Diverse speculations chat....

[micah719]

On the shores of the serpentine where the people hire rowboats........

Watcher Will, the myopic proprietor is peering through his telescope and calls through his speaking trumpet: "Number 99, your time is up, please come in!"

Will's Wife, sitting nearby: "Dear, we don't have a Number 99!"

Watcher Will, after a brief, horrifying, dawning: "Number 66, do you require assistance?"

---

All jesting aside....I was just thinking of how priviledged the USA has been over the years and comparing this with the deplorable abominations and horrendous treason and apostacy by which it is perishing before our eyes. I cast my mind back to where that civilisation began, and considered the Maflower pilgrims and the amazingly unlikely success they were blessed with. As I thought of it further I was reminded of how The Lord sent His people Israel into Egypt to wait until the Cananites had filled up their measure of sin and became due for judgement and the uprooting of their vineyard. The allotted timespan was 400 years. The Mayflower folks started the north American experiment in 1620, as far as I know;...and the 400-year anniversary of that is coming up soon. This isn't an attempt at eisegesis or replacement theology or british israelitism, nor is it a stab at datesetting or prophecy. Just thinking of how gracious The Lord has been, and how much longer He is going to permit the travesty to go on.

He used Assyria to punish Israel, Babylon to punish Assyria, Persia to punish Babylon, Greece to punish Persia, and Rome to punish Greece, and I'm wondering which out of the EUSSR, the USSSR, the land of Sinim and the muslim dungheap of despotisms is going to get theirs first. When I think of Zechariah's writing and the black & white horses that went to the north country, I'm struck by the parallel to the four horsemen of Revelation. Antichrist and governmental/financial system meant here? There are two northern powers to overcome, in that passage in Zechariah. Rumination continues....



Oh Lord Jesus Christ, Saviour, Spirit of all prophecy and Revealer of things to come, I am dull and ignorant and lack discernment and wisdom and the deceptions are many. Please quiet the heart of this wretch and order his puny mind and give him wisdom to discern the priority and truth and application of the riches of Your Word so that his service in Your Glory may be to Your will and pleasure. Amen.






Mayflower Compact, modern version, liberated from the filthy paws of the leftist Wikipedia:

In the name of God, Amen. We, whose names are underwritten, the loyal subjects of our dread Sovereign Lord King James, by the Grace of God, of Great Britain, France, and Ireland, King, defender of the Faith, etc.

Having undertaken, for the Glory of God, and advancements of the Christian faith and honor of our King and Country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the Northern parts of Virginia, do by these presents, solemnly and mutually, in the presence of God, and one another, covenant and combine ourselves together into a civil body politic; for our better ordering, and preservation and furtherance of the ends aforesaid; and by virtue hereof to enact, constitute, and frame, such just and equal laws, ordinances, acts, constitutions, and offices, from time to time, as shall be thought most meet and convenient for the general good of the colony; unto which we promise all due submission and obedience.

In witness whereof we have hereunto subscribed our names at Cape Cod the 11th of November, in the year of the reign of our Sovereign Lord King James, of England, France, and Ireland, the eighteenth, and of Scotland the fifty-fourth, 1620

[ShilohRose]

Not to negate the import of what you're saying, but actually, the first permanent English colony in North America was Jamestown, Virginia in 1608. When the Pilgrims came to the New World, they were headed for Virginia but were blown off course.

By either reckoning, we could be in deep trouble.

[micah719]

Having undertaken, for the Glory of God, and advancements of the Christian faith and honor of our King and Country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the Northern parts of Virginia....

My knowledge of American history is woeful. Perhaps there is good reason the Compact claims to be the cause of the first colony....but would someone help me out, rather than me having to scour the web with this neanderthal computer? The string on my jamtin-phone broke, so I'm resorting to the slower, backup connection.

A new line of study coming for me is the penetration of RCC economics into the world since Vatican II. Richard Bennett spoke about it in one of the mp3's I downloaded from his site and it was shocking, and with the horrendous ecumenism sliming around over here I think it might be a profitable line of inquiry. The Reformation 400 year anniversary for Europe was early-mid last century.....now I wonder if there were any salient historical events that might indicate time-up for judgement for that area?

