Well-Known Member
In other Brexit news here in Scotland, yesterday the Scottish Govt announced it will lower the EU flag at precisely 11 pm on 31st January, the point at which the UK (and Scotland) leaves the EU.

There are five flag poles outside the parliament building in Edinburgh. With priority running from left to right, the union flag is to represent the fact that we're still part of the UK and the Scottish Parliament is but an extension of the UK one, then comes the Saltire, which is Scotland's own national flag and represents the Scottish laws and the independence of the Parliament to make it's own laws apart from the UK parliament, and finally the EU flag representing Scotland's membership of EU as part of the UK.

Story here


Well-Known Member
Mrs Merkel said last year that Britain would emerge as a “potential competitor” to the EU, alongside China and the United States.
Sounds like one of the major reasons they were trying to prevent Brexit.

Maybe if they had the attitude of being competitive previously it wouldn't have come to this.

But then you would still have had to deal with a bunch of unelected bureaucrats make your laws.

Just remember, you are not out until you are out. Everything prior to that point is just a promise.


Well-Known Member
Sounds like one of the major reasons they were trying to prevent Brexit.

Maybe if they had the attitude of being competitive previously it wouldn't have come to this.

But then you would still have had to deal with a bunch of unelected bureaucrats make your laws.

Just remember, you are not out until you are out. Everything prior to that point is just a promise.
Yes your right Dan.


Well-Known Member
Boris Johnson’s Brexit bill has cleared its last hurdle after the government overturned five House of Lords amendments to it, including one that would have restored the right of unaccompanied child refugees to be reunited with their families in the UK.

The legislation is expected to gain royal assent within days after peers agreed to end the parliamentary “ping-pong” phase where it moves between the two houses until agreement is reached.

While the passage of the withdrawal agreement bill, or Wab, which puts the deal into legislation, became a formality after Johnson won a significant majority in December’s election, it is nonetheless a symbolically significant moment, after Theresa May’s plan was rejected by MPs three times.

There was, however, some final controversy, as opposition MPs condemned the government for ordering Conservative MPs to oppose an amendment drafted by Alf Dubs, the Labour peer and former child refugee, guaranteeing family reunion rights. Lord Dubs called the move “bitterly disappointing”.

The amendment, passed in the Lords on Tuesday, was rejected in the Commons by 342 votes to 254. All those who voted against were Conservatives.

“What could be more humane than asking that unaccompanied child refugees stranded in Europe be able to join relatives in this country?” Dubs said in a tweet.

It was among five amendments to the EU withdrawal agreement bill passed by peers which have now been overturned. The bill puts the government’s Brexit deal into law.

There were also amendments on EU workers legally residing in the UK getting physical proof of their right to remain; a commitment to the UK parliament not legislating for devolved matters without the consent of the devolved legislature affected, and two relating to the power of courts to depart from European court of justice rulings.

Labour’s Diane Abbott, the shadow home secretary, said the government was “attempting to shirk its moral and legal obligation to child refugees and their families”.
She said: “The Tory manifesto just a month ago claimed they would continue to support refugees, and even that they would increase that support. This is a shameful betrayal of those promises.”
Stuart McDonald, the SNP’s immigration spokesperson, said: “Rather than stepping up and playing its role in addressing the refugee crisis, the toxic Tory government has instead lurched to the extremes and closed the door on some of the most vulnerable children in the world.”
Dubs, who came to the UK as a Kindertransport child refugee after fleeing Prague in 1939, has urged the government to enshrine the principle of family reunion for child refugees fleeing conflict after Brexit.
Responding later in the Lords, Dubs said he noted government promises to make a statement on the issue in the next couple of months, saying ministers should explain how they would make sure the system was ready for the start of 2021, when the Brexit transition period ends.
While the measure was originally in the bill, it was removed after December’s election victory for Boris Johnson, with the government insisting it would stick to the commitment, but did not see the need to put it into a Brexit bill.
“The government’s policy is unchanged. Delivering on it will not require legislation,” the Brexit secretary, Stephen Barclay, told MPs as he explained to the Commons why ministers opposed the amendment.
“Primary legislation cannot deliver the best outcomes for these children as it cannot guarantee that we will reach an agreement. And that is why this is ultimately a matter which must be negotiated with the EU, and the government is committed to seeking the best possible outcome in these negotiations.”
Barclay came under pressure from MPs to explain his reasoning. Yvette Cooper, the Labour former chair of the home affairs committee, said she did not understand the active decision to remove the measure from the bill.
“There’s loads of things in legislation through the decades that the government says it agrees with and so it says it’s not needed, but it doesn’t remove it from the statute book,” she said. “And that is what makes us all suspicious.”
Barclay replied: “The reason is the purpose of this legislation is to implement in domestic law the international agreement we’ve reached.”


