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Damon Thompson
This may not be the right place to post this. My wife and I saw part of a telecase where he was preaching to a group of young people. He seemed to be right on from that part that we heard. However, as always, I'm sceptical of someone I don't know about.lol. I wanted to get info on his doctrinal beliefs, etc. Does anyone know anything about him? Thanks
Moderator
All I know about him is he is associated with The Ramp ... and is endorsed by Dutch Sheets, Chuck Pierce and others in the Apostolic Renewal Movement. I used to love Dutch Sheets but he has gone off the tracks. He supported Lakeland and Todd Bentley. (In fact I think he was one of the Latter Rain pastors with Cindy Jacobs and others who went to Lakeland to transfer a special "anointing" on Todd Bentley.) And he has become a Dominionist. Here are couple of his recent "Kingdom Now" statements:
"“So when we begin to emphasize the king and the Kingdom rule of the Lord -guess what happens? The church goes to a whole new level of Kingdom authority and that is what is about to happen. "
"Even our Gospel is deficient. We are always told in scripture to preach the gospel of the what? Do you know we are not told to preach the Gospel of the cross? The word Gospel means what? Good News- s The Gospel of the Kingdom- oh we are told to preach the good news of something. When we preach the Good News of the cross and leave it there- and that’s important- we have to preach the cross but the Good News goes beyond the cross. The cross is the entry point into the Kingdom. He didn’t say preach the Good News just of salvation but preach the Good News that I have come and reestablished the dominion of God in the earth and restored to you the dominion that you lost in Genesis. My Kingdom is now functioning in earth in a people. The cross is the entrance – The Kingdom is the realm. The cross gives us life- The Kingdom gives us something to live for. The cross is about redemption- the Kingdom is about restoration. I want you to think about that- we are not just to emphasize redemption- that gets us in but He’s about restoring everything that has been lost. We are going to move from a mindset of saving souls and growing churches to producing disciples of the Kingdom. Kingdom disciples have eternity in their hearts and weapons in their hands. They are Kingdom thinkers- difference makers- culture shapers.”
Both those quotes are from Dutch Sheets' remarks at the "Starting The Year Off Right" conference in 2008.
So, considering with whom Damon Thompson is associating his ministry, I would be very careful until I had had the chance to check out his doctrine a bit more. On his website he says: "Damon Thompson delivers a preaching ministry with a prophetic edge. Part of his calling to the ministry is to equip all members of the body of Christ with an anointing for evangelism." (Apparently sharing the gospel needs an "anointing".) You can find out more about his beliefs at "The Rock" church of Mobile where he is part of the ministry team.
Hope this helps. Perhaps someone else will know more.
-------"You are not your own; you are bought with a price." —1 Corinthians 6:19b-20a
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To even be associated with anyone who says that gospel is deficient - that did it for me. Thanks.Originally Posted by mattfivefour
Damon Thompson
The first time I saw Damon Thompson, he was at the Ramp in Alabama and was teaching the youth to "birth in the spirit", which reminded me of followers of Bagwhan Shree Rajneesh back in the 1980's.
Re: Damon Thompson
"Even our Gospel is deficient. We are always told in scripture to preach the gospel of the what? Do you know we are not told to preach the Gospel of the cross? The word Gospel means what? Good News- s The Gospel of the Kingdom- oh we are told to preach the good news of something. When we preach the Good News of the cross and leave it there- and that’s important- we have to preach the cross but the Good News goes beyond the cross. The cross is the entry point into the Kingdom."
