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The Flood

Discussion in 'Evangelism' started by Robert, Jan 12, 2011.

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  1. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member

    "Now it came about, when men began to multiply on the face of the land, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves, whomever they chose. Then the LORD said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he also is flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.” The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. " (Genesis 6:1-4, NASB, emphasis mine)

    The time: approximately 1650 years since God created the world. The human race had spread to cover the planet, and those that worshipped God began to intermingle with those that worshipped anything but God, and families of mixed beliefs began to crop up all over the place.

    And it was ANYTHING but pretty:

    "Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. The LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. The LORD said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky; for I am sorry that I have made them.” (Genesis 6:5-7, NASB, emphasis mine)

    It was a disaster; man began to commit wholesale sin against the Lord, fouling up everything with vile perversions, cruelty and sheer wickedness:

    "Now the earth was corrupt in the sight of God, and the earth was filled with violence. God looked on the earth, and behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way upon the earth. " (Genesis 6:11-12, NASB, emphasis mine)

    It was on such a scale that God no longer wanted him populating the Earth. The Lord was preparing to wipe the human race off the face of the planet. But he found one man who didn't follow the way of the masses:

    "But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD." (Genesis 6:8, NASB)

    God decided to not only tell Noah of his plans, but to spare him and his family, by employing them in his work:

    "Then God said to Noah, “The end of all flesh has come before Me; for the earth is filled with violence because of them; and behold, I am about to destroy them with the earth. Make for yourself an ark of gopher wood; you shall make the ark with rooms, and shall cover it inside and out with pitch. This is how you shall make it: the length of the ark three hundred cubits, its breadth fifty cubits, and its height thirty cubits. You shall make a window for the ark, and finish it to a cubit from the top; and set the door of the ark in the side of it; you shall make it with lower, second, and third decks. Behold, I, even I am bringing the flood of water upon the earth, to destroy all flesh in which is the breath of life, from under heaven; everything that is on the earth shall perish."(Genesis 6: 13-17, NASB, emphasis mine)

    Noah must have been shocked by what he heard; but what he heard next must have knocked him off his feet:

    "But I will establish My covenant with you; and you shall enter the ark—you and your sons and your wife, and your sons’ wives with you." (Genesis 6:18, NASB, emphasis mine)

    God was going to start over...WITH HIM!!! And He told Noah how he planned to do it:

    "And of every living thing of all flesh, you shall bring two of every kind into the ark, to keep them alive with you; they shall be male and female. Of the birds after their kind, and of the animals after their kind, of every creeping thing of the ground after its kind, two of every kind will come to you to keep them alive. As for you, take for yourself some of all food which is edible, and gather it to yourself; and it shall be for food for you and for them.”Thus Noah did; according to all that God had commanded him, so he did." (Genesis 6: 19-22, NASB, emphasis mine)

    Noah didn't debate or try to do his own way of things; what God asked of him, he did. He also didn't question the existence of God (after all, scripture describes him as righteous, and God wouldn't have selected him if he didn't worship Him) or demand proof; in faith, he obeyed.

    And it paid off:

    "Then the LORD said to Noah, “Enter the ark, you and all your household, for you alone I have seen to be righteous before Me in this time. You shall take with you of every clean animal by sevens, a male and his female; and of the animals that are not clean two, a male and his female; also of the birds of the sky, by sevens, male and female, to keep offspring alive on the face of all the earth. “For after seven more days, I will send rain on the earth forty days and forty nights; and I will blot out from the face of the land every living thing that I have made.” Noah did according to all that the LORD had commanded him." (Genesis 7:1-6, NASB, emphasis mine)

    Noah did as he was commanded, and because he trusted in God and obeyed in faith, he was now able to escape the oncoming horror of the flood:

    "Then the flood came upon the earth for forty days, and the water increased and lifted up the ark, so that it rose above the earth." (Genesis 7:17, NASB)

    Had Noah not obeyed, he and his family would have perished as well:

    "All flesh that moved on the earth perished, birds and cattle and beasts and every swarming thing that swarms upon the earth, and all mankind; of all that was on the dry land, all in whose nostrils was the breath of the spirit of life, died. Thus He blotted out every living thing that was upon the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky, and they were blotted out from the earth; and only Noah was left, together with those that were with him in the ark." (Genesis 7:21-23, NASB, emphasis mine)

    Scripture tells us the earth was "filled with violence; for that to be possible, there had to be quite a sizable population on the planet. Considering that people lived longer back then and had quite a few children (per scripture's report), 1,600 years could have resulted in a pretty substantial increase of people. Looking at how population has exploded in the recent centuries, I would say 6 billion would not be out of the question. That's about today's population.