Well-Known Member
The Scottish National Party is making a last-ditch bid to block the bill taking the UK out of the European Union from becoming law, on the final day of its passage through parliament.

SNP leader in Westminster Ian Blackford has demanded the right to attend a meeting of the Privy Council to argue the case to the Queen, or a representative of the palace, that Boris Johnson’s Withdrawal Agreement Act should not be given Royal Assent without the consent of devolved legislatures in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

Royal Assent is the final step which the bill must complete to pass into law, paving the way for the UK to depart the EU on 31 January.

After a historic parliamentary battle which saw Theresa May’s withdrawal plans rejected three times over the course of 2019, eventually leading to her resignation as PM last July, legislation to pass Mr Johnson’s similar plan has enjoyed a much smoother passage onto the statute book.

MPs thwarted his attempt to force it through in time for the scheduled Brexit date of 31 October last year by rejecting his truncated timetable for scrutiny.

But after he secured a landslide 80-seat majority for Conservatives in December’s general election, a revised bill was tabled within a week and has passed through both houses with a total of 11 days’ scrutiny.

Mr Johnson is expected to be able to use his domination of the Commons to strike out four House of Lords amendments, including on the protection of unaccompanied child refugees and the status of EU expats, with minimal resistance on Wednesday.

This will leave only Royal Assent and ratification in the European Parliament to be completed before Brexit day.

Now Mr Blackford is attempting to disrupt the final steps in the process by writing to Commons Leader Jacob Rees-Mogg to warn him that granting assent without the legislative consent of the Scottish Parliament, Welsh Sennedd and Northern Ireland Assembly would represent a “serious breach” of the so-called Sewel Convention, which underpins the devolution settlement.

"By dragging Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland out of the EU against the expressed wishes of the Scottish Parliament, Sennedd, and the Northern Ireland Assembly, the Tory government is breaching the devolution settlement and trampling over democracy,” said Mr Blackford.
"Scotland has voted against Brexit at every opportunity - yet the UK government is determined to ignore our views, terminate our EU membership, and deny us any choice over our future.
"The SNP won a landslide victory at the general election - winning 80 per cent of seats in Scotland on a cast-iron mandate to hold an independence referendum. The people of Scotland must have a choice over our future - so we can remain at the heart of Europe as an equal and independent country."
In his letter, Mr Blackford told Mr Rees-Mogg that a majority of MPs representing Scottish seats supported an unsuccessful amendment to the Queen’s Speech arguing that Royal Assent should not be given without the consent of the three devolved legislatures.
“As a member of Her Majesty’s Privy Council, I am formally requesting the right to attend any meeting of the Council convened for the purpose of granting Royal Assent to the bill,” he wrote.
“I will wish to object in the strongest possible terms at the meeting to assent being given to a bill without consent from the devolved legislatures, and which enacts a decision to leave the European Union overwhelmingly rejected by voters in Scotland in the 2016 referendum.”

They keep trying do they not. very tiresome.


Well-Known Member
Boris Johnson has been warned he must break his promise not to impose trade checks in the Irish Sea after Brexit or face legal action from the EU.

The prime minister was warned by a senior aide to Brussels chief Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier that the EU “will not tolerate any backsliding or half measures”.

Johnson has repeatedly claimed there will be no checks on trade between Great Britain and Northern Ireland as a result of his Brexit deal, insisting on Wednesday that the province would “emphatically” still have “unfettered” access to the rest of the UK after Brexit.