I have followed Dutch Sheets ministry for several years, Along with Damon Thompson so maybe I can shed some light on what Dutch meant. Dutch Sheets was not saying "the Gospel of Jesus Christ was deficient", He was saying basing Christianity on the entry level into the kingdom (Which is the cross) is deficient and not what Christ desired. Christ made a way to the father by shedding His blood. The cross is where we die to our selves, and get cleansed of sin. But it is not God's desire for us to spend our whole lives trying to die to ourselves, in the "Outer courts". Like the song says, "Take me past the outer courts, into your Holy place". The good news is not only that we have a way to get free from sin by Jesus blood, not only that by His striped we are healed, not only that we now have full authority over Satan and all his demons, But we now have a direct line to God the father. We can now have a relationship with the father on earth as it is in heaven. Much of Dutch Sheets along with Damon Thompson message is that of We must rid ourselves of this "Just a few more weary days and then ill fly away" mindset. We can have the kingdom of God now, but we must get past trying to die to our flesh which most people spend there whole lives doing. "If the only reason Jesus died was for us to get to heaven than the best thing would be for us to immediately get killed after we get saved"
Damon Thompson is the most biblical man of God I have ever seen in my entire life. Every sermon you will hear from him is solid in the word of God. If you were going judge a tree by its fruit, hundreds of thousands of youth including myself have been impacted by The Ramp ministry where he preaches. He is not perfect, but I will never forget the time I was at The Ramp and Damon got down with us at the alter and was praying to God for forgiveness for himself. He admits when he makes a mistake and always makes sure he is practicing what he preaches. I have grown to love these men of God (Dutch, Damon)and The Ramp from years of listening and learning from how God has impacted there lives. They have hearts to see this nation reformed and people transformed by the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Administrator
Re: Damon Thompson
Agreed. There is nothing deficient about the Gospel of Jesus Christ. The only one deficient is Damon Thompson if he believes that.
Moderator
Re: Damon Thompson
Jordanh777, I understand what you are saying. And if the ministries have truly brought you to Christ, then that is wonderful. But the doctrine you are being taught post-salvation is error.
Years ago I used to really like Dutch Sheets until he began veering off into Kingdom or Dominion theology. It is error plain and simple. One of the best descriptions of the basis of this error can be found on the apologetics research center's site. Here is an excerpt:The full article is at Dominion Theology - Apologetics Resource Center (ARC)One such error that continues to trouble the church is dominion theology. If you are paying attention at all to the modern prophetic movement, you are aware that dominion theology, also known as kingdom now theology or the manifest sons of God teaching has permeated this branch of Christendom.
Dominion theology is not new. Its roots go back to William Branham in the late 1940’s. The teaching was essentially dormant for a time but began to be resurrected in the 1980’s and now influences a major segment of the Christian population through teachers like Mike Bickle, Rick Joyner, Paul Cain, Francis Frangipane, Jill Austin, Kim Clement and literally a host of others.
Essentially, dominion theology arises from a distorted interpretation of Romans 8:19 and a few other passages. It teaches that a perfected, glorified church will usher in the kingdom of God by taking dominion over the world. To this end, the church must be placed in order by coming under the authority of present-day apostles and prophets. Many of these prophets are foretelling a great civil war that will take place within the church between the “grays”, associated with the brain or gray matter who focus on the scripture, and the “blues”, those associated with the sky who are open to new revelation. This is a gross oversimplification and not all dominionists would accept all that was just said but these are many of the central tenants of the movement.
Associated with this major teaching are a host of other doctrines and practices necessary to facilitate the rise of this perfected body of Christ. These can be found interspersed throughout the writings and messages of those in the movement.
It is taught that Christ must be incarnated within the church before He can return. The church will literally become the fullness of Christ. Francis Frangipane states, “When the Spirit of Christ comes into the physical world, He must enter through a physical body…When Christ first entered our world as a child, it was Mary whom God chose to give Christ birth….God is preparing us as He did Mary to give birth to the ministry of His Son. Even now, in the spiritual womb of the virgin church, the holy purpose of Christ is growing, awaiting maturity; ready to be born in power in the timing of God….the virgin Church is “in labor and in pain to give birth” (Rev. 12:1-2)…I say to you, once again, the virgin is with child. Before Jesus Himself returns, the last virgin Church shall become pregnant with the promise of God. Out of her travail, the Body of Christ shall come forth, raised to the full stature of its Head, the Lord Jesus. Corporately manifested in holiness, power and love, the Bride of Christ shall arise.” (Francis Frangipane, “In the Presence of God”, 1994) But it must be noted that, in context, the manifestation of the sons of God spoken of in Romans 8 does not occur until the redemption of the body at the resurrection. The scriptures are clear that it is Christ who brings the kingdom not the church.
