Children & The Rapture

glc11

Well-Known Member
I accept the bible's position on the age of accountability but after examining the human standard for a human brain to be fully developed and maturity to make decisions based on studies I found that those results are in agreement with your findings based on the scriptures you cited.

At What Age Is The Brain Fully Developed?

It is widely debated as to which age the brain is considered “fully mature” or developed. In the past, many experts believed that the brain may have been done developing in the mid to late teens. Then along came some evidence to suggest that development may last until at least age 20. These days, a consensus of neuroscientists agree that brain development likely persists until at least the mid-20s – possibly until the 30s.

The fact that our brains aren’t developed until the mid 20s means that “legal adults” (those age 18+) are allowed to make adult decisions, without fully mature brains. Someone who is 18 may make riskier decisions than someone in their mid-20s in part due to lack of experience, but primarily due to an underdeveloped brain. All behaviors and experiences you endure until the age of 25 have potential to impact your developing brain.

https://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/02/18/at-what-age-is-the-brain-fully-developed/
I have no idea when the age of accountability is, but I do find this interesting as it relates to a funny thing I like to say to my kids right now.

My husband and I have four teenagers! We went to a parenting class recently at the church and one of the teachers was saying that the prefrontal cortex does not start to develop until age 25 and is done by about 30. They were applying humor and saying “so when your kid freaks out and does dumb things…. Remember… ‘no prefrontal cortex”!

So now my kids just love it when we get in a debate about anything and I love to jokingly remind them about how I have a prefrontal cortex and they don’t !!

This is a description:

This brain region has been implicated in executive functions, such as planning, decision making, short-term memory, personality expression, moderating social behavior and controlling certain aspects of speech and language.[4][5][6] Executive function relates to abilities to differentiate among conflicting thoughts, determine good and bad, better and best, same and different, future consequences of current activities, working toward a defined goal, prediction of outcomes, expectation based on actions, and social "control" (the ability to suppress urges that, if not suppressed, could lead to socially unacceptable outcomes).
 

daygo

Well-Known Member
I have no idea when the age of accountability is, but I do find this interesting as it relates to a funny thing I like to say to my kids right now.

My husband and I have four teenagers! We went to a parenting class recently at the church and one of the teachers was saying that the prefrontal cortex does not start to develop until age 25 and is done by about 30. They were applying humor and saying “so when your kid freaks out and does dumb things…. Remember… ‘no prefrontal cortex”!

So now my kids just love it when we get in a debate about anything and I love to jokingly remind them about how I have a prefrontal cortex and they don’t !!

This is a description:

This brain region has been implicated in executive functions, such as planning, decision making, short-term memory, personality expression, moderating social behavior and controlling certain aspects of speech and language.[4][5][6] Executive function relates to abilities to differentiate among conflicting thoughts, determine good and bad, better and best, same and different, future consequences of current activities, working toward a defined goal, prediction of outcomes, expectation based on actions, and social "control" (the ability to suppress urges that, if not suppressed, could lead to socially unacceptable outcomes).
Romans 7 speaks of it but what age is debatable at moment imo its about 14 yrs old.
 

Wings Like Eagles

Well-Known Member
No one is disputing that babies and children will not go to heaven when they die.

The article points out the truth that the Bible teaches the rapture is for the church.
This discussion of who goes in the Rapture likely depends on how you interpret 1 Corinthians 15:23. The wording in all of the translations is that, when Christ comes, "all who belong to Him will be raised when He comes back". The very next verse says, "After that, the end will come..." The Rapture seems to be what is being referenced in verse 23 because verse 24 is likely speaking of the Day of the Lord judgment. Do not babies and children "belong to Christ" in their innocence? That is what Jesus indicated in His defense of them and their position in heaven before the throne of God. We are not saved, nor are we subject to the Rapture by knowledge of the truth (otherwise, the demons would be saved--see James 2:19). We are saved and belong to Him when He, in His great mercy, forgives our sin through the Blood of Christ. Babies and children, also belong to Him. There does not appear to be a reason to exclude them from God's mercy of the Rapture. The point could be moot, however, because, if the Lord tarries much longer, there may not be any babies born by the time that Jesus returns for His own. The fertility rate is dropping like a stone everywhere in the world.
 

