On the ground in Israel - for Ronen

[ronen]

i recently learned a little more deeply the book of joshua.
and it kind of connects to the palestinians and the idea of being judged or tested by god

at least 3 times the book says specifically that the people of the 7 nations that lived in this land, have seen the miracles that god bestowed upon the jews. the crossing of the red sea and the crossing of the jordan river.
it is said that the heart of these people melted and that they were afraid of the israelis.
yet they are offered no mercy.

what do you think of that?

[Chris]

i havent seen it. and i never had a chance to read the book of revelation. it is part of the new testament.
i cant even boast about reading the entire old testament (let alone understand it)

Well, if you'd like you can read the articles on the link and get the "conservative" Christian view on the book of Revelation.

Well, I have not covered the entire OT myself, I have read the NT and a good bit of the OT. I got a little bogged down in the sections about who begat who!! I could never keep that straight.

[ronen]

Well, if you'd like you can read the articles on the link and get the "conservative" Christian view on the book of Revelation.

Well, I have not covered the entire OT myself, I have read the NT and a good bit of the OT. I got a little bogged down in the sections about who begat who!! I could never keep that straight.

me too. but i dont think its very important either.
oh im sorry i didnt even realised it was a link. ill check it now

[ronen]

well its an entire book.. what do you think about the matter in the book of joshua which i pointed out?

[BuzzardHut]

the nazies and the muslim guys that want us dead.
they are very much alike at least in my eyes. they speak alike and reason alike.

i mean, i think that both hatreds are from the same place. and ishamel and itshak have nothing to do with the germans.
so i dont think ishmael and itshak are the reason for the current muslim israeli conflict

they are both Aryan - a cultural belief spawned by satan to promote evolution and annihilate the Jews, if satan can get rid of the Jews he defeats God's plans and promises

[ronen]

they are both Aryan - a cultural belief spawned by satan to promote evolution and annihilate the Jews, if satan can get rid of the Jews he defeats God's plans and propmises

iranians are arian i think. but arabs are our half brothers. how can they be aryan?

[Chris]

well its an entire book.. what do you think about the matter in the book of joshua which i pointed out?

They were terrified yet they did not offer the Israelis mercy. Sounds like old Satan had them led by chain to carry out evil deeds against the Israelis. Pharoah is another who saw miracles from the one true God, yet he did not offer mercy until God took something very dear to him - his firstborn. I think the hatred comes from one place and that is the devil.

[ronen]

They were terrified yet they did not offer the Israelis mercy. Sounds like old Satan had them led by chain to carry out evil deeds against the Israelis. Pharoah is another who saw miracles from the one true God, yet he did not offer mercy until God took something very dear to him - his firstborn. I think the hatred comes from one place and that is the devil.

the devil is only mentioned a couple times in the bible and not by this name. instead it says adversary (or something like that) so i wouldnt attribute much importance to him. i think he serves god in his own way (test?)

but if you mention pharaoh than i must point out that it says specifically that god made his heart heavy. and that is the reason why pharaoh would not release the israelis.

raises moral questions..
what do you think?

[BuzzardHut]

well its an entire book.. what do you think about the matter in the book of joshua which i pointed out?

There are a lot of parallels and actually prophetic patterns in the book of Joshua - a very important book.
Joshua means "Jesus is savior"
Jesus himself battles to take the land for Joshua for He is the "Captain of the Lord's Host"

Jesus repeats the same war patterns in Joshua once again in the book of Revelation




First, we see Jesus in Joshua Himself, who was a type of Christ. How do we know? Because our Lord Jesus Christ was named the same name as this great Old Testament leader. The name Jesus is the Greek form of the Hebrew Joshua.

Now, Joshua was not Joshua’s original name. Look with me at Numbers 13. In this chapter, Moses selected twelve men to spy out the land of Canaan in preparation for the Israelite invasion. The names of the twelve men are listed.

The Lord said to Moses, "Send some men to explore the land of Canaan, which I am giving the Israelites. From each ancestral tribe send one of its leaders." So at the Lord’s command Moses sent them out from the Desert of Paran. All of them were leaders of the Israelites. These are their names… from the tribe of Ephraim, Hoshea son of Nun…"

Now, verse 16: These are the names of the men Moses sent to explore the land. Moses gave Hoshea son of Nun the name Joshua.

Why did he do that? Most commentators are mystified. The two names are very similar. Hoshea in the Hebrew means May Jehovah Save. Joshua means Jehovah Is Salvation. It seems to me that Moses was led by God to strengthen Hoshea’s name to make it more solid, more durable, more certain, more dogmatic, as a personal name for the coming Messiah: Jehovah Is Salvation. Here is one who is God Himself who has come to save His people.

And these two men not only share the same name, but a similar task. Joshua took over after the giver of the law had died, and he led the people into the future that God had planned and designed for them. The Bible teacher Paul Van Gorder points out,

The book begins with the words, "Now after the death of Moses…" Moses represented the law. The people could not enter the land of Canaan until Moses was dead. "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit (Rom 8:3,4)…. Joshua led the children of Israel to victory after crossing the Jordan. He was their advocate in time of defeat. It was Joshua who allotted them their portions within the land. All of this beautifully pictures the work of the Lord.



Rahab’s Crimson Cord

Now, there is a second picture of Jesus in the book of Joshua, and it is found in a coil of scarlet roping that plays a prominent role in the story of Rahab the prostitute in Joshua 2. In this passage, the children of Israel, still on the east bank of the Jordan, are massing for the invasion; but Joshua, being a shrewd and wise general, still needed some advance military intelligence. So he secretly sent two spies on a three-day mission into the Promised Land. They secretly entered the city of Jericho, but something went badly wrong and their covers were blown. The city authorities mobilized to track them down and kill them, but a prostitute named Rahab took them in and hid them. Her heart was hungry for God, and she recognized these men as representatives of God.

She had a crimson cord which she tied to the window of her house, which was attached to the city wall, so that the men could rappel down the wall and escape. She said to them, "I know that you are going to capture this city. I know that God is with you. When you do, I beg that you’ll spare me, my father and mother, my brothers and sisters and all who belong to them. Save us from death."

Their response is in verse 14: "Our lives for your lives!" the men assured her. "If you don’t tell what we are doing, we will treat you kindly and faithfully when the Lord gives us the land." So she let them down by a rope through the window, for the house she lived in was part of the city wall. Now she had said to them, "Go to the hills so the pursuers will not find you. Hide yourselves there three days until they return, and then go on your way." The men said to her, "This oath you made us swear will not be binding on us unless, when we enter the land, you have tied this scarlet cord in the window through which you let us down, and unless you have brought your father and mother, your brothers and all your family into your house. If anyone goes outside your house into the street, his blood will be on his own head; we will not be responsible. As for anyone who is in the house with you, his blood will be on our head if a hand is laid on him.

Verse 21: "Agreed," she replied. "Let it be as you say." So she sent them away and they departed. And she tied the scarlet cord in the window.

What a picture of Christ. Judgment is coming. The Bible says that the world is about to be invaded by the judgment of God. Acts 17:30-31 says that God "now commands all men everywhere to repent, because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained."

There is only one place where we may find safety and deliverance. Just as the Israelites were told to remain in their houses with the crimson blood of the Lamb painted on the door posts, just as Rahab was told to remain in her room with the crimson cord tied to the window, so we must be under the protecting, saving power of the crimson blood of Christ.

There’s an old song that says:

What can was away my sin? Nothing but the blood of Jesus.

What can make me whole again? Nothing but the blood of Jesus.

Oh! Precious is the flow that makes me white as snow;

No other fount I know, Nothing but the blood of Jesus.

Now, can you imagine how diligently Rahab sought to get her loved ones into that room? The invasion was imminent, and nothing else mattered to her except to get her father and mother, her brothers and sisters and their children into that upper room. It’s the same sort of diligence we see in the apostle Paul as he scurried about the Roman Empire, begging everyone he met to come to Christ for salvation. It’s a picture of the burden we should have for our own loved ones who know not Christ.