Toby Brillon has written a good article also at the Temple Baptist Church website. Here is an excerpt from that article:The full article is at The Problem With Kingdom TheologyThe basic teaching of Kingdom Theology is that the Kingdom of God is now. You may sometimes hear this teaching called "Kingdom Now" or "Dominion Theology" as well. Kingdom Now followers also believe that the salvation of Christ also includes total and complete healing from all infirmities, and the return of man's rule and reign on the earth now as was in the days of Adam and Eve before the fall. Many actually believe that the death and resurrection of Christ actually restored the earth to its prefall state and Christians now simply need to rule and reign to see that effect. If that were not enough there are some problems with Kingdom Theology that contradict clear Biblical teachings and open the door to rank heresy.
The problem begins with a misapplication of Old Testament promises. Simply put, Kingdom Theology takes the promises from the Old Covenant and applies them to Christians today. The issue is that most of the promises in the Old Testament were for the nation of Israel only and would never apply to the heathen or gentile peoples. Many of these promises, or blessings and curses, were instituted to seperate Israel from the heathen that surrounded or even lived in their midst. God told Israel that if they lived according to His commands He would bless them and if they disobeyed His commands then He would curse them (Deut. 28). This was all part of God's plan to bring the Gospel to fruition. God was not "hoping" that Israel would keep these commands. In fact God told Moses of the future disobedience to come after Moses' own death (Deut. 31:16-18). I find it important at this point to remind you why God gave the law. In Galatians 3:19-25 God tells us that the law was given as a schoolmaster so that people would find their way to Christ. It is of uttermost importance to remember that the Bible is not just the Old Testament and the New Testament, rather, it is the complete revelation of God and we must read the whole Bible with our eyes on Christ. The whole Book points to Christ! It is only when we lose this perspective that we can get off-track in our theology and start thinking that Kingdom Theology even sounds reasonable. When both Testaments of Scripture are kept in focus with Christ in the center then we can easily discern the error of this dangerous Kingdom Now theology.
And another good article can be found at the Sola Dei Gloria site: The Kingdom of God and Dominion Theology Sola Dei Gloria
Hope this helps, Jordan. Nobody is doubting the truth of your salvation. The problem with Dutch and the others is what they are teaching you following salvation.
-------"You are not your own; you are bought with a price." —1 Corinthians 6:19b-20a
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an adopted son of The Most High God John 6:37-40
Re: Damon Thompson
Sorry, The Lord told me in Scripture that He would build the Kingdom, and bring it with Him, and it is His good pleasure to give it to His children.
Any attempt to do so ourselves is dangerous doomed folly, and the "preachers" mentioned in this thread are setting my wolf-warn-o-meter a-ringing. Since when is a large following proof of authenticity? Seems to me that it is a general principle that God's people are always in the minority in every time and place until eternity. That includes the Millenial Kingdom where at the end the devil is able to successfully raise a large rebellion; and especially to be expected in these evil last days where a great delusion is promised.
The glaring danger I see here and now is the great bandwagon of Jesus-professors condemning those that aren't joining in the latest fad, and perhaps at some point actually killing them or delivering them to be killed while thinking they are doing God a service. So if I see a large group claiming to be something, my instinct is to look for the minority that they hate so as to get an idea of who they really follow.
As to anyone claiming they have a ministry, I say that only the ministry of Jesus Christ is legitimate and anyone else competing or claiming to be a part of that but magnifying their own name is to be examined most carefully before any credibility is given them. Wake up and beware, The Lord was most explicit and repetitious about warnings of deceit. A little leaven leavens the whole lump...