Epieikes

Active Member
I have no idea when the age of accountability is, but I do find this interesting as it relates to a funny thing I like to say to my kids right now.

My husband and I have four teenagers! We went to a parenting class recently at the church and one of the teachers was saying that the prefrontal cortex does not start to develop until age 25 and is done by about 30. They were applying humor and saying “so when your kid freaks out and does dumb things…. Remember… ‘no prefrontal cortex”!

So now my kids just love it when we get in a debate about anything and I love to jokingly remind them about how I have a prefrontal cortex and they don’t !!

This is a description:

This brain region has been implicated in executive functions, such as planning, decision making, short-term memory, personality expression, moderating social behavior and controlling certain aspects of speech and language.[4][5][6] Executive function relates to abilities to differentiate among conflicting thoughts, determine good and bad, better and best, same and different, future consequences of current activities, working toward a defined goal, prediction of outcomes, expectation based on actions, and social "control" (the ability to suppress urges that, if not suppressed, could lead to socially unacceptable outcomes).
Love this! And yes, let's ante the age even higher...for when my husband returned to Asbury Seminary for postgraduate work in 2003, I was blessed to get to sit in on an anthropology class taught by the amazing Dr. Darrell Whiteman. Having spent considerable time spreading the Gospel among the people of Papua New Guinea and beyond, he said that he was convinced, from his research, that the "age of adulthood" among cultures has a consensus of 37 years. He didn't go into major detail, and for certain, it could be debated until the cows come home, but he shared that many life-maturing events (having/raising children, loss of a parent, massive career decisions or changes, etc.) have often had time to happen by 37. Guess how old I was that year...feeling the love at last, trying to navigate community life with peers 5-10 years younger, thinking they had everything figured out and happily content to smalltalk about kids, hair, and weather!

Just ONE more reason to love our omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent Yahweh, the great-and-unfathomable Lover of our Souls! If we wonder why Heaven won't be boring, I think we've discovered the answer. #EndlessQuestionsAnswered
 

Palehorse

Member
So I’ve categorized a bunch of responses into “buckets” of similar talking points, and apologize upfront for the length.

1. As for the “age of accountability” issue based on accepted marital age norms in ancient Israel and those of an age to make a decision FOR the Lord (I think 8 years of age was mentioned in the initial Left Behind thread), all of those are frankly, irrelevant. None of that is mentioned in Scripture. The only age mentioned as a dividing point is the age of 20. Again, not my opinion, simply going on what Scripture does say about it.

2. Just because the age of accountability is 20, doesn’t mean we shouldn’t teach our children about the Lord. We should raise our children up with the knowledge of the Lord and of our common salvation.

3. I believe the Chick tracts predate the Left Behind series, and possibly even the “Thief in the Night” movie of the seventies, as showing children being taken up at the Rapture.

4. As to children of believers vs. non-believers, we could all agree that all of us are born with sin natures. But children who die before that age (and God doesn’t always shield children from the first death) are, as mentioned in my original argument, given a certain status of innocence (unwarranted mercy). This is in light of the reality they couldn’t in full cognizance make a decision for or against the Lord. If God’s justice is perfect, and it is, then this fact could not be overlooked. IOW, if we humans can come to that reasonable conclusion about accountability, how much more must God since He designed us this way?

5. Children raptured vs. children born after the Rapture. First, the only mention of children inside the 70th Week, are of those who are not yet born and up to breastfeeding age (Matt. 24:19). So my conclusion is that all children are taken at the Rapture, given that all children are given this same status of innocence, and that God is longsuffering that none should perish, leaving the world not only Christian-less (true Christians), but also childless (for a certain period of time). Eventually, even inside the 70th Week, there are those who get pregnant but their children will not reach the age of accountability or anywhere near it, before the Second Coming. And this status of innocence also lends credence should their parents put a mark of the beast on them (obviously without their ability to contest or refuse it), they’re already covered as innocents.

6. Death of children in previous calamities. I made a point in my first post to differentiate between the two (the first death and the second) as being monumentally different. I believe all the children who perished in Noah’s flood, are redeemed now. Same with those in Lot’s day. FTR, in Sodom, there is no mention of children there either, it simply says in Gen 19:4 " the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both old and young, all the people from every quarter, surrounded the house."

