1 Thess 4:13-16

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alrdyreg

Active Member
13But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:


ok so now we have this problem. (not really a problem but you know what i mean)

if we die and go directly to Heaven then what do you make of the bolded text?

those which are asleep in Jesus. so when we die do we go directly to Jesus or do we fall asleep until the second resurrection (rapture)?

now hear this. when you sleep you have no concet of time. sleeping for 8 hours seems like 2 minutes. could this be true for the dead after Christ? those who died in 100AD have no idea its been 1900 years since they died.


i LOVE GODS WORD! its so fun to just sit down and discuss topics peacfully that have nothing to do with salvation. if i believe that we sleep until the second resurrection and you dont we are still going to heaven!!!
 
BigJer

BigJer

Member
We think in terms of time being linear...

God inhabits eternity, meaning He is outside of time alltogether. Those who have fallen asleep in Christ are present with the Lord, right? They are therefore now outside of time as we know it too. In otherwords, when the rapture happens the dead in Christ from history past and until the rapture will turn around and say, "Wow...I just died and the Raptured happened at the same time".

This is of course my conjecture of the event based on the advances in quantum physics over the recent years.
 
A

Abiding In Him

New Member
Amen Chris...... We do not soul sleep until the rapture...Believers go immediately to be with the Lord when they die.

http://www.bible.org/qa.php?topic_id=73&qa_id=242
Question:
Where do Church Age believers go when they die?

Answer:
Old Testament saints went to a place called Abraham’s bosom, which apparently refers to a paradise for Old Testament believers at the time of their death (cf. Luke 23:43; 2 Cor. 12:4). This was a heavenly place, but evidently not directly in God’s presence because Jesus had not yet died for sin to give access directly into God’s presence. If you recall, right after Christ’s death on the cross, one of the phenomena that occurred was the rending of the veil to show the way into God’s presence had been opened. It is through Christ’s sacrificial death that we are given access to God with the barrier of sin removed (Eph. 2:18; 3:12; Heb. 4:16; 10:19, 35). In anticipation of His death and the immediate access it would give to the presence of God, Jesus promised the thief on the cross that “today you will be with me in paradise” (Luke. 23:43).

Today, during the Church Age, believers go directly into the presence of God in heaven. This is evident in several passages. In Philippians 1:23 Paul wrote, “But I am hard-pressed from both directions, having the desire to depart and be with Christ, for that is very much better.” Where is Christ today? He is seated at the right hand of God in heaven (Eph. 1:20). Logically then, to be with Christ after death is to also be in heaven. So likewise, if “to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord” (2 Cor. 5), death means to be in heaven with the Lord, though without our glorified bodies which wait until the resurrection when soul will be joined together with a glorified, resurrected body.
 
BuzzardHut

BuzzardHut

Bird Mod
alrdyreg said:
this isnt an end times question.

its a where do christians go when they die.
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They go straight to heaven to be with Jesus.

To us here they look like they are asleep, thats why we have a wake.

Keep watching them and they start to decay.

Next thing you know they are rocking in a chair and we are wearing wigs chasing people around trying to take a shower.

Best to let them 'sleep'

We do not teach soul sleep, they are fully awake with Jesus.
 
ub4war

ub4war

bond servant of Christ
At the time of the Rapture of the church, those whose spirits have departed will be rejoined with resurrection bodies, perfected versions of their previous ones. This is what Paul meant when he talked about the dead in Christ rising first. At the same time we who are still alive will experience a sudden change as our physical bodies are perfected (1 Cor. 15:51-52) and we'll all arrive at the Throne of God together to begin our eternal lives with Him.


GREAT Answer
 
A

alrdyreg

Active Member
i know we dont teach soul sleep.

i never said we do. but some chrsitians believe that we dont go immidiatly to heaven. but since we died we have no concep of time so its like someone said earlier. i died and the rapture happened all at the same time.
 
Chris

Chris

Administrator
Staff member
alrdyreg said:
i know we dont teach soul sleep.

i never said we do. but some chrsitians believe that we dont go immidiatly to heaven. but since we died we have no concep of time so its like someone said earlier. i died and the rapture happened all at the same time.
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I know. :hug2: I'm just going to post this link for those that are just lurking and looking for answers. I think it might be helpful. :)

Soul Sleep
Ask a Bible Teacher

http://www.gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/soul-sleep
 
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AnyDayNow

New Member
alrdyreg said:
13But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:


ok so now we have this problem. (not really a problem but you know what i mean)

if we die and go directly to Heaven then what do you make of the bolded text?

those which are asleep in Jesus. so when we die do we go directly to Jesus or do we fall asleep until the second resurrection (rapture)?
...
Click to expand...

The souls of those who have died in Jesus prior to the rapture are in Jesus (verse 14 above) (positionally we are already there, as we are said to have been seated in the heavenlies...where Jesus is seated on the Father's throne, at the Father's right hand), Who (in turn) is in heaven at the time of the rapture. It's easy to forget that the soul is the essence of our being, not our physical bodies. When we die physically, Paul describes the time we spend with our souls detached from our bodies as "nakedness". Paul longed to go straight from being clothed with a physical body to being clothed with a heavenly body, avoiding that "nakedness". In other words, Paul longed for the rapture.

The words, "and God will bring with Him" (again verse 14) those who have previously died refers to the souls of those dead Church saints being brought to the rapture to be reunited with their physical/changed to deathless bodies. Those dead bodies will have to be reconstituted and changed before the soul can re-enter. That's what happens at the rapture.

Short answer: When Church saints die, their soul goes to heaven and remains in Christ. When the rapture occurs, the soul is brought back to be reunited with a deathless body.

Old Testament saints' souls are not in Christ, they are in Abraham's bosum. In Revelation, souls of those saints martyred during the tribulation period are under the altar, awaiting their resurrection at the end of the tribulation period (along with the OT saints), when their number is completed. Whenever a resurrection (of the order as described by Paul in 1 Cor 15) occurs, a soul is reunited with a body.
 
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