[ShilohRose]

I looked up the Mayflower Compact, and it mentions being the first colony in northern Virginia. That would be correct because while Jamestown was the first permanent English settlement, it was not in northern Virgina. Also, in the beginning, the colony of Virginia encompassed much more land than the current state of Virginia.

[Elijah's Mantle]

A new line of study coming for me is the penetration of RCC economics into the world since Vatican II. Richard Bennett spoke about it in one of the mp3's I downloaded from his site and it was shocking, and with the horrendous ecumenism sliming around over here I think it might be a profitable line of inquiry. The Reformation 400 year anniversary for Europe was early-mid last century.....now I wonder if there were any salient historical events that might indicate time-up for judgement for that area?

you've sparked up my curiosity

I dont actually know you may be on to something

but put on the full Armour micah719

some ballparks are that dangerous to go mentally loafing in
but you know that already i know you do

be brave Christian soldier

[micah719]

How silly of me to to notice north Virginia. Ok, so how many other settlements were made and which can be recognised as the definitive parent of the US experiment? What I am curious about is why the Mayflower pilgrims are so famous, given that there were many settlements.



On the research into The RCC influence in economics & polititcs....I went back to Richard Bennett's site and found text copy of his talk (see link below). A preliminary search on the web didn't turn up much useful info, though there are floods of it out there. I have no interest in wading through the ocean of tripe on the Vatican site unless I absolutely have to, there are certain to be other far more capable men that have done that distasteful work.


Papal Economics

[WKUHilltopper]

My knowledge of American history is woeful.

I dunno--I willing to bet the vast majority of American's have no idea what the Mayflower Compact was.


You do fine.

How silly of me to to notice north What I am curious about is why the Mayflower pilgrims are so famous, given that there were many settlements.

Mainly, they were seen as symbolic of the country's strive for "religious freedom", hard working achieving success, independence from an unrelated government and the Mayflower Compact--which was the granddaddy of the Constitution (Declaration of Independence, etc).

[micah719]

Mainly, they were seen as symbolic of the country's strive for "religious freedom", hard working achieving success, independence from an unrelated government and the Mayflower Compact--which was the granddaddy of the Constitution (Declaration of Independence, etc).

That sums up what I've been thinking. The spiritual base of the USA was founded on the Rock of Christ and His Word. From what I've been reading, the seeds of the decline were included in the planting of the Constitution, which unlike the MC was not an agreement purely amongst Christians and not founded securely on Biblical bedrock. The smoulderings of decline are evident from the beginning of independence but there seems to be a major acceleration around and after the civil war....which is to be expected, since war is the favourite tool of choice for changing the course of society. We're about to get another hefty dose, perhaps one of the last. I'm curious as to when the EU will build its new legions....can't be far away now. The armament industry is already well-prepared, all that needs to be done is to conscript and train the cannon-fodder. Be ready for a suitable crisis to kick that off....

[mikhen7]

Interesting journey of thought. I decided to add where my brain travels once in awhile and was led to this:

This excellent article should be ruminated on by all serious students of "Moral/Christian decline ---> excerpt from: The End of Christian America

Apr 3, 2009 8:00 PM EDT

What, then, does it mean to talk of "Christian America"? Evangelical Christians have long believed that the United States should be a nation whose political life is based upon and governed by their interpretation of biblical and theological principles. If the church believes drinking to be a sin, for instance, then the laws of the state should ban the consumption of alcohol. If the church believes the theory of evolution conflicts with a literal reading of the Book of Genesis, then the public schools should tailor their lessons accordingly. If the church believes abortion should be outlawed, then the legislatures and courts of the land should follow suit. The intensity of feeling about how Christian the nation should be has ebbed and flowed since Jamestown; there is, as the Bible says, no thing new under the sun. For more than 40 years, the debate that began with the Supreme Court's decision to end mandatory school prayer in 1962 (and accelerated with the Roe v. Wade ruling 11 years later) may not have been novel, but it has been ferocious. Fearing the coming of a Europe-like secular state, the right longed to engineer a return to what it believed was a Christian America of yore.