Since Creation, there has been the death of children. There are those who have died in abortions, the holocaust, child sacrifices to Molech and Ba’al, and those who die from any number of horrible things...the first death comes to all mankind. Where God’s mercy steps in, for those who cannot make a decision or have not yet reached the only age the bible gives us (the age of 20) is again, given this status of innocence.

7. As TallTimbers mentioned, God will do what's right (Gen. 18:25). I believe we can see that consistently throughout scriptures, where children are afforded a special status (Matt. 19:14). We might think the age of 20 is too old, based on older times and customs, but the ONLY age we see in Scripture, is again, the age of 20. Just think back to how foolish you were when you were 15, or 18. I know I certainly was. But God!
 

crunchymama

Well-Known Member
So I’ve categorized a bunch of responses into “buckets” of similar talking points, and apologize upfront for the length.

1. As for the “age of accountability” issue based on accepted marital age norms in ancient Israel and those of an age to make a decision FOR the Lord (I think 8 years of age was mentioned in the initial Left Behind thread), all of those are frankly, irrelevant. None of that is mentioned in Scripture. The only age mentioned as a dividing point is the age of 20. Again, not my opinion, simply going on what Scripture does say about it.

2. Just because the age of accountability is 20, doesn’t mean we shouldn’t teach our children about the Lord. We should raise our children up with the knowledge of the Lord and of our common salvation.

3. I believe the Chick tracts predate the Left Behind series, and possibly even the “Thief in the Night” movie of the seventies, as showing children being taken up at the Rapture.

4. As to children of believers vs. non-believers, we could all agree that all of us are born with sin natures. But children who die before that age (and God doesn’t always shield children from the first death) are, as mentioned in my original argument, given a certain status of innocence (unwarranted mercy). This is in light of the reality they couldn’t in full cognizance make a decision for or against the Lord. If God’s justice is perfect, and it is, then this fact could not be overlooked. IOW, if we humans can come to that reasonable conclusion about accountability, how much more must God since He designed us this way?

5. Children raptured vs. children born after the Rapture. First, the only mention of children inside the 70th Week, are of those who are not yet born and up to breastfeeding age (Matt. 24:19). So my conclusion is that all children are taken at the Rapture, given that all children are given this same status of innocence, and that God is longsuffering that none should perish, leaving the world not only Christian-less (true Christians), but also childless (for a certain period of time). Eventually, even inside the 70th Week, there are those who get pregnant but their children will not reach the age of accountability or anywhere near it, before the Second Coming. And this status of innocence also lends credence should their parents put a mark of the beast on them (obviously without their ability to contest or refuse it), they’re already covered as innocents.

6. Death of children in previous calamities. I made a point in my first post to differentiate between the two (the first death and the second) as being monumentally different. I believe all the children who perished in Noah’s flood, are redeemed now. Same with those in Lot’s day. FTR, in Sodom, there is no mention of children there either, it simply says in Gen 19:4 " the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both old and young, all the people from every quarter, surrounded the house."

Since Creation, there has been the death of children. There are those who have died in abortions, the holocaust, child sacrifices to Molech and Ba’al, and those who die from any number of horrible things...the first death comes to all mankind. Where God’s mercy steps in, for those who cannot make a decision or have not yet reached the only age the bible gives us (the age of 20) is again, given this status of innocence.

7. As TallTimbers mentioned, God will do what's right (Gen. 18:25). I believe we can see that consistently throughout scriptures, where children are afforded a special status (Matt. 19:14). We might think the age of 20 is too old, based on older times and customs, but the ONLY age we see in Scripture, is again, the age of 20. Just think back to how foolish you were when you were 15, or 18. I know I certainly was. But God!
And children were not required to make animal sacrifices for sin in the OT.
 

crunchymama

Well-Known Member
I’m also not convinced it’s 20. I think maybe, at one point, sure.

..but as we near the end..

That age has gone significantly lower. As children now have access to the internet in the palm of their hands. I fully believe that the fruit on the back of the phone with a bite out of it is coming full circle.

