Tall Timbers
Imperfect but forgiven
Was anything that Elijah and Enoch were wearing get left behind?
left behind
- Thread starter Kaatje
- Start date
Kaatje
My soul waits for the Lord, and in His Word I hope
Elijahs mantle was left behind, from Enoch the Bible doesn’t say.
Tall Timbers
Imperfect but forgiven
Just his mantle. It was for Elisha to have. Elijah's mantle may have been the only thing he was wearing...
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Kaatje
My soul waits for the Lord, and in His Word I hope
Enoch? It was for Elisha, wasn’t it?
And I thought people in those days wore an undergarment and a mantle, but I could be wrong.
annieforjesus
Well-Known Member
Many years ago I had a friend who didn't believe in the pretrib rapture, she would say, oh you people who believe in that are just hoping to escape the bad times..,I imagine that some of you have been told that too, well , I would think of Luke 21:36, where it talks about being counted worthy of escape and I say, Yes l, And what is wrong with that?,,Nothing.. I wish I would have been more educated in the Word years ago, I wouldn't have been so insecure and would have been prepared to respond much stronger...but Yes, I have faith in God, and an so happy that I will be counted worthy of escape..not because of anything I have done, but because Christ paid it all.
Tall Timbers
Imperfect but forgiven
cavalier973
Well-Known Member
"...oh you people who believe in that are just hoping to escape the bad times..."
The Rapture is not a rescue, but a redeployment. God *cannot* judge the world in wrath while His Church is present. Check out what the angel told "righteous" Lot as he was literally dragging the man and his family from Sodom. 2 Thessalonians 2 says that the Restrainer has to remove himself before the PseudoChrist can be revealed.
Also, if we think about it, we would be a hindrance to God's full and complete judgement, because we (if we are obeying the Scriptures) intercede on behalf of governmental leaders. God has His plan, but He also responds to our prayers and petitions, and will stay His hand if we are asking Him to.
The Rapture is not a rescue, but a redeployment. God *cannot* judge the world in wrath while His Church is present. Check out what the angel told "righteous" Lot as he was literally dragging the man and his family from Sodom. 2 Thessalonians 2 says that the Restrainer has to remove himself before the PseudoChrist can be revealed.
Also, if we think about it, we would be a hindrance to God's full and complete judgement, because we (if we are obeying the Scriptures) intercede on behalf of governmental leaders. God has His plan, but He also responds to our prayers and petitions, and will stay His hand if we are asking Him to.
Jeff0818
New Member
For some reason the thought of our clothes “traveling” with us amuses me.
I just can’t get around the thought of my Levi’s jeans needing to go with me.....or some poor Christian that decided to dress up as a clown to entertain children. Imagine that? LOL
I just can’t get around the thought of my Levi’s jeans needing to go with me.....or some poor Christian that decided to dress up as a clown to entertain children. Imagine that? LOL
maryrae
Well-Known Member
The cloths that were left behind at the Lord's Resurrection were the burial cloths. His clothing, or at least some of it, was gambled on by the soldiers at the cross.
I have no Scripture to back this up, it's just personal opinion. I'm thinking that the eternal change that's coming for us will be so thorough that our natural clothes will be instantly evaporated, "swallowed up in victory" if you will.
I have no Scripture to back this up, it's just personal opinion. I'm thinking that the eternal change that's coming for us will be so thorough that our natural clothes will be instantly evaporated, "swallowed up in victory" if you will.
Umbrella Girl
Now we see through a glass, darkly; (1 Cor 13:12)
Hello there! New to the group and late to the discussion, but wanted to add my 2 cents' worth...
I believe it is entirely possible to remain unmarried in eternity, yet still retain our individual gender. A person's gender - and their marital status - are two entirely separate things, in my opinion.
I believe it is entirely possible to remain unmarried in eternity, yet still retain our individual gender. A person's gender - and their marital status - are two entirely separate things, in my opinion.
OutWest
Active Member
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● Rom 12:12a . . Be glad for all God is planning for you.
Christians unsure of their afterlife destination cannot, in all honesty and a good conscience, comply with the above. For all they know, God has outer darkness planned for them instead of a rapture. That's not something to be glad about.
● 1Pet 3:15 . . Be ready always to give an answer to every man that asks you a reason of the hope that is in you.
The koiné Greek word for "hope" in that passage is elpis (el-pece') which means expectation. In other words: elpis isn't wishful thinking, nor crossing your fingers; no, elpis is a confident kind of hope that looks forward to something that's in the bag, and fully expects to obtain it; ergo: elpis is an anticipating hope; viz: it doesn't pray for the best, while in the back of its mind dreading the worst.
When people aren't 110% sure what the afterlife has in store for them-- if there is even the slightest concern, or unease --they can't possibly comply with 1Pet 3:15 for the simple reason that the hope that is in them is the wrong kind of hope.
● Rom 12:12 . . Be joyful in hope
When people are praying for the best, while in the back of their mind dreading the worst, they have absolutely no cause for rejoicing; but they do have plenty of cause to fear the unknown.
Elpis hope is one of the three principal elements of Christianity (1Cor 13:13). It's also a calling. (Eph 4:4)
When people are lacking the kind of hope described by the Greek word elpis, then I believe it's safe to assume that they have not yet responded to God's call; or worse, He has not called them; and they will quite possibly be left behind.