But that project has failed, at least for now. In Texas, authorities have decided to side with science, not theology, in a dispute over the teaching of evolution. The terrible economic times have not led to an increase in church attendance. In Iowa last Friday, the state Supreme Court ruled against a ban on same-sex marriage, a defeat for religious conservatives. Such evidence is what has believers fretting about the possibility of an age dominated by a newly muscular secularism. "The moral teachings of Christianity have exerted an incalculable influence on Western civilization," Mohler says. "As those moral teachings fade into cultural memory, a secularized morality takes their place. Once Christianity is abandoned by a significant portion of the population, the moral landscape necessarily changes. For the better part of the 20th century, the nations of Western Europe led the way in the abandonment of Christian commitments. Christian moral reflexes and moral principles gave way to the loosening grip of a Christian memory. Now even that Christian memory is absent from the lives of millions."


The whole article is very telling. I have always taught that the Moral landslide in America is because Parents, many years ago, decided it was ok to allow their children to make their own decisions during upbringing. It is like giving a child a can of gasoline and a match. America is burning as a result. All children must be led to the truth. If we refuse to do so, is it no wonder our children will do the same with their children. God's Word is still truth:

Deuteronomy 6:4-9 (ESV)
⁴ “Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.
⁵ You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.
⁶ And these words that I command you today shall be on your heart.
⁷ You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.
⁸ You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes.
⁹ You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.

Was God trying to teach us something???

God Bless!

[IamPJ]

Amen, mikhen...

[mattfivefour]

Yes, Mike— amen!

[micah719]

Thanks for that, Mik, very sobering article.

It prompts me to continue.....whereas the first Christian ministers to unleash the power of The Gospel on Europe had "only" to deal with cruel paganism largely untouched by knowledge of YHWH (other than that transmitted in corrupted oral traditions handed down from the Babel dispersion), anyone preaching The Gospel now has to deal with 2000 years of heresies and errors in addition to the re-emerging paganism that never really went away. Once upon a time the doctrines of Grace and substitionary atonement and salvation by faith and the Incarnation were totally novel; the first Christians and the fruit they displayed in the midst of thoroughly fleshly heathenism shone brightly and their salt stung sharply and created insatiable thirst. Now we face a heritage of counterfeits and an ignorant culture thoroughly sick of churchianity and glutted with options on the broad path to hell.

At least the ancient pagans had no modern conveniences and communications....they were relatively safe in their ignorance and self-sufficient lives. The modern man with instant access to a world of "knowledge" (some of which might even be true, but who has the time to learn to tell the difference?), and wholly dependent on inventions and the benevolence of the state, is a babe with pretensions of wisdom and wholly at the mercy of the nanny that can pluck the candy out of his mouth the instant he threatens to crawl out of line. The modern man cannot fend for himself outside his infrastructure, and the time needed to re-learn those old boyscout skills is longer than his life-expectancy should the power go out and the supermarket shelf be empty. The governments which hold the monopoly on resources and power to coerce know this, they have worked long and hard to make things this way.

If we read Foxe's Book of Martyrs (Fox's Book of Martyrs), we can see what kind of inducements can be applied to the faithful. Looking around, it is not hard to see that given a little pressure the coddled masses would agree to almost anything, with "almost" being small indeed. "Convert or die" RCC-style was last seen en-masse in Europe in Stepinac's Croatia 1941-45 (with a small reminder in 1990's Balkans and Rwanda).....and now that the followers of the Religion of Piece(s) are home amongst us, the cadre for a fearsome persecution is ready and waiting. Note the chumminess of the Vatican with the cult of mohamed since Vatican II. I've followed with some caution the smoke and mirror campaign of the FEMA camp controversies....but something I never hear is the idea that those compounds are not to keep the dissidents in but the chosen slaves, while the rejects consume each other outside (with a little helping hand). Not that such camps are a necessity: any facility built to handle large crowds will do, as the Katrina episode showed. This is not to spark off a new round of FUD, but some sober thinking of what tribulation never before seen might actually look like. Thoughts along that track might motivate me to witness more, so not all doom & gloom is fruitless.

