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RC Sproul / Ligonier Ministries

Discussion in 'Ecumenism & Roman Catholicism' started by Ducati, Jan 27, 2014.

  1. Ducati

    Ducati Well-Known Member

    Needing more inside on this.
    I went to the Ligonier website and the only thing I gathered from it was it seems like a Catholic Seminary mixed in with Reformation Calvinism.

    I'm okey with some of the teachings from RC but something's leave me wondering.

    Anyone got more facts ?
    Thanks. :)


    SBN
     
  2. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Super Moderator Staff Member

    False teacher. Severe Calvinist heresy that stems from Augustinian Gnosticism.

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  3. Ducati

    Ducati Well-Known Member

    Explain that a bit more. My brother holds him in very high regard as being the best "theologian" of our time. I think he's more impressed with RC's articulate words and delivery - he also likes CRI so go figure.
    (I thing my brother has gone more Calvinist in past years. ) :(


    SBN
     
  4. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Super Moderator Staff Member

    Sproul teaches the blasphemous doctrine that God created the multitude of mankind Rio go to Hell, choosing a few to go to Heaven with Him. Jesus did not sure for all men, but only for all men whom He had chosen. If He chose you to be saved, you WILL be saved regardless of what you want. If He has chosen you to go to Hell, then you are going to Hell even if you love Jesus. You have no choice in the matter.

    Calvin was an Augustinian monk. Augustinian studies under Origen who corrupted the Church through subtle Gnostic teachings. For example, he came to the view that Jesus was a created being and subordinate to God the Father who was, in fact, His father by virtue of having created Him.

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  5. Ducati

    Ducati Well-Known Member

    Thanks.
    Pretty much like most Calvinist but much worst.
    That explains how my brother said in a conversation that "if you are saved , you have been from the foundations of the world".
    I told him "in that case we should all be simpethedic towards lucifer since he really had no choice then".

    Brakes my heart. :(


    SBN
     
  6. Lynn

    Lynn Well-Known Member

    Ducati, Adrian is right. RC is one we can avoid along with any other 'die hard' Calvinists. Just read your Bible. The Holy Spirit will teach you (& all of us who are believers in Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord). These radio guys usually have a favorite theological hobby horse, and in this case, it's Calvinism. Steer clear of this doctrine, and just read the Bible. I learned this after many years of 'following' the teaching of the preaching of several on the radio each day and was missing what God had for me in His Word. Now, reading the Word is my first priority, and secondly, I play CD's of praise/hymns and worship God myself, rather than listening to someone else's theological agenda for the day, which is either Calvinism, felt needs, or something else I may not profit from.
     
  7. Ducati

    Ducati Well-Known Member

    Thanks Lynn.
    From what I've learned from the Bible and the leading of the Holy Spirit , I listen to everyone with a Biblical ear of discernment.


    SBN
     
  8. chuckt

    chuckt Member

    What do you mean by "Rio"?

    I disagree with Calvinism and I am not a Calvinist.

    I don't think you should throw the baby out with the bath water. When Christian leaders signed the document "Evangelicals and Catholics Together", it was D. James Kennedy, R.C. Sproul, John Piper and John MacArthur with Dr. John Ankerberg as host supporting the doctrine of Justification by Faith and warning that we could take sides (excommunicate) over this issue.

    I'm an adult Christian who knows what to listen to and what not to listen to. If we weren't supposed to be exposed to evil then why didn't God get rid of the tree of knowledge in the Garden of Eve? I think that R.C. Sproul is valuable in dealing with atheists, learning logic and learning about the doctrine of justification by faith alone, information on the Trinity as well as many other things. I acknowledge there are other areas that I don't agree with him on but throwing him out does not service helping the Christian community. Here is an analogy: If you want to protect your computer, do you throw the virus definitions out because they represent evil? If you want to shadow box, you have to have something to shadow box against.

    We all have fallen short of the glory of God so when do we reject each other for falling short?
     
  9. Chris

    Chris Administrator Staff Member

    We don't reject him as a Christian brother, but we just don't want his Calvinist teachings on the board. Alot of folks don't know what to avoid out there on the Internet, so we try to stay as biblical as we can. :thumbup
     
  10. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Super Moderator Staff Member

    What Chris said.

    And "Rio" is what Swype decided I had swyped/typed on mangy phone. It wasn't. What I actually typed was "to". Just can't trust technology!