    Now, let's think on that: out of an entire world full of people, only Noah, his wife and his sons and their wives, 8 people, survived. The rest, 6 billion human lives, all snuffed out because of their wickedness before the Lord.

    6 billion people, in one fell swoop, ALL WENT TO HELL FOR ETERNITY.


    If this doesn't demonstrate how serious God is about sin, not much else will. When it comes to God, the standard is ABSOLUTE PERFECTION; nothing else will do. And sinner (yes, YOU), you don't even begin to come NEAR that level that God demands. All of us have sinned against God, and have offended the most beautiful, perfect being that exists. We have all committed the worst of all possible crimes against the most innocent and lovely of individuals, and have slapped the Living God in the face with our pride and rebellion.

    Because of that, you cannot enter heaven, let alone stand before the Lord unless you are as HOLY as HE IS, no "ifs, ands OR buts." We cannot enter on our good works; God has already decreed that:

    "For all of us have become like one who is unclean, And all our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment; And all of us wither like a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, take us away." (Isaiah 64:6, NASB, emphasis mine)

    And by "filthy garment" scripture is describing the clothes of a woman going through menstruation. God is saying your good deeds to him are like used tampons! Disgusting, but it is the gospel truth. Nothing we have done or can ever do is good enough to wash away our sin.

    That is where Jesus Christ comes in.

    "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life." (John 3:16, NASB)

    Only the blood of Christ, shed for us on the rough wooden cross on Calvary, can wash away the stain of sin:

    "Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our introduction by faith into this grace in which we stand; and we exult in hope of the glory of God. And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance; and perseverance, proven character; and proven character, hope; and hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out within our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us. For while we were still helpless, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly. For one will hardly die for a righteous man; though perhaps for the good man someone would dare even to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him. For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. And not only this, but we also exult in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation." (Romans 5:1-11, NASB, emphasis mine)

    Without his blood, we cannot be reconciled to God, and we stand no chance of eternal life with him.

    Make no mistake: the coming tribulation is bad. Hell, by comparison, is FAR worse. But the worst thing of all is to stand before your precious creator, only to discover that everything you could have ever needed is in front of you, and you now must spend all of eternity separated from him! This is what makes hell HELL: you burn with the realization that YOU wronged and rejected the most perfect and beautiful, awesome and majestic, grand and pure person in all existence, and now must spend forever without him in the worst of all situations...

    ...when you could have been with HIM.

    You need to choose what is most important to you: your way, or his path. Do you love your sins more, or are you willing to leave all that behind and confess to Him that you have committed crimes against Him and wish to turn from them? Are you willing to accept his free love gift, or will you simply pass it by?

    This is the time for your "ark" of salvation... will you take the Lord up on his offer, or do like most humanity did back then ( and continue to do so now) and spurn him?

    It's your call.

    Last edited: Jan 13, 2011
  2. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member

    In case anyone was wondering: this article was aimed at the unsaved.

    *Robert peers out from under his rock*
  3. dave-o

    dave-o Well-Known Member

    Forgive me but I feel the need to point out that this statement is an assumption not supported by Scripture.

    Even today a person has until the moment they die to repent and turn to God through faith in Jesus Christ, the "seed of the woman". Since we know that God does not play favorites with mankind, we can be sure that those pre-flood people had the same opportunity. The flood was quick but not instant so they had some warning that death was imminent albeit not much. So we can't possibly know how many *may* have repented before they died. That number could be none, all or anywhere in between.

    Scripture clearly shows that our God is a long-suffering God of mercy before judgment. So the flood could have been more about His mercy than His righteous anger and judgment similar to the pop-culture "left behind" scenario.

    So were any saved? Only God knows.