But Barnier’s adviser, Stefaan De Rynck, stressed that the Brexit deal negotiated by the PM includes a commitment from the UK to impose “checks” on goods, including food and agri-food, heading to Northern Ireland to ensure they comply with EU customs and single market rules.

He made clear that Johnson must implement what he agreed, including checks, by the end of the year or face enforcement action under the terms of the deal.

He told an event at University College London: “We will have to be extremely disciplined to get it up and running in 11 months, to have the UK authorities apply the checks that the UK has agreed to apply. The union’s customs code (and) the union’s single market standards continue to apply in Northern Ireland as of 2021.”

He went on: “That creates quite a bit of preparatory measures that are needed and ... certainly we will not tolerate any backsliding or half measures.

“The protocol is clear on what needs to be done by both sides and we will want to stick to that.”

Johnson alienated the Democratic Unionist Party by striking a deal which leaves Northern Ireland effectively in the EU single market, but also the UK customs area, to ensure Great Britain could enjoy a looser relationship with Brussels after Brexit while maintaining a soft Irish border.

De Rynck refused to respond to Johnson’s comments at prime minister’s questions on Wednesday when he was asked by the DUP’s Jefferey Donaldston whether his promise of no checks meant there would “continue to be unfettered access for Northern Ireland businesses to the UK single market” and vice versa.

Johnson replied: “Emphatically it does.”

De Rynck said: “I won’t dwell on comments I haven’t seen.

“The situation is clear - as of January 2021 the withdrawal agreement contains legally binding commitments, and the protocol is very clear that UK authorities will be in charge, if you are talking about goods flows from Great Britain into Northern Ireland, for the application of the customs codes of the European Union and to ensure that products that enter comply with single market standards of the EU, be it food, agri-food, industrial products and what have you.

“That’s a very clear commitment and the challenge for 2020 will be to work with the UK authorities.”
He added: “There are clear commitments on the UK which are legally binding.”
De Rynck pointed towards mechanisms in the Brexit deal for resolving disputes when asked what sanctions the EU could take, including the so-called “joint committee”.
He also suggested the UK could lose international standing if it breached the withdrawal agreement, the legislation for which passed through parliament on Wednesday.
“It’s the first major international agreement for Brexit Britain,” De Rynck said.


Well-Known Member
Brief overview.

Brexit day: what happens after January 31?

Brexit day is fast approaching, with the UK on track to officially leave the European Union (EU) in less than two weeks. But how did we get to this stage, and what is in the Brexit deal?
Here is everything you need to know about the UK's departure, including what the deal means for UK citizens and the changes to travel, investments and savings we can expect to see post-Brexit.
What is Brexit?
Brexit - a portmanteau of Britain and exit - was coined following the 2016 United Kingdom European Union membership referendum. The referendum, held on Thursday June 23, 2016, was to decide whether the UK should leave or remain in the EU. Leave won by 51.9 per cent to 48.1 per cent. More than 30 million people voted meaning the turnout was 71.8 per cent.
What date is the UK due to leave the EU?
The UK had been due to leave the EU on March 29, 2019, two years after Article 50 was invoked triggering the exit process, but the original withdrawal agreement was rejected several times by MPs.
The EU granted an initial extension until April 12, 2019, before backing a six month extension until October 31, 2019.
After failing to pass a revised Brexit deal into law, and with the Benn Act preventing a no-deal Brexit, Prime Minister Boris Johnson was legally required to ask for another extension. EU leaders agreed to this and set a new departure date of January 31, 2020.
Following the December general election, which saw Mr Johnson and the Conservatives secure a majority of 80 seats, MPs voted in favour of the Withdrawal Agreement Bill and the UK is now expected to meet the latest Brexit deadline.
What is in the Brexit deal?
The prime minister's Brexit deal, which is currently being examined in the House of Lords, outlines a range of issues, including travel, money, healthcare, citizens' rights, agriculture and trade.
Most notably, the deal states that the UK will leave the EU customs union and have the freedom to develop new trade agreements with other countries around the world.
Unlike former prime minister Theresa May, Mr Johnson has replaced the Irish backstop with a new agreement for Northern Ireland that will begin when the transition period concludes in December 2020.
Mr Johnson has also abandoned Mrs May’s idea of a close economic partnership, opting for a more distant relationship based on a Free Trade Agreement instead.

