My first-year alone, I stopped counting at 35 times I had read through the new testament.
Well, I was never the same again.
Gotta love Calvary Chapels and their worship!
 

Jaybird

Well-Known Member
I agree with you as a former Catholic. The Pope calls Mary the "Queen of Heaven." Still trying to find that in my Bible to no avail. With all of the Bible resources available today how can anyone fall for this garbage? Just read your Bible and find out what it says!
 

Wally

Choose Your Words Carefully...
I agree with you as a former Catholic. The Pope calls Mary the "Queen of Heaven." Still trying to find that in my Bible to no avail. With all of the Bible resources available today how can anyone fall for this garbage? Just read your Bible and find out what it says!
Unfortunately too many read only the gospel of Milton.
You see, just make an epic novel, add great graphics, and people will believe.

Worked before and will work again... just like ... Star Wars...
 
There is an actual prayer to Mary that you memorize and then as you touch each bead on the rosary you recite the prayer. So if there are 30 beads on the rosary you would be reciting the prayer 30 times (I don't remember how many beads it actually has). In the Catholic Mass they basically re-enact Calvary through some rituals. There is a defined structure to it and depending on the Church they may have a choir or band. The priest will deliver a sermon on a variety of topics related to Christian living, but they rarely read from the Bible. They consider confession one of the sacraments (by which grace is attained). All you do is let the priest know your sins and then he absolves you of the sin and makes you do some sort of penance (like rote prayers). During Lent they abstain from eating meat on Friday and replace that with fish supposedly to remind you of what happened on Good Friday. A strange religion with lots of unbiblical teachings, rituals and some biblical truth thrown in to give it an air of legitimacy and they say anyone who doesn't believe their way is a heretic. They should take a long look in the mirror.
Amen! I was born into the Catholic Church. I hated it. They taught us that if we didn't follow the HRCC we would go to hell. And that all non Catholics are heretics. A cult. Teach Catechism and not Bible. Pray to Saints and kinda border on Mary worship. I love Mary a lot, mind you, but I think they put her up there with Jesus. And to me that's wrong. Jesus is God. I finally left the Church in 2011 or 2012 at the urging of a close friend. I've been Protestant ever since! Like I say it's a relationship not a religion.
 
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