KNOW WHO YOU'RE READING

[SteveJM]

"All thinking men are atheists." -- Ernest Hemingway, American author (1899-1961)
"For most people, religion is nothing more than a substitute for a malfunctioning brain." -- Gene Roddenberry, Creator of Star Trek (1921-1991).
"I cannot see how a man of any large degree of humorous perception can ever be religious-unless he purposely shut the eyes of his mind & keep them shut by force." -- Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist (1835-1910)
"Every sensible man, every honorable man, must hold the Christian sect in horror." -- Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright.

These were quotes gathered from the website Scientists of the Christian Faith: A Presentation of the Pioneers, Practitioners and Supporters of Modern Science. For a more complete listing of allegedly atheistic authors you might want to refer to List of atheist authors - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.


What do we know about the writers and authors, whose, works we've read, television shows and movies we've watched, songs we've sung, etc. Their works may be in our private libraries, Kindle, Ipad or pod. Their influence can certainly be in our lives, whether we are aware of it or not. Cartoons? Are they so innocent? Obviously not. We must be discerning as to the mindset and values of those whose works we allow into our minds and the minds of our children. Our children and grandchildren who are being indoctrinated as much as educated in our schools should be given the greatest of consideration. The battle goes on for the teaching of intelligent design and creationism. Lets not forget the new morality(immorality) that is being pushed onto our children. I'm not surprised, that even today with all of the advances in Scientific knowledge that strongly prove an intelligent design, that there are many who refuse to believe.

My wife's cousin and my friend, Sarah, asked the question of why the schools want to shove evolution down our kids throat? That question lit a fire under me and I want to share my response to her, with you.

I think it's because those who make the decisions of what our children are taught, are opposed to the implications of creation. If you have creation, then you also have a creator. That would be some being that is immeasurably far superior to his creation. A God of order, and a God that seems to fit very well with the God of the Bible. The "wisdom" of the late Aleister Crowley, a well known Satanist, can be seen in his quote,"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law." If you have no one to account to, for your life and your choices, then you are free to do what thou wilt. This (Satanic) theme of doing whatever you want to do is a dominant theme in the music, entertainment and advertisement arenas today, and has been for some time. I also believe that those who are in places of high power don't want the masses to be beholden to anyone higher than themselves and more specifically those in positions of power. If anyone doubts creation, I would challenge you to visit a "Bodies Revealed" exhibit.BODIES REVEALED

The fool has said in his heart,“There is no God.” (Psalm 14:1).

"The heavens declare the glory of God, and the skies declare the work of His hands" (Psalm 19:1).

"I will praise Thee for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Thy works are wonderful and my soul knows this full well" (Psalm 139:14).

For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. (Romans 1:20).



Columbia University astronomer, Robert Jastrow discussed what he calls “the most theistic result to ever come out of science”:

According to the picture of the evolution of the universe developed by the astronomer and his fellow scientists, the smallest change in any of the circumstances of the natural world, such as the relative strengths of the forces of nature, or the properties of the elementary particles, would have led to a universe in which there could be no life and no man…

It is possible to make the same argument about changes in the strengths of the electromagnetic force, the force of gravity, or any other constants of the material universe, and so come to the conclusion that in a slightly changed universe there could be no life, and no man. Thus according to the physicist and the astronomer, it appears that the universe was constructed within very narrow limits, in such a way that man could dwell in it. This result is called the anthropic principle.


Some scientists suggest, in an effort to avoid a theistic or teleological implication in their findings, that there must be an infinite number of universes, representing all possible combinations of basic forces and conditions, and that our universe is one of an infinitely small fraction, in this great plenitude of universes, in which life exists. (From Personal Library | Sententias)



Colossians 2:8
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

[dave-o]

Some scientists suggest, in an effort to avoid a theistic or teleological implication in their findings, that there must be an infinite number of universes, representing all possible combinations of basic forces and conditions, and that our universe is one of an infinitely small fraction, in this great plenitude of universes, in which life exists.

I absolutely love that! It's my favorite thing to point out to God-doubters.

Only believe what is proven? HA! Belief in evolution now REQUIRES absolute FAITH that these impossible-to-prove universes exist. The more we learn about the universe the more we find that its true that "...His eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made..."