    Interesting detail that many bible students miss:

    Genesis 7
    4 For after seven more days I will cause it to rain on the earth forty days and forty nights, and I will destroy from the face of the earth all living things that I have made.” 5 And Noah did according to all that the LORD commanded him. 6 Noah was six hundred years old when the floodwaters were on the earth.
    7 So Noah, with his sons, his wife, and his sons’ wives, went into the ark because of the waters of the flood. 8 Of clean animals, of animals that are unclean, of birds, and of everything that creeps on the earth, 9 two by two they went into the ark to Noah, male and female, as God had commanded Noah. 10 And it came to pass after seven days that the waters of the flood were on the earth.

    The picture is this; Here Noah, family and the animals are all sealed safely in the ark but then God waits for 7 days to begin. Why? Is it possibly a type of the final week of 7 years that precedes the final judgment?
    Last edited: May 13, 2011
  4. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member

    Were any saved? Let's put it this way: its' easy to cry out for forgiveness when disaster is upon us; its' another when the skies are clear. These people had 100 years to repent as Noah ( who was 500 when he started and 600 when he finished) built the Ark, yet in the end, only Noah and his family were spared.

    Keep these verses in mind:

    "Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. The LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. The LORD said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky; for I am sorry that I have made them.” But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD." (Genesis 6:5-8, NASB)

    "Now the earth was corrupt in the sight of God, and the earth was filled with violence. God looked on the earth, and behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way upon the earth. " (Genesis 6:11-12, NASB)

    These verses pretty well sum up the condition of man on the planet after about roughly 1600 years after Adam, and what a state it was in!!!

    Also, consider this verse:

    “Behold, I, even I am bringing the flood of water upon the earth, to destroy all flesh in which is the breath of life, from under heaven; everything that is on the earth shall perish. But I will establish My covenant with you; and you shall enter the ark—you and your sons and your wife, and your sons’ wives with you.(Genesis 6:17-18, NASB, emphasis mine)

    If all it took was the threat of waters surrounding someone to make them truly repent, God would have devised a different way to cleanse the earth. But god so no one on earth who would truly repent, after all, the Lord can see into the Human heart as Jeremiah 17:9-10 tells us:

    “The heart is more deceitful than all else And is desperately sick; Who can understand it? I, the LORD, search the heart, I test the mind, Even to give to each man according to his ways, According to the results of his deeds." (Jeremiah 17:9-10, NASB, emphasis mine)

    There is a difference between true repentance and asking for forgiveness when confronted with the consequences. One is godly sorrow; the other is simply trying to keep from suffering consequences. They had time to repent, and did not; God then acted.

    As for the 7 days time, if any had truly repented during that time, scripture would have told of them. While it does not mention why God waited 7 days before the Flood, one thing is apparent; no one came forward to repent between that time and the flood.

    God's mercy was the Ark; outside of being in the Ark, no one would survive the Flood. Similarly, outside of Jesus Christ, there is no salvation.

    The fact that God had to do what he did because of wickedness on the earth shows that indeed, most of the planet, save for the people in the Ark, all died because of sin. Scripture never speaks of any repenting in sorrow for what they did against the Lord; only Noah and his family were saved.

    So, if someone doesn't honestly repent and they die, where do you think they would go?
  5. dave-o

    dave-o Well-Known Member

    God's grace was the ark. Noah and his family were all sinners too but Noah received grace through faith just like we do today.

    Genesis 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

    God has never changed the way to righteousness. One way or another it has always been grace through faith.

    If you choose to believe that every last one of those flood victims will spend eternity in the lake of fire by all means do so. You may even be correct.

    I don't claim to know because the Scriptures simply do not tell us. Which was my whole point.
  6. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member

    Mattfivefour, what is your opinion on this?
  7. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Well-Known Member

    Respectfully I believe Dave's interpretation is wrong. I understand the basis upon which he bases it—faith in God. But it is faith in God's Messiah that saves. Those who died looking forward to the promise are the ones who are saved. As the writer of Hebrews said, "All these died in faith, without receiving the promises, but having seen them and having welcomed them from a distance, and having confessed that they were strangers and exiles on the earth." (Hebrews 11:13) They did not simply believe in God because belief (mental assent) in God by itself is nothing: "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble." (James 2:19) No they believed in His promise.

    Now I suppose we could use Dave's argument that, just like the thief on the Cross, one can instantly repent and be saved. So we would have to accept his view unless there were scriptures that told us plainly what happened to the people outside of the ark.