Porn alone is rampant and CHILDREN easily access this if they have phones. I do believe that Satan uses this once again for his gain. I think the most recent study I read was that a high percentage of 8-9 year olds have seen and/or regularly access.
This makes me sad for many reasons, but just because they have blatant access to sin does not mean they understand it. In fact, you could argue being surrounded by sin makes it more difficult to understand it. An 8yo may access porn (Oh Lord Jesus :sob ) but they literally cannot understand what it is and what it means, even if they purposely watch it every day.

A different example- In the homeschooling community it is common for young elementary age kids to do school work several years ahead of their current age. But at some point, they stop and hit a wall. There are certain topics they just cannot do- advanced algebra, certain critical thinking assignments. Of course there are a very small handful of geniuses, but for the most part they have to get older and let their brains catch up.
 

daygo

Well-Known Member
So I’ve categorized a bunch of responses into “buckets” of similar talking points, and apologize upfront for the length.

1. As for the “age of accountability” issue based on accepted marital age norms in ancient Israel and those of an age to make a decision FOR the Lord (I think 8 years of age was mentioned in the initial Left Behind thread), all of those are frankly, irrelevant. None of that is mentioned in Scripture. The only age mentioned as a dividing point is the age of 20. Again, not my opinion, simply going on what Scripture does say about it.

2. Just because the age of accountability is 20, doesn’t mean we shouldn’t teach our children about the Lord. We should raise our children up with the knowledge of the Lord and of our common salvation.

3. I believe the Chick tracts predate the Left Behind series, and possibly even the “Thief in the Night” movie of the seventies, as showing children being taken up at the Rapture.

4. As to children of believers vs. non-believers, we could all agree that all of us are born with sin natures. But children who die before that age (and God doesn’t always shield children from the first death) are, as mentioned in my original argument, given a certain status of innocence (unwarranted mercy). This is in light of the reality they couldn’t in full cognizance make a decision for or against the Lord. If God’s justice is perfect, and it is, then this fact could not be overlooked. IOW, if we humans can come to that reasonable conclusion about accountability, how much more must God since He designed us this way?

5. Children raptured vs. children born after the Rapture. First, the only mention of children inside the 70th Week, are of those who are not yet born and up to breastfeeding age (Matt. 24:19). So my conclusion is that all children are taken at the Rapture, given that all children are given this same status of innocence, and that God is longsuffering that none should perish, leaving the world not only Christian-less (true Christians), but also childless (for a certain period of time). Eventually, even inside the 70th Week, there are those who get pregnant but their children will not reach the age of accountability or anywhere near it, before the Second Coming. And this status of innocence also lends credence should their parents put a mark of the beast on them (obviously without their ability to contest or refuse it), they’re already covered as innocents.

6. Death of children in previous calamities. I made a point in my first post to differentiate between the two (the first death and the second) as being monumentally different. I believe all the children who perished in Noah’s flood, are redeemed now. Same with those in Lot’s day. FTR, in Sodom, there is no mention of children there either, it simply says in Gen 19:4 " the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both old and young, all the people from every quarter, surrounded the house."

Since Creation, there has been the death of children. There are those who have died in abortions, the holocaust, child sacrifices to Molech and Ba’al, and those who die from any number of horrible things...the first death comes to all mankind. Where God’s mercy steps in, for those who cannot make a decision or have not yet reached the only age the bible gives us (the age of 20) is again, given this status of innocence.

7. As TallTimbers mentioned, God will do what's right (Gen. 18:25). I believe we can see that consistently throughout scriptures, where children are afforded a special status (Matt. 19:14). We might think the age of 20 is too old, based on older times and customs, but the ONLY age we see in Scripture, is again, the age of 20. Just think back to how foolish you were when you were 15, or 18. I know I certainly was. But God!
Pete I agree on a lot of things and will think on these things as well. However given a choice when your 14 or 20 would you know what choice youve made eg if I hit someone or steal would I know what I am doing, would I know its wrong etc etc as well as that one of the stages of development happens around 14 where you are able to debate and to reason what, how when you do things etc. Hope this makes sense.
 

mattfivefour

Well-Known Member
Fascinating discussion. Lots of grist for the thought mill. But may I suggest one overarching thought? One foundation that should underpin everything we think on this subject. And that is this:

GOD IS GOOD!