[Robert]

Actually, Gene Roddenberry didn't say that quote:

Ro-Ros: Positive Atheism's Big List of Quotations (seventh entry down)

That is an atheist site, and if Gene had said that, they would have been the first to confirm it. But Gene wasn't particularly a religious person either; he considered himself a humanist and agnostic. We do indeed need to be careful who we are reading; what they say enters our minds, and our minds are the battlefield.

Good post, SteveJM! :

[Meg]

Great post, Steve! These points about who or what influences our thinking has a lot to do with the fact that I don't read fiction any more.

[mattfivefour]

My wife's cousin and my friend, Sarah, asked the question of why the schools want to shove evolution down our kids throat? That question lit a fire under me and I want to share my response to her, with you.

I think it's because those who make the decisions of what our children are taught, are opposed to the implications of creation. If you have creation, then you also have a creator. That would be some being that is immeasurably far superior to his creation. A God of order, and a God that seems to fit very well with the God of the Bible. The "wisdom" of the late Aleister Crowley, a well known Satanist, can be seen in his quote,"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law." If you have no one to account to, for your life and your choices, then you are free to do what thou wilt. This (Satanic) theme of doing whatever you want to do is a dominant theme in the music, entertainment and advertisement arenas today, and has been for some time. I also believe that those who are in places of high power don't want the masses to be beholden to anyone higher than themselves and more specifically those in positions of power. If anyone doubts creation, I would challenge you to visit a "Bodies Revealed" exhibit.

Exactly! That is the nub of it right there. Few atheists will ever admit to it, though. Lee Strobel quotes one famous atheist who did, in the opening pages of his book The Case for Faith. Unfortunately I have loaned it to someone so I cannot reproduce that quote for you at this moment. I will be visiting the person at Christmas, so I will post it then ... unless someone else here has the book and knows the statement I am referring to.

[micah719]

Perhaps this is it, perhaps not...can't seem to find the NYR archive online so these three examples are the best I can do. I may have the book in my cellar (no, not your copy), but it is amongst many others in one of 17 large heavy boxes jammed into a small space with two bicycles on top, and this thread is not that urgent...

http://telicthoughts.com/that-foot-in-the-door/
"It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door."

(Richard Lewontin, Review of Sagan's 'The Demon-Haunted World', in New York Review of Books, Jan. 9, 1997, pp.28,31


Can we allow a Divine Foot in the Door? - Yahoo! Answers
We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is an absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.

Reference

Richard Lewontin, Billions and billions of demons, The New York Review, p. 31, 9 January 1997.


The Constructive Curmudgeon: Richard Lewontin, "Billions and Billions of Demons," The New York Review, January 1997, p. 31.
"We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counterintuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door. The eminent Kant scholar Lewis Beck used to say that anyone who could believe in God could believe in anything. To appeal to an omnipotent deity is to allow that at any moment the regularities of nature may be ruptured, that miracles may happen."

[mattfivefour]

No, but those are excellent quotes nonetheless, bro. The one I am thinking of is by a well-known writer who said quite openly that he chose not to believe in God because if he believed in God he could no longer live as he wanted, fulfilling his own desires. Thus, he said, he chose not to believe in him. When I find the exactg quote I will post it in this thread.

Thanks for the excellent material in your reply.

[readyforhome]

I knew Roddenberry made a habit out of not having religion in the television series, so I guess this shouldn't be a real suprise. Though I DO remember the ONE episode of the original series that had the Enterprise visiting a planet that was very much patterned after the old Roman Empire. There was also a persecuted group of what they thought were "sun" worhippers, though in the end it was Lieutenant Uhura who figured out it was actually the Son of God. I was more than a little suprise to tell everyone the truth. And all that time they kept mentioning the sun, when it is spelled son. I don't remember the name or number of the episode though.

[israelmybeloved]

I knew Roddenberry made a habit out of not having religion in the television series, so I guess this shouldn't be a real suprise. Though I DO remember the ONE episode of the original series that had the Enterprise visiting a planet that was very much patterned after the old Roman Empire. There was also a persecuted group of what they thought were "sun" worhippers, though in the end it was Lieutenant Uhura who figured out it was actually the Son of God. I was more than a little suprise to tell everyone the truth. And all that time they kept mentioning the sun, when it is spelled son. I don't remember the name or number of the episode though.