    I believe we have just such scriptures. Jesus refers to the flood in Matthew 24:38-29 when He says, "For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and they did not understand until the flood came and took them all away; so will the coming of the Son of Man be." The Greek verb translated "took away" here is αἴρω (airo, pronounced IRE-oh) which is usually used to mean to remove forcibly for the purpose of putting to death. It is used in Luke 23:18 where the crowd yelled to αἴρω Christ and release Barabbas instead. Also in John 19:15 where people yell to αἴρω Him. Crucify Him. In Acts 21:36 when the Jews saw Peter in the Temple they tried to seize him to execute him because they wrongly assumed he had defiled the Temple (a capital offense) by bringing in a Gentile. As they tried to seize him from the soldiers they were yelling "αἴρω him!" And will you recall that when the mob had quieted down, Paul got permission to speak to them. But when he testified to Jesus Christ being given to the Gentiles as well, they rose up against him violently. "They listened to him up to this statement, and then they raised their voices and said, “Away with such a fellow from the earth, for he should not be allowed to live!” And ... they were crying out and throwing off their cloaks and tossing dust into the air." (Acts 22:22-23)

    Luke records the words of Jesus speaking of the flood as: "They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all." (Luke 17:27) The Greek word translated "destroy" here is ἀπόλλυμι (apollumi, pronounced a-POL-loo-mee) and literally means "to destroy completely". In fact the name for Satan "Apollyon (the Destroyer)" is a proper noun derived from this verb). We find this word used in secular Greek literature of ancient Greece and the Holy Land to refer to something that is lost forever (such as references to permanently lost money in the Flinders Petrie Papyri III 51:5 and the Oxyrhynchus Papyri I 105:3-4.) In report "The Fayum towns and their Papyri" we see it used of the destruction of life and in the loss of life of two pigs who died being taken to market. (III :3 and following)

    But there is more.

    In Hebrews, we find that it was "By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith." Hebrews 11:7. The word for condemn here is the Greek κατακρίνω (katakrino, pronounce ka-ta-KREE-no) which is an intensified form of the verb to judge. It literally meant "to impose a final judgment of guilt" on someone ... as in to condemn them to be executed. Now we might try to argue that that simply means phsycial death, not spiritual death. But we would be arguing against the entire purpose of the OT. We need to remember that in the OT God's physical judgments warned of and typified His spiritual judgments in the NT. Executing a man in Israel was the equivalent of a man being cut off from God spiritually today. A man cut off from Israel for violating God's law is the same as a man today who dies in his sin.

    Then 1 Peter 3:19-20 says " ... He (Jesus) went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, who once were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through the water." This states that only eight emerged from the flood ... unless we want to hypothesize something about those outside the ark that scripture does not say. Then we have 2 Peter 2:5 where the Holy Spirit tells us that God "did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a preacher of righteousness, with seven others, when He brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly;."

    Therefore, cleaving to scripture alone and casting down my own ideas about what I perceive to be true mercy, I have no hesitation in accepting that Scripture clearly tells us in these scriptures that those who died in the flood died eternally lost. Now I do not know that it was whatever number of billions that the number guys love to calculate from whatever clues they can find in scripture. But, respectfully, surely their doing that is not unlike those who, based on mental figuring, figure that we can extrapolate from scripture things that are plainly not there and things that scripture when searched actually reveals as wrong when searched.

    We have one Rock on which to stand. The eternally revealed Word of God. We may have some awesome ideas, but if they do not stand up to the light of God's Word, they are wrong, ... no matter how right they may seem to us.

    I hope this helps.
  8. Hannah

    Hannah Well-Known Member


    you made the comment that the flood came and people didn't really have time to repent and get saved.

    First of all in those days men still were able to talk to God directly if they wanted to but they didn't.

    The other observation you need to make when reading the story of Noah is that in God's mercy it took Noah ages to build that Ark. People would ask him why he was building it. Noah would reply that God told him to build it. Noah was witnessing for the Lord. These people had ample time to learn that their days were numbered.

    Many people leave it until it is too late. The people in Noah's time had all they needed to find God and get Saved.

    Noah building the Ark was one long witness to the people in Noah's time.

    Now it is interesting that in the New Testament we often get a few NEW insights into Old Testament events.

    God waited patiently in those days while Noah built the Ark. What did God wait patiently for? People to repent. When they did not they were swept away in the flood.