As He, Himself, said to Moses: "The LORD, the LORD God, is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in loving devotion and faithfulness, maintaining loving devotion to a thousand generations, forgiving iniquity, transgression, and sin." (Exodus 34:6-8)

Or as the apostle John summarized: "God is love."

When Abraham looked the Lord in the face under the great trees of Mamre and said, "Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?" it was a rhetorical question. He knew the answer. And so should we, if we know God.

So, rest your heart on the truth that God is ultimate goodness, ultimate justice, ultimate righteousness, and ultimate love. Never let any thought on the subject of the eternal fate of little children (or any subject for which we cannot find a clear answer in Scripture) sit on any other foundation than that.

Glory to God!!!
 

Palehorse

Member
Pete I agree on a lot of things and will think on these things as well. However given a choice when your 14 or 20 would you know what choice youve made eg if I hit someone or steal would I know what I am doing, would I know its wrong etc etc as well as that one of the stages of development happens around 14 where you are able to debate and to reason what, how when you do things etc. Hope this makes sense.
I wholeheartedly agree and endorse what MattFiveFour says. Right on absolutely. There are numerous topics we could pick that we simply don't have the clearest answer to in Scripture. However, when we look at the nature of God, and the consistent pattern He shows us about Himself, I rest easy on my position. To Daygo's point about the difference in 14 vs. 20, I still go with what Scripture says and the Bible uses 20 as the dividing age.
 

glc11

Well-Known Member
I wholeheartedly agree and endorse what MattFiveFour says. Right on absolutely. There are numerous topics we could pick that we simply don't have the clearest answer to in Scripture. However, when we look at the nature of God, and the consistent pattern He shows us about Himself, I rest easy on my position. To Daygo's point about the difference in 14 vs. 20, I still go with what Scripture says and the Bible uses 20 as the dividing age.
As a mom with four teenagers who always was told that ages 12-14 are when they are accountable….. please tell me where in scripture it shows that 20 is the dividing age???! Very interested!

I have done my best to raise them up to know the Lord, but as stated already:

-surrounded by so much sin everywhere in this immoral country! Such a confused generation
-no “prefrontal cortex “ ( hahaha! Lol! Had to say it!)

I do seriously want to open my Bible and find where the dividing age is 20!!!!! Sincere question.

And I know there is no sure fire black and white answer. I agree with the others who said “God will do what is right”
I just never heard about “20”

This is a great thread.
 

Palehorse

Member
As a mom with four teenagers who always was told that ages 12-14 are when they are accountable….. please tell me where in scripture it shows that 20 is the dividing age???! Very interested!

I have done my best to raise them up to know the Lord, but as stated already:

-surrounded by so much sin everywhere in this immoral country! Such a confused generation
-no “prefrontal cortex “ ( hahaha! Lol! Had to say it!)

I do seriously want to open my Bible and find where the dividing age is 20!!!!! Sincere question.

And I know there is no sure fire black and white answer. I agree with the others who said “God will do what is right”
I just never heard about “20”

This is a great thread.
Well, my initial go to verse was in Exodus 30, where those under 20 did not have to pay a ransom tax:

Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying: 12 “When you take the census of the children of Israel for their number, then every man shall give a ransom for himself to the Lord, when you number them, that there may be no plague among them when you number them. 13 This is what everyone among those who are numbered shall give: half a shekel according to the shekel of the sanctuary (a shekel is twenty gerahs). The half-shekel shall be an offering to the Lord. 14 Everyone included among those who are numbered, from twenty years old and above, shall give an offering to the Lord. 15 The rich shall not give more and the poor shall not give less than half a shekel, when you give an offering to the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves. 16 And you shall take the atonement money of the children of Israel, and shall appoint it for the service of the tabernacle of meeting, that it may be a memorial for the children of Israel before the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves.” (Ex. 30:11-16)

Remember, at this point in human history, mankind's lifespans were normalized pretty much to where we are today (as opposed to the days before the flood when people lived for centuries).