_
● Rom 12:12a . . Be glad for all God is planning for you.
Christians unsure of their afterlife destination cannot, in all honesty and a good conscience, comply with the above. For all they know, God has outer darkness planned for them instead of a rapture. That's not something to be glad about.
● 1Pet 3:15 . . Be ready always to give an answer to every man that asks you a reason of the hope that is in you.
The koiné Greek word for "hope" in that passage is elpis (el-pece') which means expectation. In other words: elpis isn't wishful thinking, nor crossing your fingers; no, elpis is a confident kind of hope that looks forward to something that's in the bag, and fully expects to obtain it; ergo: elpis is an anticipating hope; viz: it doesn't pray for the best, while in the back of its mind dreading the worst.
When people aren't 110% sure what the afterlife has in store for them-- if there is even the slightest concern, or unease --they can't possibly comply with 1Pet 3:15 for the simple reason that the hope that is in them is the wrong kind of hope.
● Rom 12:12 . . Be joyful in hope
When people are praying for the best, while in the back of their mind dreading the worst, they have absolutely no cause for rejoicing; but they do have plenty of cause to fear the unknown.
Elpis hope is one of the three principal elements of Christianity (1Cor 13:13). It's also a calling. (Eph 4:4)
When people are lacking the kind of hope described by the Greek word elpis, then I believe it's safe to assume that they have not yet responded to God's call; or worse, He has not called them; and they will quite possibly be left behind.
_
maryrae
Well-Known Member
Oh outwest, I strongly disagree with you. Just because some Christians waiver in their "hope" does not mean that they are not truly believers. There are wonderful brothers & sisters in Christ who have lived under poor teaching as to the wonderful nature of their salvation. They are not lost, just poorly/wrongly taught. I expect to see them in Glory; my own father who has already passed, among them!
maryrae, I agree. We come to Christ with many affirmities, sicknesses, hurts and scars but also problems with faith or doubts, sometimes a false teaching we must correct, all kinds of things the Great Healer must deal with. But the people that stick with it overcoming these things will get their reward. I'm sure glad Jesus didn't say to me "You're to stupid to be saved" even though I sure was.
Luk_5:39 No man also having drunk old wine straightway desireth new: for he saith, The old is better. Sometime it takes a while for hope to grow-it's NEW. imo
Luk_5:39 No man also having drunk old wine straightway desireth new: for he saith, The old is better. Sometime it takes a while for hope to grow-it's NEW. imo
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OutWest
Active Member
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Well; I can hardly blame you. After all; I'm just another armchair expert. My interpretations shouldn't be assumed infallible and/or speaking for God ex cathedra.
The best thing to do is consult your pastor and see what he has to say; especially considering the gravity of this matter. I couldn't possibly imagine anyone more disappointed, nor more humiliated, than a Christian left behind at the rapture.
_
Well; I can hardly blame you. After all; I'm just another armchair expert. My interpretations shouldn't be assumed infallible and/or speaking for God ex cathedra.
The best thing to do is consult your pastor and see what he has to say; especially considering the gravity of this matter. I couldn't possibly imagine anyone more disappointed, nor more humiliated, than a Christian left behind at the rapture.
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Jan51
Well-Known Member
There will be no true Christians left behind at the rapture. The partial rapture theory is not accepted on this board. At the rapture, the church is caught up to meet the Lord in the air.
The dead rising first probably wont be noticeable unlike those who were alive and raptured, who will vanish in front of all, most likely leaving their clothes behind.
Many on this forum including myself believe all children under the age of accountability will also be raptured. I wont debate the age of accountability as there are other threads on this forum discussing this.
Most pastors I have met have a very limited knowledge in, or even believe in a pre trib rapture.
The best source of information on the rapture is His written Word.
ozaprah
Active Member
Outwest,
Given that there is a Crown of Righteousness for those who long for his appearing (ie: reward at Bema seat judgement) it by definition means there are many believers who aren't longing for his appearance. They are still believers. All believers go in the rapture, be they mature, milk, or carnal. Such is the grace and mercy of God.
Given that there is a Crown of Righteousness for those who long for his appearing (ie: reward at Bema seat judgement) it by definition means there are many believers who aren't longing for his appearance. They are still believers. All believers go in the rapture, be they mature, milk, or carnal. Such is the grace and mercy of God.
ozaprah
Active Member
All good and thought provoking points OutWest.
Although Noah did get to take his children, and Lot's daughters came with him. The Egyptian children situation is different, and I don't consider that a typology of the rapture.
I think the advocates of children being raptured point to Romans 7:9 as there being an age of accountability at which before that the children belong to the Lord. What is that age? Only the Lord knows.
My opinion? Don't know! Will find out soon hopefully! It throws up questions of if there are no children taken, what happens to believer's babies in-utero?
Kaatje
My soul waits for the Lord, and in His Word I hope
I don't see any connction between these judgements and the Rapture.
After all, in those cases, we only see what was happening on earth.
Yes, the children died, but we don't know how they were judged after death.
There are more scriptural passages in which the children share the penalty for their fathers' sins.
After the revolt of Korah, Dathan and Abiram, they and their whole families perished.
But we know our God is just and merciful, and He gives everyone a personal judgement.