Will Brexit affect my travel plans?
After Brexit, the UK will enter a transition period, where many agreements between Britain and Europe will remain the same. This means that all travel arrangements and holidays between January 31 and December 31, 2020, will be unaffected.
British citizens will not need a visa to travel to EU countries, but the European Commission has said that from 2021, travellers will need to apply for an ETIAS (European Travel Information and Authorisation System) visa waiver. Similar to an American ESTA, this is expected to cost around £6 and will be valid for several years.
Ferries, cruise ships, coaches and trains are all expected to operate as normal after Brexit, but some travellers could face delays at EU airports, should British passport holders be processed differently.
The latest advice from the UK government states that British travellers planning to visit the EU beyond January 31 should have a passport with at least six months of validity left after the document ceases to permit unrestricted travel across the EU.
Meanwhile, ABTA has said that UK citizens, who have a full driving licence and wish to drive within the EU, will not need an additional licence. However, an international driving permit will be required in certain countries and those who wish to drive their own vehicle will need to carry a Green Card in order for UK car insurance to be applicable.
Fortunately, the Government has suggested that it intends to keep the European Health Insurance Cards (EHIC), which provide free or reduced-cost medical treatment in EU countries, or a similar health scheme after Brexit.


Well-Known Member
Done deal now! In fact with the UK law now taking precedence, if the EU stalls over the exit deal, they cannot unilaterally extend it as EU law will not usurp UK law any more after 11 pm on 31st January 2020. So if Boris says he's off, then there's nothing they can do about it.

Meaning, that we could still exit EU on December 31st 2020 with no deal at all if the EU messes up the exit terms.

The SNP have picked a real charmer in Ian Blackford as their main spokesman in the UK parliament too, he's a shocker in the house of commons, someone needs to give him a nudge as the record is stuck.

The remoaners forget why the leavers voted, it wasn't about deals, economics or trade, it was about democracy and sovereignty. Yet these remoaners continually bang on about the money and economics side of things. We don't care about these things per se, we want autonomy and, UK law and parliament to be our sovereignty. So we will never regret it 1, 2 or even 20 years down the line if we lose a deal here or there along the way.
Last edited:


Well-Known Member
With one less greedy level of govmint to support, I'm pretty sure the UK will be better off economically when out of the E.U. That will also give the UK a leg up in terms of competition for trade among the nations.
Absolutely! These treacherous, treasonous remainers who want us to stay are continually downplaying the UK as a world trader and 5th richest country in the world. They say we can't do anything for ourselves any more and we'll only be doing deals with 3rd world countries as that is about our strength and limit.

Actually, that is what the remainers wish for our country after we had the cheek to vote to leave the EU. They would love us to fail just so they can say we told you so, now let's get back in the EU tomorrow.

We won't fail, onward and upwards after 31st January 2020.


Well-Known Member
Absolutely! These treacherous, treasonous remainers who want us to stay are continually downplaying the UK as a world trader and 5th richest country in the world. They say we can't do anything for ourselves any more and we'll only be doing deals with 3rd world countries as that is about our strength and limit.

Actually, that is what the remainers wish for our country after we had the cheek to vote to leave the EU. They would love us to fail just so they can say we told you so, now let's get back in the EU tomorrow.

We won't fail, onward and upwards after 31st January 2020.
Yes agree TheRedeemed.

Tall Timbers

Imperfect but forgiven
U.S. Treasury Secretary: Post-Brexit Trade Deal to Be Inked by End of Year

The Treasury Secretary of the United States, Steve Mnuchin, said that the Trump administration expects to sign a post-Brexit trade deal with the United Kingdom by the end of this year.

At the World Economic Forum in Davos, Mr Mnuchin said that an Anglo-American trade deal is “an absolute priority” for President Donald Trump, further cementing Boris Johnson’s negotiating position with the European Union.