The second place is in Numbers, where God essentially cursed that unbelieving generation who were in the wilderness. Only those 20 and younger could enter into the Promised Land (along with Joshua and Caleb)

Surely none of the men who came up from Egypt, from twenty years old and above, shall see the land of which I swore to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, because they have not wholly followed Me, 12 except Caleb the son of Jephunneh, the Kenizzite, and Joshua the son of Nun, for they have wholly followed the Lord.’ (Num. 32:11-12)

Also, throughout the Pentateuch, the age at which a census of the people was taken, was 20. The age at which one could go to war was 20. The age at which burnt offerings were to be offered, was 20.

This is really the only place in Scripture that gives a specific age for anything relating to innocence vs. culpability I've found.

Hope this helps.
 

glc11

Well-Known Member
Well, my initial go to verse was in Exodus 30, where those under 20 did not have to pay a ransom tax:

Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying: 12 “When you take the census of the children of Israel for their number, then every man shall give a ransom for himself to the Lord, when you number them, that there may be no plague among them when you number them. 13 This is what everyone among those who are numbered shall give: half a shekel according to the shekel of the sanctuary (a shekel is twenty gerahs). The half-shekel shall be an offering to the Lord. 14 Everyone included among those who are numbered, from twenty years old and above, shall give an offering to the Lord. 15 The rich shall not give more and the poor shall not give less than half a shekel, when you give an offering to the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves. 16 And you shall take the atonement money of the children of Israel, and shall appoint it for the service of the tabernacle of meeting, that it may be a memorial for the children of Israel before the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves.” (Ex. 30:11-16)

Remember, at this point in human history, mankind's lifespans were normalized pretty much to where we are today (as opposed to the days before the flood when people lived for centuries).

The second place is in Numbers, where God essentially cursed that unbelieving generation who were in the wilderness. Only those 20 and younger could enter into the Promised Land (along with Joshua and Caleb)

Surely none of the men who came up from Egypt, from twenty years old and above, shall see the land of which I swore to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, because they have not wholly followed Me, 12 except Caleb the son of Jephunneh, the Kenizzite, and Joshua the son of Nun, for they have wholly followed the Lord.’ (Num. 32:11-12)

Also, throughout the Pentateuch, the age at which a census of the people was taken, was 20. The age at which one could go to war was 20. The age at which burnt offerings were to be offered, was 20.

This is really the only place in Scripture that gives a specific age for anything relating to innocence vs. culpability I've found.

Hope this helps.
Thank you very much!!!!!
 

daygo

Well-Known Member
I wholeheartedly agree and endorse what MattFiveFour says. Right on absolutely. There are numerous topics we could pick that we simply don't have the clearest answer to in Scripture. However, when we look at the nature of God, and the consistent pattern He shows us about Himself, I rest easy on my position. To Daygo's point about the difference in 14 vs. 20, I still go with what Scripture says and the Bible uses 20 as the dividing age.
Yes agree Pete so do I, I still ask for wisdom and the Holy spirit and try my best to use common sense. Thanks for your input.
 

mattfivefour

Well-Known Member
Well, my initial go to verse was in Exodus 30, where those under 20 did not have to pay a ransom tax:

Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying: 12 “When you take the census of the children of Israel for their number, then every man shall give a ransom for himself to the Lord, when you number them, that there may be no plague among them when you number them. 13 This is what everyone among those who are numbered shall give: half a shekel according to the shekel of the sanctuary (a shekel is twenty gerahs). The half-shekel shall be an offering to the Lord. 14 Everyone included among those who are numbered, from twenty years old and above, shall give an offering to the Lord. 15 The rich shall not give more and the poor shall not give less than half a shekel, when you give an offering to the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves. 16 And you shall take the atonement money of the children of Israel, and shall appoint it for the service of the tabernacle of meeting, that it may be a memorial for the children of Israel before the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves.” (Ex. 30:11-16)

Remember, at this point in human history, mankind's lifespans were normalized pretty much to where we are today (as opposed to the days before the flood when people lived for centuries).