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  11. iSong6:3

    iSong6:3 Well-Known Member

    :lol: Sorry, bro, your phone has now devolved into "mangy." Not sure your relationship can survive this enforced togetherness. :tele
     
  12. mbrown1219

    mbrown1219 Heaven's Stables

    And here I thought he was speaking in the original Greek sometimes!

    :lol:

    ETA: Is that the theory of devolution, iSong?
     
  13. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Super Moderator Staff Member

    My", sis, My. My My My My my. Not mangy. :doh:

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  14. iSong6:3

    iSong6:3 Well-Known Member

    It's the Universal Theory of Man's Existential Struggle With the Imperfections and Failures of Modern Telephonic Communication Technology and the Lowered Ideation Thereof™. /gasp for breath/

    :hehheh
     
  15. mbrown1219

    mbrown1219 Heaven's Stables

    Who knew, iSong? Surely not I!

    :pound:

    If not "mangy" then what? What does that translate to en Ingles?

    ETA: Oh, I get it finally. My, my, my, my, my, my phone. (Not mine, Adrian's.)
     
  16. chuckt

    chuckt Member

    I agree with rejecting Calvinism and staying Biblical but being Biblical means we're rejecting two things:

    Luke 16:8 Parallel: And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light.

    King James Bible

    And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light.

    Matthew 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
    Matthew 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

    We can still learn from unbiblical people as Jesus directed (Matthew 23:2-3) and the children of this world are wiser than the children of light. When we are instructed to cut off the world like this, we also become unbiblical by rejecting the teaching of Jesus to observe and do.

    I'm not saying to follow his heresy. I'm saying to follow Jesus.
     
  17. mattfivefour

    mattfivefour Super Moderator Staff Member

    Chuck, if your interpretation and advice is correct, then Peter and Paul and John were incorrect to publicly warn people against false teachers by name.

    Respectfully, the meaning of the parable of the unrighteous servant is that Christ's followers should use this world's goods to help those who are in need of it in their lives. And just as the unjust master congratulated the shrewd servant for using the money wisely with the result that he benefited, so too God will approve of how we use what we have access to and the result will be of great benefit to us in Heaven.

    As to Christ's comments about the Pharisees, he was telling people not to follow after their hypocrisy but to do that which they in fact taught: the Law of Moses as laid out in the Torah.

    Respectfully, in none of that can we find license to listen to false teachers. As Jesus also said, "Beware the leaven (ie: false teaching) of the Pharisees." And in another place: "A little leaven leavens the whole bunch."

    As a Calvinist teacher and preacher, and a cessationist, Mr Sproul puts false doctrine into those who follow him; and his obvious intellect and admirable communication skills lead them to accept what he says as truth, particularly as he couches it all in Scripture.

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  18. chuckt

    chuckt Member

    I think that at some point in our lives, we've all had heresies or misunderstandings about God.

    I'm not saying it was wrong for Paul to name names.

    As a child, Jesus hung out in the temple. Did those teachers have their theology all together?

    Paul caused a dispute among the Sadducees and the Pharisees. Why? What did they not believe in and what did the other group believe in? Did they sit in Moses' seat? Are we to observe and do when they don't have it all together?
     
  19. mbrown1219

    mbrown1219 Heaven's Stables

    Not many should be teachers, as they are called to a much higher standard and their position as a "teacher" will be judged more harshly because of leading many astray.

    James Chapter 3 FYI
     
  20. Ducati

    Ducati Well-Known Member

    My brother and I were raised under the same roof , the same church , the same parents , everything - we seem to be so far apart on Biblical issues. He is a big supporter of CRI Hank Hannagraff , John MacAurthor , and RC Sproul. I'm amazed at some of the things that come out of his mouth.
    His favorite verse of scripture that he likes to throw out at me is "whom the Son has set free is free indeed" - not bound by law ,deed , or thought. He lives his life very loose (in my opinion). He drinks , curses, and basically on the surface no different then someone "in the world". He thinks I'm legalistic and judgmental because I feel there is a standard that every Christian should live and conduct there life by.
    I feel these Calvinistic teachers have made him very lax and loose in his walk with our Lord. He says "he's saved because God chose him-period, and there's nothing he can do to lose that salvation , its is eternal right ?".

    He's killin me. :crying
     

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