I for one am a big Star Trek fan, in some episodes, it has a reference to God. (I'm talking about our God). Did you know that the hand symbol that Spock does is actually taken from the Jewish Preists at prayers. Do I believe in aliens, no, but I do like star trek, just telling the truth

[WKUHilltopper]

You can usually tell by their leaning to secular humanism stories. It is too easy to see actually. Man can solve this, man can solve that, man can over come. Man needs a world collective. Man needs to "grow up" and do away with war. Even in science fiction--Martians won't visit because Man isn't ready or has to advance first. Pffft! Please!

There's a lot of faith put into Man.

[mattfivefour]

I found the quote I was looking for in my post above!

It is in this post: http://www.raptureforums.com/forum/a...tml#post238803

An atheist speaks honestly (for once)

A well-known British ... philosopher ... wrote honestly that the reason he did not believe in God was that if he were to believe in Him he could not lead the lifestyle he wanted.

The man in question is Aldous Huxley, the famous British intellectual, writer, atheist and humanist. Among many things he is remembered (he died in 1963) for his novel Brave New World. He was a brilliant man. And absolutely honest intellectually. Here is what Huxley wrote in his well-known book of essays titled Ends And Means (page 270ff):

"I had motives for not wanting the world to have a meaning; consequently assumed that it had none, and was able without any difficulty to find satisfying reasons for this assumption. The philosopher who finds no meaning in the world is not concerned exclusively with a problem in pure metaphysics, he is also concerned to prove that there is no valid reason why he personally should not do as he wants to do, or why his friends should not seize political power and govern in the way that they find most advantageous to themselves.... For myself, the philosophy of meaninglessness was essentially an instrument of liberation, sexual and political." (All emphases are mine.)

We may shake our heads at this man's refusal to accept the reality and truth of God, but we must admire his honesty in stating the reason he did not want to do so was to be free to do what he wanted, sexually and politically. Would that most atheists were that intellectually honest ... instead of hiding behind artificially constructed ideas they invent to try and disprove God's existence!

[livin_in_the_Son]

I found the quote I was looking for in my post above!

It is in this post: http://www.raptureforums.com/forum/a...tml#post238803

You know, that is really quite sad when you think about it. Our time here on earth is but a breath compared to eternity. I wonder now if he would still think it was worth it?

[mattfivefour]

You know, that is really quite sad when you think about it. Our time here on earth is but a breath compared to eternity. I wonder now if he would still think it was worth it?

Without any fear of being found wrong on this point at any time from now through all of eternity, the answer to your question is "NO!" But sadly it is far, far too late!

[mikhen7]

Just a thought,

"Voltaire, the famous skeptic is said to have died with cries of internal agony. His nurse is recorded as witnessing those throes of emptiness which led her to pen the following: "For all the money in Europe I wouldn’t want to see another unbeliever die! All night long he cried for forgiveness." Voltaire is just one of many who lived to prove that joy could never be found in a life apart from the eternal God, Heb. 12:17."

Taken from "Addicted to Joy"

God Bless!!

[WKUHilltopper]

"All thinking men are atheists." -- Ernest Hemingway, American author (1899-1961)
"For most people, religion is nothing more than a substitute for a malfunctioning brain." -- Gene Roddenberry, Creator of Star Trek (1921-1991).
"I cannot see how a man of any large degree of humorous perception can ever be religious-unless he purposely shut the eyes of his mind & keep them shut by force." -- Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist (1835-1910)
"Every sensible man, every honorable man, must hold the Christian sect in horror." -- Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright.

Sure, you're right. Christianity is a horror like Voltarie said. Chopping off your wife's fingers for wanting to go to college, forcing children into prostitution and stoning women for getting raped because they encouraged adultery is much, much better than Christianity. Islam isn't a horror, it's just swell! Isn't it, you idiots? Well--they probably have an idea about it now.

[SteveJM]

Just a thought,

"Voltaire, the famous skeptic is said to have died with cries of internal agony. His nurse is recorded as witnessing those throes of emptiness which led her to pen the following: "For all the money in Europe I wouldn’t want to see another unbeliever die! All night long he cried for forgiveness." Voltaire is just one of many who lived to prove that joy could never be found in a life apart from the eternal God, Heb. 12:17."

Taken from "Addicted to Joy"

God Bless!!