The Captain of the Lord’s Host

We also see Jesus in what I believe is a special pre-incarnate appearance in Joshua 5. This is one of the most unusual scenes in the Old Testament. After the Israelites crossed the Jordan River and prepared to fight for the city of Jericho, the Lord Jesus Himself—God the Son—left the throne of heaven for a few moments to impress something on the one who would later be His earthly namesake. Look at Joshua 5:13ff:

Now when Joshua was near Jericho, he looked up and saw a man standing in front of him with a drawn sword in His hand. Joshua went up to Him and asked, "Are you for us or for our enemies?"

"Nether," He replied, "but as commander of the army of the Lord I have now come." Then Joshua fell facedown on the ground in reverence and asked Him, "What message does my Lord have for His servant."

The commander of the Lord’s army replied, "Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy." And Joshua did so.

There are two things to notice here. First, the identity of this strange commander. Why do I say that this is a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ? By pre-incarnate appearance, I mean that Jesus came down to earth in the form of a human being before He actually became a human being at Bethlehem. Jesus Christ, being God, has always existed as God. He existed in Old Testament days. The prophet Micah tells us that His comings and goings are from old, even from eternity. We’re also given the indication in the Bible that God the Father and God the Holy Spirit remain invisible, but it is one of the jobs of God the Son to manifest the presence of God to His creation. John 1:18 says, "No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only (Son), who is at the Father’s side, has made Him known."

So there are several times in the Old Testament when we get glimpses of the physical, literal appearance of Jesus Christ prior to His birth in Bethlehem, and theologians call these sightings under a special name—Christophonies.

But notice in this passage the strange message. When Joshua realized that He was speaking with the Lord Himself, he asked, "What message to you have for me? What do I need to know?"

We would have thought that the Commander of the Lord’s Hosts would give him some military instruction or some spiritual insight. Instead the only message is: "Take off your shoes. The place where you are standing is holy."

What can we glean from that? Look back at chapter 1. In the introduction of the book, in the initial set of instructions that God gives to Joshua, He reminds him of His constant, abiding Presence:

No one will be able to stand up against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so I will be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you—verse 5

The Lord your God will be with you wherever you go—verse 9

The pillar of cloud may have vanished. The column of fire may no longer be seen. Moses is dead. But I have not gone anywhere. My presence is just as real and just as near and just as powerful as it ever was. The angelic armies are hovering unseen over your head. Wherever you are is holy, because I am with you.

The Lord Jesus wants us to regard wherever we are as a holy place, because He is with us. Your living room is holy ground, for when you are there, Jesus is there. Your bedroom is holy ground. Your office at work is a holy place when you are there, for Christ is there with you.


And Joshua went forth with a newfound confidence, knowing that even if he could not see the Lord, the Lord was there, present, hovering near with His divine armies, ready to fight on his behalf, even as our Lord Jesus Christ said as He ascended into heaven, Lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the world.

And so we see Jesus in Joshua…

Through the man Joshua himself whose name made him a prototype of the Coming Messiah: Jehovah is Salvation;

Through the scarlet cord signifying the saving power of the blood of Christ;

Through the mysterious Captain of the armies of God whose presence is near us. Whenever Jesus is with us wherever we are standing is holy ground.

Glimpses of Jesus in Joshua - A Donelson Fellowship Pocket Paper

In Hebrews 4:8 we read: "For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day."

Likewise in Acts 7:45 we have: "Which also our fathers that came after brought in with Jesus into the possession of the Gentiles, whom God drave out before the face of our fathers, unto the days of David."

The Greek texts all literally have the name JESUS in these two places, though the contexts refer to the man Joshua. Joshua himself is a pictoral "type" of our Lord Jesus Christ. Joshua, along with Caleb, did believe God had given them the promised land, but the rest of the people entered not in because of unbelief. Later this same Joshua ('Jesus' in Greek) led the people into the land. The promised land typifies the spiritual rest from our own works which was accomplished by the greater Jesus, the Son of God Himself.


Joshua himself was called by four different names including Jeshuah Nehemiah 8:17; Joshua in Joshua 1:1; Jehoshuah in Numbers 13:16, and Oshea in Numbers 13:11. He is mentioned only twice in the New Testament, once in Acts 7:45 and again in Hebrews 4:8. In Greek his name translates as Insous, or Jesus in English. This is exactly the same way "Jesus" is spelled in every case.

There are also other people in the Bible whose name was Jesus. In Acts 13:6 we come across a false prophet and a sorcerer. He was "a Jew, whose name was Bar-jesus." Bar-Jesus means "son of Jesus". We also meet a fellow Christian worker in the book of Colossians 4:11 - "And Jesus, which is called Justus, who are of the circumcision."

In the genealogy of Christ, the Traditional texts, the Majority of all manuscripts including A, and the Syriac all read like the King James Bible, by mentioning "the son of Er, which was the son of JOSE..." (or Joseph). However the corrupt manuscripts of Sinaiticus and Vaticanus read: "the son of Er, the son OF JESUS", and so do the RV, ASV, RSV, Goodspeed, and the J.W. versions. The NASB, NIV have changed this to read: "the son of JOSHUA".

It is obvious that many people in the Bible were called by several names, as Peter, Cephas, Simeon, and Simon Barjona (all one man), and that there were many people with the same name. It is not too hard to figure out who is who just by reading the context.

Both Hebrews 4:8 and Acts 7:45 the literal Greek "Jesus" refers to the man Joshua, who himself believed God and is the "type" of the true Jesus, who indeed does lead us into the promised land and gives us rest from our own labours.



http://www.truthnet.org/Christianity/revelation

[BuzzardHut]

the devil is only mentioned a couple times in the bible and not by this name. instead it says adversary (or something like that) so i wouldnt attribute much importance to him. i think he serves god in his own way (test?)

but if you mention pharaoh than i must point out that it says specifically that god made his heart heavy. and that is the reason why pharaoh would not release the israelis.

raises moral questions..
what do you think?

satan is listed several times throughout scripture
http://www.buzzardhut.net/Satan.pdf

satan's will is against God's will
God made man to worship Him and follow His will
http://www.buzzardhut.net/Man.pdf

we can only have fellowship with God through salvation
http://www.buzzardhut.net/Salvation.pdf

Pharaoh's heart was already hard, God just made it harder

[ronen]

buzzardhut, i opened a blog by mistake could you delete it for me?

i want to comment on your previous post
but i dont know how to multi quote

can you explain how it is done?

[BuzzardHut]

buzzardhut, i opened a blog by mistake could you delete it for me?

i want to comment on your previous post
but i dont know how to multi quote

can you explain how it is done?

you can just click on "reply with quote" that's good enough

[Chris]

the devil is only mentioned a couple times in the bible and not by this name. instead it says adversary (or something like that) so i wouldnt attribute much importance to him. i think he serves god in his own way (test?)

but if you mention pharaoh than i must point out that it says specifically that god made his heart heavy. and that is the reason why pharaoh would not release the israelis.

raises moral questions..
what do you think?

The devil is called by about 30-40 different names in the Bible. He's mentioned many times in the Bible. He is one of the main reasons why we are in the situation we are in. The devil and evil is central to human history as it stands opposed to God and righteousness. To dismiss him as not being important is not right.

As for pharoah, he used his free will like everyone else. If you keep rejecting God (hard heart) then your heart can be further hardened as in the case of pharoah. Same thing with Jesus, if you reject his salvation over and over, eventually your heart will be hardened and you'll be lost. Does that make sense?

[ronen]

The devil is called by about 30-40 different names in the Bible. He's mentioned many times in the Bible. He is one of the main reasons why we are in the situation we are in. The devil and evil is central to human history as it stands opposed to God and righteousness. To dismiss him as not being important is not right.