    In the end only the righteous in the days of Noah were spared and those righteous were Noah and his family. Not that others could not be saved but did not want to be saved, they have been described by the passage in Peter above as those who disobeyed.

    No one in those days were without the salvation of the Messiah either because the above passage clearly teaches us that Jesus died for Noah and his family, the only people of Noah's time who were not disobedient and were found righteous. Anybody else could have been saved as well if they wanted God and His ways but they didn't. Just like today you either want to be God's or reject Him. The choice is the same. Christ's death covered people before and after His Crucifixion and Ressurrection. Salvation was always on offer and God certainly always gave people TIME to come to Him.

    So what happened at that time when Noah and his family were saved? The people were going about their lives without God and without a care and without desiring God, living in rebellion and disobedience and then the END came.
  9. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member

  10. cspat64

    cspat64 Well-Known Member

    I believe God sent the flood to wipe out the wicked generation- to start it all over again. I believe that God had already known that those people would not repent anyhow as He can see the end from the beginning.
  11. EnRapturedwithChrist

    EnRapturedwithChrist Well-Known Member

    What I find really profound is that Noah believed God's message and acted upon it. Up until then, there was no such thing as rain. Noah trusted God even though he had never seen rain or probably even knew what rain was.
    People must have thought Noah was crazy for preaching about rain. Probably even his own family.

    Praise God for Noah's faith and willingness to listen to Him. :thumbup
  12. Ohioan

    Ohioan Well-Known Member

    The Attack from the Angelic Realm

    I agree with this,

    { This angelic sin was somehow connected with Noah and the flood. If we accept the “angelic attack view,” then these corrupt angels somehow sexually molested the women. The result was a corrupt race.

    “And the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness (evidently in tartarus) for the judgment of the great day; as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them in a similar manner to these, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, (flesh of a different kind; homosexuality) are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.” (Jude 6-7)}

    Noah was found perfect in his generations, not that his generations were without sin, but that neither he nor his generations had been polluted from the angelic invasion.
    Because the sons of god came to and took the daughters of men for wives their offspring became corrupt, I hope this is not a poor comparison, but it is like a computer being corrupted by a virus. That virus was passed along until all had become corrupted and none could be saved.
  13. Ort

    Ort Well-Known Member

    Remember also, in Revelation, how many judgments fall upon those left on the earth, and how they do not repent even though such dangers and horrors hem them in from every side. Like Robert or Adrian said, if it only took the threat of the flood to cause them to repent, they would have. Likewise, when God throws bowl and trumpet judgments at the people, I believe they cursed Him and refused to give Him glory except for once. That is the sinful spirit of man right there! JMHO.
  14. Carl

    Carl Well-Known Member

    5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
    2 Peter 2:5 (KJV)

    English Words used in KJV:
    preacher 3
    [Total Count: 3]

    1) a herald or messenger vested with public authority, who conveyed the official messages of kings, magistrates, princes, military commanders, or who gave a public summons or demand, and performed various other duties. In the NT God's ambassador, and the herald or proclaimer of the divine word.
    —Strong's Greek & Hebrew Dictionary

    This says to me that Noah did not hide what was going to happen. And like through out history the prophets told what God was angry with man about, and how God expected man to change to get right with God. I can see Noah doing all these things to anyone that came by to see what Noah was up to and why.

    There was warning just like the book of Revelation is a warning. Yet when we read that book we find that there are men that shake their fist at God saying they don't deserve the punishment they are receiving, not repenting.

    As in the days of Noah. People are doing the same thing today. Laugh at the Bible and believers. Go about their sinful ways thinking that today will be like yesterday, and tomorrow will be like today.

    Oh God I pray for mercy on this wicked generation. Visit them with the truth of Your Son Jesus and what He has done for them.
  15. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Well-Known Member

    Sorry, Ohioan, I must most respectfully disagree with the article on that site. It is a classic case of eisegesis. He sees in scripture what he came to scripture with; it is not there without his a priori assumption. But he plays with attempts at exegesis and confuses the two.

    That said, this is not going to become an argument here. I have already stated I will not allow this thread to degenerate into a Nephilim thread. Nor an angels molesting women thread. So I am going to close this now. If somebody thinks they have new material, please pm me with it and I will consider re-opening the thread so the material can be posted.
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