It gave me chills, when I read what Voltaire's nurse wrote. Voltaire, crying for forgiveness? Perhaps we'll see him one day, just as we'll see the thief that was on the cross next to Jesus. Still, even if one has a deathbed conversion (I'm not sure that Voltaire had one, only he and God, the angels and those in Heaven know that), how hard it would be to realize that you've been on the wrong side for nearly all of your life, and that your negative influence will carry on after you leave? This would certainly cause one to have "internal agony." I would however, rather make that decision before death. I think of the story that Jesus told about the rich man and Lazarus.

Luke 16:19-31
19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

When I was a college student, I preached to a small group of teens one Sunday morning. My message was titled, "Making the wrong decision at the right time and making the right decision at the wrong time." It was a simple message using the above text, and if I remember correctly, the following passages and some others.

Proverbs 27:1
Boast not thyself of tomorrow; for thou knowest not what a day may bring forth.
James 4:14
Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.
2 Corinthians 6:2
(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

Here is a part of Matthew Henry's commentary on 2 Corinthians chapter 6-"The gospel is a word of grace sounding in our ears. The gospel day is a day of salvation, the means of grace the means of salvation, the offers of the gospel the offers of salvation, and the present time the proper time to accept these offers. The morrow is none of ours: we know not what will be on the morrow, nor where we shall be. We now enjoy a day of grace; then let all be careful not to neglect it..."

Words are so powerful, and that's one reason why we should be slow to speak. Choices we make today can have such far reaching effects, that is why we must choose carefully. I have some deep regrets myself. One of my deepest regrets is that I, with my wife, chose to stop having children after having two. Today, I went to my wife's aunt's funeral. She had six children, seventeen grandchildren and 12 great grandchildren. As I watched her family pass before the casket one last time, I thought, "If only, if only I had not been so fearful, so easily duped by the wisdom of the world to limit how many children I had." It still is a heartache for me. I have asked for forgiveness for that terrible sin, and I know that God is faithful to forgive and blot it out. I can understand Voltaire's agony.

[readyforhome]

Again, the biggest reasons many of the famous people who are atheists are in fact atheists as I see it is because they want to rut like animals, and have no consequences and or have any feeling of guilt. Most are not willing to concede to this though. I do find one thing ironic, and that is we as Christians are accused of being stupid and not thinking for ourselves, and that atheists/agnostics and "freethinkers" like to say is that they think for themselves. etc... Here's the rub, most of the time when I'm around various sites I see the same quotes over and over again from atheists. Then I find out that these are from other well known atheists. Take for instance Ricky Gervais, as part of his hosting responsibilities he apparently felt it necessary to say, "I want to thank God for making me an atheist." This quote got thrown around over and over again. Then there was one of his lines from, "The Invention of Lying" where he made up "The Man in the Sky", obviously doing his best to mock the creator. Again, if anyone noticed we were subject to this term over and over again shortly after that, and not so shortly afterwards. If one were trying to be intellectually honest, would they feel the need to do this? Aren't they just following what someone else has said? Can that really be considered thinking for oneself? And finally who could forget and ever get tired of, "The Flying Sphagetti Monster", as a mocking reference for God. Boy, I for one NEVER get tired of that one.

[Mad Matt]

Watch out for C.S. Lewis as well. If you read the Chronicles of Narnia, you know Aslan is "God" and Tash is "satan". In the Last Battle, however, he is know as Tashlan! Half God/Half Satan! There are references to other pagan ceremonies throughout the Narnia series which Aslan participates in as well. Mr. Tummus is a reference to Pan. The list goes on. In some of Lewis's other works he refers to man as a higher form of animal! All this from a man praised by the church??!!

[SteveJM]

Watch out for C.S. Lewis as well. If you read the Chronicles of Narnia, you know Aslan is "God" and Tash is "satan". In the Last Battle, however, he is know as Tashlan! Half God/Half Satan! There are references to other pagan ceremonies throughout the Narnia series which Aslan participates in as well. Mr. Tummus is a reference to Pan. The list goes on. In some of Lewis's other works he refers to man as a higher form of animal! All this from a man praised by the church??!!

Good to know, Mad Matt. What more can you share in regard to C.S. Lewis's writings? Is there an objective book, and or website that you would recommend so that I can learn more?

[Meg]

Good to know, Mad Matt. What more can you share in regard to C.S. Lewis's writings? Is there an objective book, and or website that you would recommend so that I can learn more?

I just ran a quick search, and the things quoted about Lewis suggest he was more a polytheist than a sincere Christian. Maybe Adrian can come up with a clean link.