As for pharoah, he used his free will like everyone else. If you keep rejecting God (hard heart) then your heart can be further hardened as in the case of pharoah. Same thing with Jesus, if you reject his salvation over and over, eventually your heart will be hardened and you'll be lost. Does that make sense?

isrealis believe in god. so if jesus is god than i dont see the problem. we just call him by a different name.
same can be said about the muslims.
but buzz made a VERY long comment in which he must have put a lot of effort so ill get to responding to it now

buzz my friend, i got ADD if i tried to read it all at once and than comment on all of it than id forget 3/4 of it by the time i finished reading.
thats why i need the multi quote

[Chris]

isrealis believe in god. so if jesus is god than i dont see the problem. we just call him by a different name.
same can be said about the muslims.
but buzz made a VERY long comment in which he must have put a lot of effort so ill get to responding to it now

buzz my friend, i got ADD if i tried to read it all at once and than comment on all of it than id forget 3/4 of it by the time i finished reading.
thats why i need the multi quote

I don't see why Israelis don't believe in Jesus either?? Only the sinless one can atone for sin. A sinful man can't atone for the sins of sinful men. Only God in the flesh could atone for the sins of mankind. That is what Jesus did, and he is seated next to God as we speak.

What can be said about moslems? The god of the koran is not the same God of the Bible.

You can highlight his text you want to reply to and then wrap it in [QUOTE] tags. You can do that as much as needed.

[Chris]

Ronen, I know this is off topic but aren't you up late for Israeli time?? You must be staying up all night.

I'm going to be going to bed soon.

[ronen]

There are a lot of parallels and actually prophetic patterns in the book of Joshua - a very important book.
Joshua means "Jesus is savior"

it means god is savior. i dont think the name matters but still

Jesus himself battles to take the land for Joshua for He is the "Captain of the Lord's Host"

that is not written. joshua meets the "Captain of the Lord's Host" but it doesnt say that this being fights in these wars. in fact when you read the story, nothing makes you think that it is.
[/QUOTE]

Jesus repeats the same war patterns in Joshua once again in the book of Revelation

you know we dont read this book. how can i comment on it...

First, we see Jesus in Joshua Himself, who was a type of Christ. How do we know? Because our Lord Jesus Christ was named the same name as this great Old Testament leader. The name Jesus is the Greek form of the Hebrew Joshua.

does that not contradict with what you said earlier? -> "Jesus himself battles to take the land for Joshua for He is the "Captain of the Lord's Host" " ->did he meet himself?

Now, Joshua was not Joshua’s original name. Look with me at Numbers 13. In this chapter, Moses selected twelve men to spy out the land of Canaan in preparation for the Israelite invasion. The names of the twelve men are listed.

The Lord said to Moses, "Send some men to explore the land of Canaan, which I am giving the Israelites. From each ancestral tribe send one of its leaders." So at the Lord’s command Moses sent them out from the Desert of Paran. All of them were leaders of the Israelites. These are their names… from the tribe of Ephraim, Hoshea son of Nun…"

Now, verse 16: These are the names of the men Moses sent to explore the land. Moses gave Hoshea son of Nun the name Joshua.

no problem here

Why did he do that? Most commentators are mystified. The two names are very similar. Hoshea in the Hebrew means May Jehovah Save. Joshua means Jehovah Is Salvation. It seems to me that Moses was led by God to strengthen Hoshea’s name to make it more solid, more durable, more certain, more dogmatic, as a personal name for the coming Messiah: Jehovah Is Salvation. Here is one who is God Himself who has come to save His people.

hardly mystifying.. abram's name was changed and jacob's. this is not the first time.
probably one of many even. izevel baal zvuv and others

And these two men not only share the same name, but a similar task. Joshua took over after the giver of the law had died, and he led the people into the future that God had planned and designed for them. The Bible teacher Paul Van Gorder points out,

The book begins with the words, "Now after the death of Moses…" Moses represented the law. The people could not enter the land of Canaan until Moses was dead. "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit (Rom 8:3,4)…. Joshua led the children of Israel to victory after crossing the Jordan. He was their advocate in time of defeat. It was Joshua who allotted them their portions within the land. All of this beautifully pictures the work of the Lord.

rev again.. dont know what to say about it

Rahab’s Crimson Cord

Now, there is a second picture of Jesus in the book of Joshua, and it is found in a coil of scarlet roping that plays a prominent role in the story of Rahab the prostitute in Joshua 2. In this passage, the children of Israel, still on the east bank of the Jordan, are massing for the invasion; but Joshua, being a shrewd and wise general, still needed some advance military intelligence. So he secretly sent two spies on a three-day mission into the Promised Land. They secretly entered the city of Jericho, but something went badly wrong and their covers were blown. The city authorities mobilized to track them down and kill them, but a prostitute named Rahab took them in and hid them. Her heart was hungry for God, and she recognized these men as representatives of God.

She had a crimson cord which she tied to the window of her house, which was attached to the city wall, so that the men could rappel down the wall and escape. She said to them, "I know that you are going to capture this city. I know that God is with you. When you do, I beg that you’ll spare me, my father and mother, my brothers and sisters and all who belong to them. Save us from death."

Their response is in verse 14: "Our lives for your lives!" the men assured her. "If you don’t tell what we are doing, we will treat you kindly and faithfully when the Lord gives us the land." So she let them down by a rope through the window, for the house she lived in was part of the city wall. Now she had said to them, "Go to the hills so the pursuers will not find you. Hide yourselves there three days until they return, and then go on your way." The men said to her, "This oath you made us swear will not be binding on us unless, when we enter the land, you have tied this scarlet cord in the window through which you let us down, and unless you have brought your father and mother, your brothers and all your family into your house. If anyone goes outside your house into the street, his blood will be on his own head; we will not be responsible. As for anyone who is in the house with you, his blood will be on our head if a hand is laid on him.

Verse 21: "Agreed," she replied. "Let it be as you say." So she sent them away and they departed. And she tied the scarlet cord in the window.

What a picture of Christ. Judgment is coming. The Bible says that the world is about to be invaded by the judgment of God. Acts 17:30-31 says that God "now commands all men everywhere to repent, because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained."

There is only one place where we may find safety and deliverance. Just as the Israelites were told to remain in their houses with the crimson blood of the Lamb painted on the door posts, just as Rahab was told to remain in her room with the crimson cord tied to the window, so we must be under the protecting, saving power of the crimson blood of Christ.

There’s an old song that says:

What can was away my sin? Nothing but the blood of Jesus.

What can make me whole again? Nothing but the blood of Jesus.

Oh! Precious is the flow that makes me white as snow;

No other fount I know, Nothing but the blood of Jesus.

"Now, there is a second picture of Jesus in the book of Joshua" not much of a picture if you ask me
i didnt bother checking in the book, if you say the rope (or coil) was crimson than i believe you
but can we see jesus in anything red in the bible?

Now, can you imagine how diligently Rahab sought to get her loved ones into that room? The invasion was imminent, and nothing else mattered to her except to get her father and mother, her brothers and sisters and their children into that upper room. It’s the same sort of diligence we see in the apostle Paul as he scurried about the Roman Empire, begging everyone he met to come to Christ for salvation. It’s a picture of the burden we should have for our own loved ones who know not Christ.

The Captain of the Lord’s Host

We also see Jesus in what I believe is a special pre-incarnate appearance in Joshua 5. This is one of the most unusual scenes in the Old Testament. After the Israelites crossed the Jordan River and prepared to fight for the city of Jericho, the Lord Jesus Himself—God the Son—left the throne of heaven for a few moments to impress something on the one who would later be His earthly namesake. Look at Joshua 5:13ff:

Now when Joshua was near Jericho, he looked up and saw a man standing in front of him with a drawn sword in His hand. Joshua went up to Him and asked, "Are you for us or for our enemies?"

"Nether," He replied, "but as commander of the army of the Lord I have now come." Then Joshua fell facedown on the ground in reverence and asked Him, "What message does my Lord have for His servant."

The commander of the Lord’s army replied, "Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy." And Joshua did so.

you quoted half the book. your knowledge is overwhelming.

There are two things to notice here. First, the identity of this strange commander. Why do I say that this is a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ? By pre-incarnate appearance, I mean that Jesus came down to earth in the form of a human being before He actually became a human being at Bethlehem. Jesus Christ, being God, has always existed as God. He existed in Old Testament days. The prophet Micah tells us that His comings and goings are from old, even from eternity. We’re also given the indication in the Bible that God the Father and God the Holy Spirit remain invisible, but it is one of the jobs of God the Son to manifest the presence of God to His creation. John 1:18 says, "No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only (Son), who is at the Father’s side, has made Him known."

the first chapter of the book of yona does not have 18 phrases. so you must have meant your own christian book of john. and on that i dont know anything. as for micah, you didnt provide an exact location (though i do not doubt you can) but something tells me that the exact words written there will not say that god comes in human flesh form. or else my people would have joined you long ago.