“What I saw coming out was that they wanted to accomplish both these deals in 2020. That’s obviously an aggressive timetable,” the Treasury secretary said per the BBC.

“That’s an absolute priority of President Trump and we expect to complete that with them this year, which we think will be great for them and great for us,” he added.

In modern times the USA and the UK have had each other's backs. I reckon that close relationship will continue. Militarily, I don't believe there is a closer relationship in terms of trust as that which the USA and UK enjoy... While I was in the US Air Force, this unique relationship with the UK was quite noticeable.
Last edited:


Well-Known Member
Inching ever closer, Boris has signed brexit withdrawal agreement and the eu leaders have signed it as well, voted on 29th Jan by the European parliament. Looks like this long drawn out affair and thread will end soon, will post more tomorrow and the few days ahead phew.


Well-Known Member
The US wants to agree a post-Brexit trade deal with the UK this year, the country's treasury secretary has said.

After meeting Chancellor Sajid Javid in London, Steve Mnuchin said he believed the UK could negotiate trade deals with the US and EU at the same time.

"I'm quite optimistic," he told a Chatham House think tank event.

After Brexit happens on 31 January, the UK will be free to negotiate and sign new trade deals with countries with no existing EU deals - like the US.

At the same time, the UK will also be negotiating a free trade deal with the EU to ensure that UK goods are not subject to tariffs and other trade barriers once the Brexit transition period ends on 31 December.

Let the negotiations begin.


Well-Known Member
Business leaders have welcomed what they call a clarification of the government's view that there would be "no alignment" with EU rules in a post-Brexit trade deal with the EU.

Chancellor Sajid Javid said the UK would use the power to diverge from Europe only when it was in the interests of business.

Concerned businesses had questioned him at the World Economic Forum.

His words, just six days ago, caused shockwaves for British industry.

Businesses had assumed the UK would stay closely connected to European rules and standards, where industry needed it.

Answering questions from UK chief executives at a Davos lunch, Mr Javid said that although the UK could not be a rule taker, for democratic reasons, "it doesn't mean we will diverge for the sake of it".

Business group the CBI welcomed the clarification that there could be scope for continued alignment for the car or chemicals industry.

"It's good to have clarification that in terms of divergence from the EU, that will be when it is in the economic interests of the country. It is not an obligation, it's a right we can use if we need to use it," the CBI chief Carolyn Fairbairn, host of the lunch, told the BBC.

Other attendees said they had made clear to the chancellor that unnecessarily introducing friction into manufacturing supply chains would reduce, not increase investment spending.

The chancellor dialled in to a key cabinet committee meeting on post Brexit-trade strategy just after the lunch.

The purpose of such freedoms is to help the government forge new trade deals with, for example, the US.


Well-Known Member
Boris has marked the historic signing of the Brexit Withdrawal Agreement with a smiling picture of himself flanked by Union Jack flags.

The Prime Minister posted a picture of himself, pen in hand with the flags behind him, signing the agreement ahead of Britain’s departure from the EU next week.

He wrote: “Today I have signed the Withdrawal Agreement for the UK to leave the EU on January 31st, honouring the democratic mandate of the British people.

“This signature heralds a new chapter in our nation’s history.”

Predictably, the PM’s triumphant tweet garnered a mixed response, with some praising his tenacity in delivering Britain’s departure from Europe, while others were more critical.

Chrissie Grech wrote: “You've just signed away your country's prosperity, and all to please your oligarch chums. #NotMyBrexit #NotMyPM”, while Henry Lynn tweeted: “Today you have signed an agreement that has no tangible benefits. You've done it on the back of newspapers blaming the EU and immigration for the problems in the country, primarily the lack of investment in the North, by the Tories. Never have so many people been conned by so few.”

Well your bound to get some people that will remain negative.


Well-Known Member
Yet Sue P wrote: “Thank you Boris. As part of the establishment you must have realised the vitriol that would be thrown at you when you campaigned for leave, huge respect to you for sticking with it and delivering on your promise. Here’s to a great independent future for the U.K.”

Ribble Valley MP Nigel Evans wrote: “Let the healing begin...”

At least some are being positive.