The thing I see in Mik's article is that the culture has been deprived of Biblical standards of righteousness, a preparation for the kingdom of lawlessness. Over here in Deutschland in the heart of the revived roman empire there is no shortage of laws....except in the hearts of the people where consciences have been seared and papered over with synthetic morals torn out of the pages of the sick minds of the "thinkers" of the "Enlightenment". The source of the problem is also given....the children's minds are stolen and poisoned from an early age; a closer look at "kindergarten" is enough to make me furious at the heinous crime taking place daily in the open. It continues through many years of soul-lethal schooling, on into college, and all the way to the grave. The Lord's power to save is not in any way diminished, so no need to compromise and water down the Gospel to make it appealing to "seekers". Just give them the good news and take the flak. Of course, to appreciate the good news they need the bad news, and that's why the Big 10 are so unwelcome nowadays....


A match in a coalmine can seem brighter than the sun, when it's the only light you've seen in years....and the light of the Son must be all the brighter in the eyes of the light-starved souls we meet every day. Oh Lord, please give us the Love to spread Your light, and to endure the response.

[mikhen7]

Thanks for that, Mik, very sobering article.

It prompts me to continue.....whereas the first Christian ministers to unleash the power of The Gospel on Europe had "only" to deal with cruel paganism largely untouched by knowledge of YHWH (other than that transmitted in corrupted oral traditions handed down from the Babel dispersion), anyone preaching The Gospel now has to deal with 2000 years of heresies and errors in addition to the re-emerging paganism that never really went away. Once upon a time the doctrines of Grace and substitionary atonement and salvation by faith and the Incarnation were totally novel; the first Christians and the fruit they displayed in the midst of thoroughly fleshly heathenism shone brightly and their salt stung sharply and created insatiable thirst. Now we face a heritage of counterfeits and an ignorant culture thoroughly sick of churchianity and glutted with options on the broad path to hell.

At least the ancient pagans had no modern conveniences and communications....they were relatively safe in their ignorance and self-sufficient lives. The modern man with instant access to a world of "knowledge" (some of which might even be true, but who has the time to learn to tell the difference?), and wholly dependent on inventions and the benevolence of the state, is a babe with pretensions of wisdom and wholly at the mercy of the nanny that can pluck the candy out of his mouth the instant he threatens to crawl out of line. The modern man cannot fend for himself outside his infrastructure, and the time needed to re-learn those old boyscout skills is longer than his life-expectancy should the power go out and the supermarket shelf be empty. The governments which hold the monopoly on resources and power to coerce know this, they have worked long and hard to make things this way.

If we read Foxe's Book of Martyrs (Fox's Book of Martyrs), we can see what kind of inducements can be applied to the faithful. Looking around, it is not hard to see that given a little pressure the coddled masses would agree to almost anything, with "almost" being small indeed. "Convert or die" RCC-style was last seen en-masse in Europe in Stepinac's Croatia 1941-45 (with a small reminder in 1990's Balkans and Rwanda).....and now that the followers of the Religion of Piece(s) are home amongst us, the cadre for a fearsome persecution is ready and waiting. Note the chumminess of the Vatican with the cult of mohamed since Vatican II. I've followed with some caution the smoke and mirror campaign of the FEMA camp controversies....but something I never hear is the idea that those compounds are not to keep the dissidents in but the chosen slaves, while the rejects consume each other outside (with a little helping hand). Not that such camps are a necessity: any facility built to handle large crowds will do, as the Katrina episode showed. This is not to spark off a new round of FUD, but some sober thinking of what tribulation never before seen might actually look like. Thoughts along that track might motivate me to witness more, so not all doom & gloom is fruitless.

The thing I see in Mik's article is that the culture has been deprived of Biblical standards of righteousness, a preparation for the kingdom of lawlessness. Over here in Deutschland in the heart of the revived roman empire there is no shortage of laws....except in the hearts of the people where consciences have been seared and papered over with synthetic morals torn out of the pages of the sick minds of the "thinkers" of the "Enlightenment". The source of the problem is also given....the children's minds are stolen and poisoned from an early age; a closer look at "kindergarten" is enough to make me furious at the heinous crime taking place daily in the open. It continues through many years of soul-lethal schooling, on into college, and all the way to the grave. The Lord's power to save is not in any way diminished, so no need to compromise and water down the Gospel to make it appealing to "seekers". Just give them the good news and take the flak. Of course, to appreciate the good news they need the bad news, and that's why the Big 10 are so unwelcome nowadays....