So there are several times in the Old Testament when we get glimpses of the physical, literal appearance of Jesus Christ prior to His birth in Bethlehem, and theologians call these sightings under a special name—Christophonies.

no. not in the old testament. the captain of the lord's armies may be just that.
your assertions that he is in fact god are backed by new testament books.

But notice in this passage the strange message. When Joshua realized that He was speaking with the Lord Himself, he asked, "What message to you have for me? What do I need to know?"

We would have thought that the Commander of the Lord’s Hosts would give him some military instruction or some spiritual insight. Instead the only message is: "Take off your shoes. The place where you are standing is holy."

What can we glean from that? Look back at chapter 1. In the introduction of the book, in the initial set of instructions that God gives to Joshua, He reminds him of His constant, abiding Presence:

No one will be able to stand up against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so I will be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you—verse 5

The Lord your God will be with you wherever you go—verse 9

The pillar of cloud may have vanished. The column of fire may no longer be seen. Moses is dead. But I have not gone anywhere. My presence is just as real and just as near and just as powerful as it ever was. The angelic armies are hovering unseen over your head. Wherever you are is holy, because I am with you.

The Lord Jesus wants us to regard wherever we are as a holy place, because He is with us. Your living room is holy ground, for when you are there, Jesus is there. Your bedroom is holy ground. Your office at work is a holy place when you are there, for Christ is there with you.


And Joshua went forth with a newfound confidence, knowing that even if he could not see the Lord, the Lord was there, present, hovering near with His divine armies, ready to fight on his behalf, even as our Lord Jesus Christ said as He ascended into heaven, Lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the world.

And so we see Jesus in Joshua…

Through the man Joshua himself whose name made him a prototype of the Coming Messiah: Jehovah is Salvation;

im ashamed to say that i have recently read these words and have not noticed this evident problem.
indeed joshua comes up to the captain of gods armies. he asks him who he is.
the answer is as you said - to take his shoes off.
and than the chapter is over???
and immedietly the next chapter begins with "so said god to joshua"
so is the captain our god..?
i will ask my teacher this question and see what he has to say about it.
you made a strong point here.

Through the scarlet cord signifying the saving power of the blood of Christ;

Through the mysterious Captain of the armies of God whose presence is near us. Whenever Jesus is with us wherever we are standing is holy ground.

Glimpses of Jesus in Joshua - A Donelson Fellowship Pocket Paper

will check it more carefully a little later

In Hebrews 4:8 we read: "For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day."

Likewise in Acts 7:45 we have: "Which also our fathers that came after brought in with Jesus into the possession of the Gentiles, whom God drave out before the face of our fathers, unto the days of David."

The Greek texts all literally have the name JESUS in these two places, though the contexts refer to the man Joshua. Joshua himself is a pictoral "type" of our Lord Jesus Christ. Joshua, along with Caleb, did believe God had given them the promised land, but the rest of the people entered not in because of unbelief. Later this same Joshua ('Jesus' in Greek) led the people into the land. The promised land typifies the spiritual rest from our own works which was accomplished by the greater Jesus, the Son of God Himself.

new testament books. again i dont have any comment

Joshua himself was called by four different names including Jeshuah Nehemiah 8:17; Joshua in Joshua 1:1; Jehoshuah in Numbers 13:16, and Oshea in Numbers 13:11. He is mentioned only twice in the New Testament, once in Acts 7:45 and again in Hebrews 4:8. In Greek his name translates as Insous, or Jesus in English. This is exactly the same way "Jesus" is spelled in every case.

first time i see him called yeshua in nehemia
ill ask about it

There are also other people in the Bible whose name was Jesus. In Acts 13:6 we come across a false prophet and a sorcerer. He was "a Jew, whose name was Bar-jesus." Bar-Jesus means "son of Jesus". We also meet a fellow Christian worker in the book of Colossians 4:11 - "And Jesus, which is called Justus, who are of the circumcision."

In the genealogy of Christ, the Traditional texts, the Majority of all manuscripts including A, and the Syriac all read like the King James Bible, by mentioning "the son of Er, which was the son of JOSE..." (or Joseph). However the corrupt manuscripts of Sinaiticus and Vaticanus read: "the son of Er, the son OF JESUS", and so do the RV, ASV, RSV, Goodspeed, and the J.W. versions. The NASB, NIV have changed this to read: "the son of JOSHUA".

It is obvious that many people in the Bible were called by several names, as Peter, Cephas, Simeon, and Simon Barjona (all one man), and that there were many people with the same name. It is not too hard to figure out who is who just by reading the context.

Both Hebrews 4:8 and Acts 7:45 the literal Greek "Jesus" refers to the man Joshua, who himself believed God and is the "type" of the true Jesus, who indeed does lead us into the promised land and gives us rest from our own labours.



The Book of Revelation God's Plan for Eternity

well all in all you know a great deal more than me. i am no expert.
though i dont understand what point exactly you wished to convey... other than that you know the book better than anyone i know.
yet your answer to the moral problem with pharaoh has not settled the matter.
if his heart was already heavy than why did god made it heavier?

[BuzzardHut]

it means god is savior. i dont think the name matters but still

yes, God is saviour, Jesus is God and completed salvation at the cross

that is not written. joshua meets the "Captain of the Lord's Host" but it doesnt say that this being fights in these wars. in fact when you read the story, nothing makes you think that it is.

not only is God in the battle but angels as well

you know we dont read this book. how can i comment on it...

a great idea to read it, we base this entire board upon it as well as other books

does that not contradict with what you said earlier? -> "Jesus himself battles to take the land for Joshua for He is the "Captain of the Lord's Host" " ->did he meet himself?

a type of Christ means an example
the pre-incarnate Jesus is throughout the old testament, including walking with Adam in the garden
http://www.buzzardhut.net/Jesus.pdf

if you say the rope (or coil) was crimson than i believe you
but can we see jesus in anything red in the bible?

The Scarlet Thread

no. not in the old testament. the captain of the lord's armies may be just that.
your assertions that he is in fact god are backed by new testament books.

im ashamed to say that i have recently read these words and have not noticed this evident problem.
indeed joshua comes up to the captain of gods armies. he asks him who he is.
the answer is as you said - to take his shoes off.
and than the chapter is over???
and immedietly the next chapter begins with "so said god to joshua"
so is the captain our god..?
i will ask my teacher this question and see what he has to say about it.
you made a strong point here.

yes, God was there as Jesus - The Captain of the Lord's Host

though i dont understand what point exactly you wished to convey... other than that you know the book better than anyone i know.

just pointing out how similar patterns in the old and new testament are centered around Jesus and prophecy

yet your answer to the moral problem with pharaoh has not settled the matter.
if his heart was already heavy than why did god made it heavier?

Exodus 7:3-4 says, “But I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and though I multiply my miraculous signs and wonders in Egypt he will not listen to you. Then I will lay my hand on Egypt and with mighty acts of judgment I will bring out my people the Israelites.” It seems unjust for God to harden Pharaoh’s heart and then to punish Pharaoh and Egypt for what Pharaoh decided when his heart was hardened. Why would God harden Pharaoh’s heart just so He could judge Egypt more severely with additional plagues?

First, Pharaoh was not an innocent or godly man. He was a brutal dictator overseeing the terrible abuse and oppression of the Israelites, who likely numbered over 1.5 million people at that time. The Egyptian pharaohs had enslaved the Israelites for 400 years. A previous pharaoh—possibly even the pharaoh in question—ordered that male Israelite babies be killed at birth (Exodus 1:16). The pharaoh God hardened was an evil man, and the nation he ruled agreed with, or at least did not oppose, his evil actions.

Second, before the first few plagues, Pharaoh hardened his own heart against letting the Israelites go. “Pharaoh's heart became hard” (Exodus 7:13, 22; 8:19). “But when Pharaoh saw that there was relief, he hardened his heart” (Exodus 8:15). “But this time also Pharaoh hardened his heart” (Exodus 8:32). Pharaoh could have spared Egypt of all the plagues if he had not hardened his own heart. God was giving Pharaoh increasingly severe warnings of the judgment that was to come. Pharaoh chose to bring judgment on himself and on his nation by hardening his own heart against God’s commands.