The second place is in Numbers, where God essentially cursed that unbelieving generation who were in the wilderness. Only those 20 and younger could enter into the Promised Land (along with Joshua and Caleb)

Surely none of the men who came up from Egypt, from twenty years old and above, shall see the land of which I swore to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, because they have not wholly followed Me, 12 except Caleb the son of Jephunneh, the Kenizzite, and Joshua the son of Nun, for they have wholly followed the Lord.’ (Num. 32:11-12)

Also, throughout the Pentateuch, the age at which a census of the people was taken, was 20. The age at which one could go to war was 20. The age at which burnt offerings were to be offered, was 20.

This is really the only place in Scripture that gives a specific age for anything relating to innocence vs. culpability I've found.

Hope this helps.
I agree with you, Pete. As I studied Scripture, I more and more came to this understanding ... as a generalization.

That said, I do think each individual, as a specific case, may --possibly-- come to a place of accountability at a different chronological age prior to that. 20 may be correct and it is a comfort for some parents, but since God alone knows the heart He alone can rightly judge when an individual has reached an age where he or she is accountable before Him.

So, again we all must lean on the truth expressed by Abraham-- surely the Judge of all the earth shall do right. Amen! Therefore, when it comes to this and other difficult and disturbing questions, I often find myself quoting from an old hymn: "I rest on His unchanging grace."
 

Reunionroundthecorner

Well-Known Member
As someone who has a daughter who was born into eternity (stillborn), this topic was on my mind. I once read a discussion on this topic on this site a while ago (before I joined) and someone's stance was that babies in the womb were sinners and wouldn't be in the rapture. It greatly upset my grieving heart to the point I stopped reading the site for a while. So I would implore people discussing this topic to be mindful about those parents whose young children/babies are no longer living. I'm not saying make things up that aren't in the Bible, but just be careful on how you phrase things.

As for my thoughts, I think back to King David's baby son. I'm also now very confident I will be reunited with my daughter in the future, and happy to know she's reunited with her daddy. I agree wholeheartedly with @Palehorse
I have twins I miscarried in heaven CrunchyMama. I know, without a doubt, this is true. How do I know? Because Jesus, himself, said, "Suffer the little children to come unto me and hinder them not, for theirs in the Kingdom of Heaven." Matt 19:13. He also said in Matt 18:3 "Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the Kingdom of Heaven."

We may not know the mind of God BUT what we do know is God has never condemned anyone to hell (or separation from Him). Separation comes from a conscious choice to reject his son and his death for us. Knowingly rejecting God's ultimate sacrifice of His son is what condemns us. How can babies consciously reject Jesus? They can't and my God says the Kingdom of Heaven belongs to them. When you come to Jesus to surrender your life to him and accept him as your Lord and Saviour, do you come to him with all knowledge and maturity? No, you come to Him with "child-like" faith. That's what He accepts. No less, no more.

As far as the rapture thing........if He doesn't take the innocent, then why would he take us? Because he is faithful that promised. :)
 

Bethlehem57

Well-Known Member
Not to sound contrary (not my intent) but it's your opinion, versus the only age we have to work within Scripture. I know a lot of people want to link the age of 13 (Bar Mitzvah age) as being the age of accountability, but that age (13) is nowhere in Scripture.
I’m praying for our daughter who is 21, with the mind of a 14 year old. She accepted Christ and was baptized, but since she’s gotten older, she doesn’t want to go to church, pray or read the Bible. I am certain that He hears my prayers.
 

JoyJoyJoy

I Shall Not Be Moved
I’m praying for our daughter who is 21, with the mind of a 14 year old. She accepted Christ and was baptized, but since she’s gotten older, she doesn’t want to go to church, pray or read the Bible. I am certain that He hears my prayers.
My neice has several disabilities. Thankfully she is saved and loves Jesus. She is in her 40s now, but we went through some rough times with her. Keep praying, sister. God hears your prayers. Regardless of a person's intellect or mental disabilities, the Master can communicate with her.
 

Bethlehem57

Well-Known Member
My neice has several disabilities. Thankfully she is saved and loves Jesus. She is in her 40s now, but we went through some rough times with her. Keep praying, sister. God hears your prayers. Regardless of a person's intellect or mental disabilities, the Master can communicate with her.
I’m really needing your prayers today! Probably post in other topic, but ever notice how the devil works so hard on you when you get closer to the Lord by staying in His Word no matter the circumstances?
 
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