A match in a coalmine can seem brighter than the sun, when it's the only light you've seen in years....and the light of the Son must be all the brighter in the eyes of the light-starved souls we meet every day. Oh Lord, please give us the Love to spread Your light, and to endure the response.

Dear brother, I want you to know I will bear that burden of the pagan response with you. The time has come for all true God loving believers to acknowledge, come what may, we must stand no matter the consequence. I appreciate the burden you see in EU. But remember, God is still at your side, and He before us nothing can be against us. Should we have to pay for our faith with our own blood the wicked will still lose the battle.

God is Victorious!!

God Bless

God Bless

[FaithInChrist]

Once Christianity is abandoned by a significant portion of the population, the moral landscape necessarily changes. For the better part of the 20th century, the nations of Western Europe led the way in the abandonment of Christian commitments. Christian moral reflexes and moral principles gave way to the loosening grip of a Christian memory. Now even that Christian memory is absent from the lives of millions."

The funny thing is that if somebody were to knock America to her knees ie: 9/11/01, then she jumps up and the majority of the people claim their Christianity, they claim to be willing to fight for their beliefs. I guess what I am saying is that if you polled America; the percentage that believe they are Chrisitans is astonishingly high. They believe in Christ, but as mentioned above they do not adhere to any Christian morals or Christian commitments.

America definitely has a county full of psuedo-Christians that are ripe for the One-World, One-Religion pickin's.

God Bless us all, if it weren't for pre-trib surely we wouldn't survive the wrath that is going to befall this country.

[Carl]

My knowledge of American history is woeful. Perhaps there is good reason the Compact claims to be the cause of the first colony....but would someone help me out, rather than me having to scour the web with this neanderthal computer? The string on my jamtin-phone broke, so I'm resorting to the slower, backup connection.

A new line of study coming for me is the penetration of RCC economics into the world since Vatican II. Richard Bennett spoke about it in one of the mp3's I downloaded from his site and it was shocking, and with the horrendous ecumenism sliming around over here I think it might be a profitable line of inquiry. The Reformation 400 year anniversary for Europe was early-mid last century.....now I wonder if there were any salient historical events that might indicate time-up for judgement for that area?

Since the topic at hand is the Lord taking countries/nations to the wood shed. You might consider that Europe suffered the first and second world war, as well as other wars started by upstarts. But when WWII ended the US did kinda point certain upstart countries in (certain governmental directions, and did help them with operation fresh start) {tongue in cheek}.

in fourteen hundred ninety two Columbus sailed the ocean blue.

[Chris]

My hometown is called "America's 1st Settlement" as you can read about it on Wikipedia. First Europeans were in 1520's.

Pensacola, Florida - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Carl]

As I read the Bible through I can't help but notice that faithfulness in God seems to last but one generation. Certainly there is always a remnant, but the mainstream of society seems to drift away from godly precepts. In fact the drift away from God is a danger that always starts the next generation.

One little story that Dr. James Dobson used to tell about a skiing holiday he took his family on. As it turned out the whole weekend was messed up by a snow storm. That is until Sunday. So Dr. Dobson made the decision to go skiing rather than to attend church on Sunday morning. Next thing that Dr. Dobson noticed was that his son Ryan was crying. Dr Dobson asked what was wrong. The answer was, "this is the first time that you have said it is okay to skip church"!

Now we have supposed church members that go to church on Sunday and live like hell the rest of the week. So we have an erosion of the very part of societal framework that is supposed to hold us together. Call the whole mess an inheritance of long standing compromises.

Of course there are those that have been at work since the beginning to introduce programs (for the good of society) that have given the government permission to create programs that take the place of charity and Godly help. Now most worship the god of wealth, and that is now failing.

We, that are a remnant, may end up like Sodom and Gomorrah where only Lot and his family were rescued. I know there are Blood Washed Christians that are praying for the US, but visibly not much is happening. Unless we consider that our way of life seems to be changing for the worse, and that without remedy.

We have had threads that stated we are no longer in that type of dispensation. But still there must be certain guiding principles that God uses through out time. There seems to be many parallels between the rise and fall of nations and God's Word.