As a result of Pharaoh’s hard-heartedness, God hardened Pharaoh’s heart even further, allowing for the last few plagues (Exodus 9:12; 10:20, 27). Pharaoh and Egypt had brought these judgments on themselves with 400 years of slavery and mass murder. Since the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23), and Pharaoh and Egypt had horribly sinned against God, it would have been just if God had completely annihilated Egypt. Therefore, God’s hardening Pharaoh’s heart was not unjust, and His bringing additional plagues against Egypt was not unjust. The plagues, as terrible as they were, actually demonstrate God’s mercy in not completely destroying Egypt, which would have been a perfectly just penalty.

Romans 9:17-18 declares, “For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: ‘I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.’ Therefore God has mercy on whom He wants to have mercy, and He hardens whom He wants to harden.” From a human perspective, it seems wrong for God to harden a person and then punish the person He has hardened. Biblically speaking, however, we have all sinned against God (Romans 3:23), and the just penalty for that sin is death (Romans 6:23). Therefore, God’s hardening and punishing a person is not unjust; it is actually merciful in comparison to what the person deserves.

Why did God harden Pharaoh’s heart?

[BuzzardHut]

The Preexistence of Jesus Christ as God – It is possible (as some have
done) to hold to his preexistence without believing in his deity. For
instance, the Jehovah’s Witnesses cult brazenly declares that Christ
preexisted as Michael the archangel prior to Bethlehem. But the Bible
dogmatically declares both his preexistence and his deity.

A. The fact of his divine preexistence

1. As taught by Isaiah – “For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given:
and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be
called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father,
The Prince of Peace” (Isa. 9:6).

a. His eternal preexistence is seen through the title “the everlasting
Father,” a phrase that can also be translated “the Father of Eternity” –
The Hebrew word for father is ah, which can also be rendered
“source,” and “inventor.” In other words Jesus is the father and source
of eternity itself.

b. His divine preexistence is seen by the twin titles “wonderful,” and
“mighty God.”

(1) Wonderful – The Hebrew word for wonderful is pehleh. The same
phrase occurs in Isaiah 28:29: “This also cometh forth from the
LORD of hosts, which is wonderful in counsel, and excellent in
working.”

(2) The mighty God – Here the Hebrew is el gibbor and can be found
in many Old Testament passages, all of which refer to God
himself. (See Deut. 10:17; Judg. 5:23; Psa. 24:8; 45:3; Isa. 10:21;
42:13; Jer. 32:18.)

2. As taught by Micah – “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are
small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will
be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times”
(Mic. 5:2, NIV).

3. As taught by John the Baptist – “John bare witness of him, and cried,
saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred
before me: for he was before me” (John 1:15).
What does this verse mean? According to Luke 1:36, John’s birth to
Elisabeth occurred some six months prior to Jesus’ birth. Even though,
humanly speaking, John the Baptist was born before Jesus was born, John
declares in these verses that Jesus existed before him and that he
recognizes Jesus as our Messiah... “the Lamb of God, which taketh away
the sin of the world” (John 1:29).

4. As taught by the Apostle John – “In the beginning was the Word, and the
Word was with God, and the Word was God” (John 1:1). “(For the life
was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you
that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;)”
(1 John 1:2).

In these verses the Apostle John connects Jesus’ preexistence to his
deity.

5. As taught by the Apostle Paul – “For by him were all things created, that
are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be
thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created
by him, and for him: and he is before all things, and by him all things
consist” (Col. 1:16-17). (See also 2 Cor. 8:9; Phil. 2:6-8.)

6. As taught by the Apostle Peter – “Who verily was foreordained before the
foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you” (1
Pet. 1:20).

7. As taught by Christ himself – “For I came down from heaven, not to do
mine own will, but the will of him that sent me” (John 6:38). “I am the
living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread,
he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I
will give for the life of the world.... When Jesus knew in himself that his
disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you? What
and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?”(John
6:51, 61-62). “Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before
Abraham was, I am” (John 8:58). “And now, O Father, glorify thou me
with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world
was” (John 17:5). Here Christ requests that the Father share his glory with
the Son. But note the Father’s previous statement about his glory in Isaiah:
“I am the Lord: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another”
(Isa. 42:8).

One is forced to conclude that either Christ was God indeed and had a
rightful claim to this glory, or he was an arrogant imposter demanding
something the Father would never give him. Of course Jesus’ divine
preexistence is inescapable. Jesus Christ is God. (See also Rev. 1:8, 11;
22:13.)

8. As taught by the book of Hebrews – “But unto the Son he saith, Thy
throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the
sceptre of thy kingdom” (Heb. 1:8). “Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and
to day, and for ever” (Heb. 13:8). (See also Heb. 1:10-12.)

B. The activities of the divine preexistent Christ – What was our Savior doing
prior to his Bethlehem appearance? The Scriptures make it plain he was busy
indeed.

1. He was creating the universe – “All things were made by him; and without
him was not any thing made that was made” (John 1:3). “For by him were
all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and
invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or
powers: all things were created by him, and for him” (Col. 1:16). “Hath in
these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of
all things, by whom also he made the worlds; and, Thou, Lord, in the
beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the
works of thine hands” (Heb. 1:2, 10),

Moses, in Genesis 1:1, tells us, “In the beginning God created the
heaven and the earth.” In other words, Moses, who wrote the book of
Genesis, tells us that the universe was created by God. However, in the
above verses John tells us that the world and the universe were made by
Christ. Of course there is no contradiction. Jesus was God, and he created
all things. This creation included everything, from electrons to galaxies,
and from angels to Adam.

2. He was controlling this created universe – “Who being the brightness of
his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by
the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down
on the right hand of the Majesty on high” (Heb. 1:3); “And he is before all
things, and by him all things consist” (Col. 1:17).

From the time he created the earth and placed it some 93 million miles
from the sun right on up to this very day he is controlling that distance. If
the earth would suddenly venture too close to the sun – get a few million
miles closer to it – we would all “boil away.” If the earth would stray a
few more million miles from the sun in its orbit around the sun, we would
freeze to death. However, we have the assurance he is controlling the
universe.

3. He was communing with the Father – “Father, I will that they also, whom
thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my
glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the
foundation of the world” (John 17:24).

II. The Old Testament Ministry of Jesus Christ – The Old Testament records
a number of theophanies. A theophany is a pre-Bethlehem appearance of
Christ. Most Bible theologians hold that the recurring angel of the Lord
episodes in the Old Testament are to be identified with Christ himself.
This theological position is strongly suggested by two key passages.
The first is found in Genesis 48, where the dying patriarch Jacob is
blessing his two grandchildren. The old founder of Israel prays: “The
angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads” (Gen. 48:16a). As
no regular angel can redeem men, it is assumed the angel here is actually
Jesus Christ.

The second passage is found in Judges 13, where a barren couple has
just learned from the angel of the Lord about the future birth of Samson.
In gratitude, Manoah (the father) requests the name of the angel, that he
might call the babe after him. Note the answer, however: “And the angel
of the Lord said unto him, Why askest thou thus after my name, seeing it
is secret?” (Judg. 13:18).

This word secret is from the same Hebrew root word found in Isaiah
9:6, where it is translated “Wonderful.” “For unto us a child is born, unto
us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his
name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The
everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace” (Isa. 9:6). Since we know the
“Wonderful” in this verse is a reference to Christ, it is highly probable the
“secret” in Judges 13:18 is also referring to Christ.
Let us now examine some other Old Testament theophanies.

A. He appeared to Hagar, Abraham's Egyptian wife, on two occasions.

1. First occasion, prior to the birth of her son Ishmael (Gen. 16:7-14) – The
first biblical reference to the angel of the Lord occurs here as he tenderly
ministers to a pagan and pregnant Egyptian girl.

2. Second occasion, following the birth of Ishmael (Gen. 21:16-20)

B. He appeared to Abraham.

1. Concerning the birth of Isaac (Gen.18:10)

2. Concerning the destruction of Sodom (Gen.18:17)

3. Concerning the sacrifice of Isaac (Gen. 22:11)

C. He appeared to Jacob.

1. At Bethel (Gen. 28:12-15)

2. By the brook Jabbok (Gen. 32:24-30)

D. He appeared to Moses – These three occasions were all connected with Mount
Sinai.

1. The first occasion was near the mountain – “And when the Lord saw that
he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush,
and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I. And he said, Draw not
nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou
standest is holy ground” (Exod. 3:4-5).

2. The second occasion was on the mountain – “Behold, I send an Angel
before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which
I have prepared” (Exod. 23:20).

3. The last occasion was in the mountain – “And it shall come to pass, while
my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a cliff of the rock, and will
cover thee with my hand while I pass by” (Exod. 33:22).

E. He appeared to Joshua (Josh. 5:13-15) – He appeared to Joshua on the eve of
the battle against Jericho and introduced himself as “captain of the host of the
Lord.”

F. He appeared to Gideon Judg. 6:11-24) – The angel of the Lord found a very
discouraged Gideon threshing wheat beside a wine press to hide it from the
opposing Midianites.

G. He appeared to Samson's parents (Judg. 13).

H. He appeared to Isaiah (Isa. 6:1-13) – A study of the book of Isaiah reveals that
Isaiah was allowed to see more of the glory of the preincarnate Christ than any
other Old Testament prophet.

I. He appeared to three young Hebrews in the fiery furnace – How exciting are
the astonished words of the pagan king Nebuchadnezzar as he witnessed this
appearance. “Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonied, and rose up in
haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellors, Did not we cast three men
bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True,
O king. He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst
of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of
God” (Dan. 3:24-25).

J. He appeared to Daniel.

1. The first of these appearances was in a lions’ den – “Then said Daniel unto
the king, O king, live for ever. My God hath sent his angel, and hath shut
the lions’ mouths, that they have not hurt me” (Dan. 6:21-22).

2. The second occurred during the beginning of King Belshazzar's reign – “I
saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with
the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought
him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a
kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his
dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his
kingdom that which shall not be destroyed” (Dan. 7:13-14).

3. The third occurred by the Tigris River – “Then I lifted up mine eyes, and
looked, and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded
with fine gold of Uphaz: His body also was like the beryl, and his face as
the appearance of lightning, and his eyes as lamps of fire, and his arms and
his feet like in colour to polished brass, and the voice of his words like the
voice of a multitude” (Dan. 10:5-6).

K. He appeared to Zechariah (Zech. 1:8-13; 2:8-11; 3:10; 6:12-15) – In his book
Zechariah describes Christ as protecting Jerusalem (1:8-13), measuring
Jerusalem (2:8-11), cleansing Jerusalem (3:10), and building Jerusalem (6:12-15).

As you can see, from the above study of the Old Testament ministry of
Christ, he was busily at work, even before his Bethlehem appearance. John
MacArthur summarizes:
The ministry of the Angel of the Lord in the Old Testament parallels the
ministry of Jesus Christ in the New Testament:
1. He revealed God's Word (Exod. 3:2-6; John 1:18).

2. He called leaders like Moses, Gideon, and Samson into God’s service just
as Christ called his disciples (Exod. 3:6-10; Judg. 6:14-16; 13:1-5, 24-25;
Matt. 10:1-4).

3. He delivered his people through Moses, Gideon, and Samson just as Christ
delivered his people through his work on the cross (Exod. 14:19-20; Judg.
6:14-16; Gal. 5:1).

4. He protected his people. Psalm 34:7 says, “The angel of the Lord
encampeth around about those who fear him, and delivereth them.” Christ
protects us as well.

5. He interceded for Israel (Zech. 1:12). Similarly Christ is our intercessor
(Heb. 7:25).

6. He defended believers against the attacks of Satan (Zech. 3:1-6), which is
precisely what Christ does (1 John 2:1-2).

7. He confirmed the covenant with Abraham (Gen. 22:15-18), and Christ
sealed the New Covenant with his blood (Matt. 26:28).

8. He comforted Hagar (Gen. 16:7-11), which is reminiscent of how Jesus
comforts us (Matt. 11:28-30). (God, Satan, and Angels, p. 147)

III. The Virgin Birth Incarnation of Jesus Christ – “And the Word was made
flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the
only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth” (John 1:14). “Hereby
know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is
come in the flesh is of God” (1 John 4:2). “For what the law could not do,
in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the
likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh” (Rom.
8:3). “And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was
manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto
the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory” (1 Tim.
3:16).

A. False views concerning the Incarnation

1. The Ebionites – The Ebionites denied the reality of Jesus’ divine nature.
Their error is refuted by the Apostle John in the first verse of his Gospel
account: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God,
and the Word was God” (John 1:1).

2. The Gnostics – The Gnostics denied the reality of Jesus’ human nature.
Their error is refuted by the Apostle John in the first verse of his first
epistle: “That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which
we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands
have handled, of the Word of life” (1 John 1:1).

3. The Arians – The Arians affirmed Jesus’ preexistence but denied his deity.
This is the position of the present-day Jehovah's Witnesses.

4. The Nestorians – The Nestorians believed two persons actually indwelt the
body of Christ, the human person and the divine person.

5. The Eutychians – The Eutychians went to the opposite extreme and said
both natures (the human and the divine) mingled to make up a third and
totally different nature from the original two natures.

B. The true view of the Incarnation

1. The definition involved
The word incarnation means “in flesh” and denotes the act whereby
the eternal Son of God took to Himself an additional nature, humanity,
through the virgin birth. The result is that Christ remains forever
unblemished deity, which He has had from eternity past; but He also
possesses true, sinless humanity in one Person forever (cf. John 1:14; Phil.
2:7-8; 1 Tim. 3:6).
The virgin birth was the means whereby the incarnation took place and
guaranteed the sinlessness of the Son of God. For this reason the virgin
birth was essential. Isaiah 7:14 predicted the virgin birth and Matthew
1:23 provides the commentary, indicating its fulfillment in the birth of
Christ. Matthew 1:23 identifies Mary as a “virgin” (Gk. parthenos, clearly
denoting a virgin). (Paul Enns, Moody Handbook of Theology, p. 222)
Note: This Greek word parthenos is used 14 times in the New
Testament, and on every occasion it refers to a virgin. (See Matt. 1:23;
25:1, 7, 11; Luke 1:27 – twice; Acts 21:9; 1 Cor. 7:25, 28, 34, 36-37; 2
Cor. 11:2; Rev. 14:4.)

In the one person, Jesus Christ, there are two natures – a human nature
and a divine nature, each in its completeness and integrity, and these two
natures are organically and indissolubly united, yet so that no third nature
is formed thereby. (A. H. Strong, Systematic Theology, p. 673)
Charles Ryrie suggests:
More concisely one may describe the person of Christ incarnate as
being full Deity and perfect humanity united without mixture, change,
division, or separation in one Person forever. The key components of the
description include “full Deity” (no diminution of any attribute of Deity),
“perfect humanity” (“perfect” rather than “full” in order to emphasize his
sinlessness), “one Person” (not two), and “forever” (for He continues to
have a body, though resurrected, Acts 1:11; Rev. 5:6). (Basic Theology, p.
247)

2. The illustration involved – The great evangelist D. L. Moody often related
the story of a young biologist who came across an especially large and
active ant hill during his walk in a forest. Delighted with his find, the
biologist sat down on a nearby rock, and taking out pen and notebook,
began writing down what he saw. Soon, however, the entire ant hill was in
an upheaval as the tiny creatures became aware of his presence.
Frustrated, the biologist walked away wishing he could in some manner
communicate with them, assuring the little creatures of his interest and
that no harm would be forthcoming.
He concluded, however, the only way this could happen would be to
take upon himself the body of an ant and thus become part of their
existence, sharing his story in a way they could comprehend.
This is exactly what occurred at the Incarnation. The infinite, holy,
eternal, and sinless Son of God agreed to take upon himself a finite and
fleshly body that he, the lofty Creator, might personally communicate with
us, his lowly creatures.

3. The nature involved – The term “hypostatic union” is often employed in
explaining the nature of the Incarnation. Consider the following three
quotations describing the hypostatic union:

a. From Paul Enns
The hypostatic union may be defined as “the second person, the
preincarnate Christ came and took to Himself a human nature and
remains forever undiminished Deity and true humanity united in one
person forever.” When Christ came, a Person came, not just a nature;
He took on an additional nature, a human nature – He did not simply
dwell in a human person. The result of the union of the two natures is
the theanthropic Person (the God-Man). (Moody Handbook of
Theology, p. 227)

b. From Robert Lightner
To deny either the undiminished deity or the perfect humanity of
Christ is to put oneself outside the pale of orthodoxy. Equally as
essential to orthodox theology is the belief that these two are
inseparable and will remain eternally united in the person of Christ.
The hypostatic union is the theological description of this and refers to
the two hypostases, or natures, forming the one person of Christ.
Apart from this union Christ could not have been mediator
between God and man. If he had only been man, his death could not
have atoned for man's sin. If he had been only God, he could not have
died, since God cannot die. If he had not been man, he would not have
had a genuine link with humanity and would not have had perfect
sympathy with man. (Biblical Theology, p.81.)

c. From Charles Ryrie
This simply means that the attributes of both natures belong to the
one Person without mixing the natures or dividing the Person.
Practically speaking, it is the basis for Christ being seen to be weak,
yet omnipotent; ignorant, yet omniscient; limited, yet infinite.
I have said that attributes cannot be transferred from one nature to
the other. To do so would change the mix of the complex of attributes
and thus the nature. If infinity can be transferred to humanity, then
Deity loses infinity and is no longer full Deity. However, attributes of
both natures must be expressed through the one Person. Thus the
Person can seem to “transfer” back and forth from the expression of
one or the other natures, though the attributes themselves must remain
as part of whichever nature they properly belong to. Thus theologians
have developed a system to classify the actions of the person of Christ
with respect to origination of the action.
Some examples include (a) actions predicated on the whole Person,
like redemption (both natures being involved); (b) actions predicated
on the divine nature (though the whole Person is the subject), like
preexistence (true only of the divine nature); and (c) actions predicated
on the human nature, like being thirsty.
Whatever help such a classification may give, it seems more
important to remember that the Person does whatever He does,
revealing whatever attribute of whichever nature He reveals. The
Person thirsted; the Person knew all things; the Person does not know
the day or the hour; and (probably the hardest one) the Person died. Of
course, Deity does not die or thirst, but the Person, Jesus Christ, the
God-Man, did both. (Basic Theology, p. 247.)

4. The miracle involved – The miracle of the virgin birth was not the actual birth,
but rather the conception of Christ's earthly body. Furthermore, the conception
was not only supernatural, but unique also, for God had already performed
supernatural births for Sarah, Hannah, Elisabeth, and others. Finally it should be
noted that we are not to speak of the virgin birth as the Immaculate Conception.
This is the false religious dogma that Mary was conceived and born without
original sin.

5. The duration (or perpetuity) involved – When the Son of God joined himself to
a body at Bethlehem it was an eternal arrangement. He will continue to manifest
himself in this body (in its resurrected state, of course) throughout the ages.

6. The prophecies involved:
a. Old Testament prophecies
(1) The fact of his birth – “And I will put enmity between thee and the
woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy
head, and thou shalt bruise his heel” (Gen. 3:15). Genesis 3:15 is
known to Bible students as the protoevangel verse. This literally
means, “first Gospel” verse, that is, the first mention of Christ’s
birth. This is important to note, for neither Adam or Eve (to whom
these words were first spoken) had experienced physical birth.
Both were directly created, one from the dust of the ground (Gen.
2:7), and the other from a human side (Gen. 221-22). But the
Messiah would be born.

(2) The method of his birth
(a) He was to be born of a woman – This too must have been a
shocker, for originally the woman had come from the man, but
not so with the future Messiah. He would proceed from the
seed of the woman (Gen, 3:15).

(b) He was to be born of a virgin woman – “Therefore the Lord
himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive,
and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel” (Isa. 7:14).
This woman would conceive and bear the Christ child without
the aid of a man.

(3) The nature of his birth – “For unto us a child is born, unto us a son
is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his
name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The
everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace” (Isa. 9:6). In a nutshell, he
would become the God-man.
(a) The phrase “a child is born” refers to his humanity.
(b) The phrase “a son is given” refers to his deity.
(4) The nationality of his birth
(a) First, he would come from the nation Israel (Gen. 12:3) – This
prophecy was especially remarkable, for Israel did not
officially become a nation until the days of Moses, many
centuries later (Exod. 19 – 20). Even then it would remain a
small and insignificant country in the Middle East. In matters
of military strength, cultural accomplishments, inventions, etc.,
Israel would contribute nothing. Her mission, however, was to
be far more important, for the Savior of all men would come
from her borders.

(b) Second, he would come from Judah, one of Israel’s 12 tribes
(Gen. 49:10) – The oldest tribe was Reuben, and perhaps the
most influential tribe was Ephraim, but the Messiah would
come from the tribe of Judah.

(c) Third, he would come from the house of David, of the tribe of
Judah in Israel (2 Sam. 7:12-13) – David was the eighth son of
a poor Bethlehem sheep herder, but this family would produce
the Savior of the world.

(5) The time of his birth – According to Daniel 9:24-27, his death
would occur some 483 years after the beginning of the project to
rebuild the Jerusalem walls. He was born, of course, some 33 years
prior to his death.

(6) The place of his birth – It was to be in the little town of Bethlehem.
“But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the
thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me
that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of
old, from everlasting” (Mic. 5:2). God could have chosen Rome, or
Babylon, or even the Jewish religious center of Jerusalem, but
instead he picked Bethlehem, the house of Bread.

(7) The sign accompanying his birth – A special supernatural light in
the form of a star would brighten the heavens and point to his birth
place (Num. 24:17).

(8) The unusual interest at his birth
(a) Wise men would come to Bethlehem to worship him (Isa. 60:3,
6, 9; Psa. 72:10)

(b) Wicked men would come to Bethlehem to kill him (Jer 31:15).
b. New Testament prophecies – Heavenly announcements were given to
at least eight individuals or groups concerning the Incarnation in the
New Testament.

(1) To Zacharias – “And he shall go before him in the spirit and power
of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the
disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people
prepared for the Lord….And thou, child, shalt be called the
prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the
Lord to prepare his ways” (Luke 1:17, 76). This prophecy was
given to Zacharias concerning his son, John the Baptist.

(2) To Mary – “And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and
bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS….And the angel
answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee,
and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also
that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son
of God” (Luke 1:31, 35). In these verses the angel Gabriel appears
to Mary and he tells her that she has found favor among women
and God is going to allow her the privilege of bearing the Messiah
into the world.

(3) To Elisabeth – “And she spake out with a loud voice, and said,
Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of they
womb. And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord
should come to me?” (Luke 1:42-43).

(4) To Joseph – The angel Gabriel appeared to Joseph, the distraught
would-be husband of Mary, to reassure him. “But while he thought
on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in
a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto
thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the
Holy Ghost. And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his
name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins” (Matt.
1:20-21).

(5) To the shepherds – “And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for,
behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all
people. For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour
which is Christ the Lord. And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye
shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a
manger: (Luke 2:10-12)

(6) To the Wise Men – “Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of
Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold there came wise men
from the east to Jerusalem, saying, Where is he that is born King of
the Jews? For we have seen his star in the east, and are come to
worship him” (Matt. 2:1-2) “When they saw the star, they rejoiced
with exceeding great joy. And when they were come into the
house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell
down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their
treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense,
and myrrh. And being warned of God in a dream that they should
not return to Herod, they departed into their own country another
way” (Matt. 2:10-12).

(7) To Simeon – “And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost,
that he should not see death, before he had seen the Lord’s Christ”
(Luke 2:26).

(8) To Anna – “And she coming in that instant gave thanks likewise
unto the Lord, and spake of him to all them that looked for
redemption in Jerusalem” (Luke 2:38).

7. The reasons involved – Why the Virgin Birth incarnation? God never does
anything without a good reason, and in this case, there were some 12 excellent
reasons for the Incarnation.

a. To reveal the invisible God – “No man hath seen God at any time; the
only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath
declared him” (John 1:18). “Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long
time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath
seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the
Father?” (John 14:9).
God loved the world, and how could he get his message across? He
sent Jesus into the world to become man and tell God's story in man’s
language to reveal the invisible God.

b. To fulfill prophecy – “And I will put enmity between thee and the
woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head,
and thou shalt bruise his heel” (Gen. 3:15). This was the first promise
of Bethlehem – the seed of woman shall bruise the head of the serpent.

c. To guarantee the Davidic Covenant – In 2 Samuel 7 David was
discouraged because he wanted to build the temple, and the Lord
would not allow him to do so. Because he was a man of war, the Lord
would instead allow his son, Solomon, to build the temple. However,
God promised David something far more precious, and it was what
theologians refer to today as the Davidic Covenant. This covenant
assured David that someday an heir from his own seed would rule over
Israel on his throne forever.
“And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a
son, and shalt call his name Jesus. He shall be great, and shall be
called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him
the throne of his father David: And he shall reign over the house of
Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end” (Luke 1:31-
33). In this Scripture from Luke 1, the angel Gabriel reminded Mary of
the fact that the Incarnation was the fulfillment of the Davidic
Covenant.

d. To make a sacrifice for our sins – Jesus left the ivory palaces of
heaven to come down to this world and enter the womb of Mary, to
make sacrifice for our sins. “But we see Jesus, who was made a little
lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory
and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every
man” (Heb. 2:9).
“For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should
take away sins. Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith,
Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared
me.... By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the
body of Jesus Christ once for all.... But this man, after he had offered
one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God”
(Heb. 10:4-5, 10, 12).
“And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in
him is no sin” (1 John 3:5). “For even the Son of man came not to be
ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for
many” (Mark 10:45).

e. To reconcile man to God – “To wit, that God was in Christ,
reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto
them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation” (2 Cor.
5:19). “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men,
the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be
testified in due time” (1 Tim. 2:5-6).

f. To provide an example for believers – We are told in the Scriptures
that Christ suffered, and that he left an example for us, that we should
follow his steps. The world often misunderstands the Incarnation. The
world thinks Christ is the example for unbelievers. That’s not what 1
Peter 2:21 says. It says that Christ has come to be an example for
believers. He is not an example for unbelievers. He is the Savior. He
came to save unbelievers and make them believers. Once we are saved
we study the life of Christ because he is our example. But there could
be no example apart from the Incarnation.
“For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for
us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps” (1 Pet.
2:21). “He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk,
even as he walked” (1 John 2:6).

g. To provide the believer with a high priest – In order to provide
believers with a high priest, it was necessary that Christ should be
made like unto his brethren. He passed sinlessly through all human
experiences, that he might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in
things pertaining to God, to make atonement for our sins. He was
obliged to become completely like his brethren – apart from sin, of
course.

“Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his
brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things
pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people”
(Heb. 2:17). “Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly
calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ
Jesus” (Heb. 3:1). “For we have not an high priest which cannot be
touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points
tempted like as we are, yet without sin” (Heb. 4:15).

h. To destroy the devil and his works – “Forasmuch then as the children
are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of
the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power
of death, that is, the devil” (Heb. 2:14). “He that committeth sin is of
the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the
Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the
devil” (1 John 3:8).

i. To escape the historical curse

(1) Upon Adam’s seed – “Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into
the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for
that all have sinned” (Rom. 5:12).

(2) Upon King Jehoiakim and his son, Jehoiachin – Both King
Jehoiakim and his son, Jehoiachin, were wicked rulers (Jer. 22:30;
Jer. 36:27-31). They were both judged by God and warned that
their physical seed would never prosper upon the throne of David.
Jesus escaped that judgment by being born of a virgin.

j. To preach, heal, and liberate – “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me,
because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath
sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the
captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that
are bruised, to preach the acceptable year of the Lord” (Luke 4:18-19).

k. To give life – abundant life – “He that believeth on the Son hath
everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but
the wrath of God abideth on him” (John 3:36). “The thief cometh not,
but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might
have life, and that they might have it more abundantly” (John 10:10).

l. To glorify the Father – “Therefore, when he was gone out, Jesus said,
Now is the Son of man glorified, and God is glorified in him” (John
13:31). “And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that
the Father may be glorified in the Son” (John 14:13). “I have glorified
thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to
do” (John 17:4).

[BuzzardHut]

The Old Testament Witnesses of Jesus Christ – The Bible is a Christ-centered
book. Jesus himself said the Old Testament spoke of him. “Search the scriptures;
for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me”
(John 5:39).

The following is a brief panorama of his story in history, as demonstrated by
some Old Testament men and women. Events in their lives remind us of some
aspect in the Savior’s New Testament ministry.

A. Adam – His headship over a new creation (Gen. 1:28; Rom. 5:17-19; 1 Cor.
15:22, 45, 47; Heb. 2:7-9)

B. Moses – His prophetical ministry (Deut. 18:15-18; Heb. 3:5-6)

C. Melchizedek – His priestly ministry (Gen. 14:18-20; Psa. 110:4; Heb. 5-8)

D. David – His kingly ministry (2 Sam. 7:1-17; Mark 11:10; Rev. 5:5; 22:16)

E. Jeremiah – His sorrows (Jer. 3:20; 5:1-5; 8:20-22; 9:1; 10:19; 11:19)

F. Joseph – His sufferings (the most perfect type of Christ in the Old Testament)

1. Hated without a cause (Gen. 37:4, 8; John 15:25)

2. Ridiculed (Gen. 37:19; Luke 22:63)

3. Plotted against (Gen. 37:20; John 11:53)

4. Stripped of his robe (Gen. 37:23; John 19:23-24)

5. Sold for silver (Gen. 37:28; Matt. 26:14-16)

6. Lied about (Gen. 39:14; Matt. 26:61)

7. Placed in captivity with two guilty men (Gen, 40:1-3; Luke 23:32-33)

8. Unrecognized by his own (Gen. 42:8; John 1:11)

G. Isaac – His death (Gen. 22:2, 8, 10; Matt. 26:36, 42-43)

H. Jonah – His resurrection Jonah 1:17; Matt. 12:40; 16:4; Luke 11:29)

I. Joshua – His victorious life (Joshua 1:3, 5-6, 8-9; John 10:17-18; 19:30)

J. Noah – His saving life (Gen. 6:13-14, 17-18; 1 Pet. 3:18-22)

K. Abraham – His father (Gen. 22:7-8; Matt. 26:36, 42-43)

L. Daniel – His acceptance by the Father (Dan. 9:23; 10:11, 19; Matt. 3:17; 17:5)

M. Elijah – His forerunner (Isa. 40:3-4; Matt. 17:11-12)

N. Elisha – His miracles (2 Kings 2:9; John 3:2): Elisha performed 14 miracles,
nearly double those of any other Old Testament man, except Moses.

O. Ezekiel – His parables (Ezek. 17:2; 20:49; Matt. 13:3): There are 69 parables
in the Old Testament; 23 are to be found in Ezekiel’s book alone.

P. Ruth – His church (Ruth 2&; 2 Cor. 11:2)

Q. Boaz – His love for the church (Ruth 2-4; Eph. 5:25-27)

R. Ezra – His zeal for the Scriptures (Neh. 8; Matt. 21:42; 22:29; Mark 12:10,
12:24; Luke 4:21; 24:27; John 10:35)

S. Nehemiah – His zeal for the Holy City (Neh. 1 – 2; Matt. 23:37-39; Luke
19:41)

T. Absalom: His opposition

1. From Judas – Absalom was a betrayer and member of David's inner circle,
as was Judas of Jesus’ inner circle (2 Sam. 15; Matt. 26:14).

2. From the coming Antichrist – Absalom plotted against the Davidic throne,
as will the Antichrist (2 Sam. 15; Rev. 13)

U. Solomon – His wisdom (1 Kings 3:11-13; Luke 4:22; John 7:46)

V. Lot – His backslidden followers (Gen. 19; 2 Pet. 2:7)