Last edited by micah719; September-10th-2010 at 03:23 PM. Reason: added "the latest fad" to clarify
Fleethewrath2come
Re: Damon Thompson
I've watched Damon "Live" ....he's a great orator NO doubt, Passionate YES, but You can Preach Jesus and be in doctrinal error
I have a friend that graduated from CBC in Springfield Mo,,started a church in Kansas City
became friends with Damon Thompson and Rod Parsley and got sucked into the WOF movement
Preaching JESUS passionately is GREAT but when you describe His attributes in a manner that doesn't reflect his truth ....IE ...WOF .....you are preaching in ERROR
getting people to "fall down" "slain in the Spirit" and attributing it to the HOLY SPIRIT is ERROR
I could soap box on this, I pray for Damon ...he has a great gift of communication.....
But He needs to denounce alot of what He teaches PAST Jesus Christ and Him Crucified
Romans 13:11 This is all the more urgent, for you know how late it is; time is running out. Wake up, for our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed. 12 The night is almost gone; the day of salvation will soon be here.
Free In Christ
Re: Damon Thompson
I am sure some of you may have fizzled out on Hal Lindsey but his book "The Road to Holocaust" is by far numero uno on Dominion Theology in my book. If you really want a wake up call you should read it. My first semester of Bible college was at OCC Joplin, Mo Ozark Christian College. They are major Dominionists and I got sick of hearing there "We must evangelize to reach the world now" in order to bring Christ back doctrine. I finished and moved on the SBU Boliver. They also taught you could lose your salvation. They are affiliated with the Independent Christian Church and Church of Christ denom. Campbellites.
At any rate it is a good book regardless of your opinion of Lindsey.
Preview Here:
Amazon.com: The Road to Holocaust (9780553348996): Hal Lindsey: Books
God Bless
Snippet -->
In Christ,
Daniel 12:3 (New King James Version)
Those who are wise shall shine
Like the brightness of the firmament,
And those who turn many to righteousness
Like the stars forever and ever.
www.truthinspires.com
an adopted son of The Most High God John 6:37-40
Re: Damon Thompson
From the website of his ministry:
From the website of The Ramp ministry (bold emphasis mine):About Damon
Damon Thompson travels to various churches, conferences, and gatherings, releasing the spirit of awakening through a prophetic call to renewed hunger for God. He wants to see believers equipped to fulfill their current, immediate destiny of carrying revival. He desires to be a sword in the hands of local ministries to effectively establish the Kingdom of God in people’s lives. He also longs to see true spiritual fathers raised up that will develop mature sons to become voices of awakening. Along with an extensive travel schedule, Damon is also part of the leadership at the Ramp in Hamilton, Alabama, where he speaks regularly and fathers spiritual sons and daughters. Damon currently resides in Hamilton with his family.
The ultimate focus of his ministry is to help people develop eyes to see and ears to hear on their own so that they may live life with a prophetic edge and fulfill their current, immediate destiny. Currently, that focus has two main themes – Authenticity and Identification.
Authenticity – We minister to equip and allow the Body of Christ to enter into a place of authentic worship that is not pre-rehearsed. Many people have become lovers of “methodology” – that is, they have fallen in love with the way things are done instead of the One who is doing. Most people are missing their current moment of destiny because it does not look like their past experience. We want to break that mindset.
Identification – Proper identification breaks the cycle of insecure leaders feeding co-dependent people and the co-dependent people feeding the insecure leader. To help people recognize that the leaders in their lives are to equip them to hear the Voice of God and do the work of His ministry. We are all called to live a “prophetic” life, not depending solely on the ministry of the Prophet to hear for us. We are all called to live an “evangelistic” life, not depending solely on the ministry of the Evangelist to introduce people to the Kingdom.
Damon Thomas quotes, from:The Ramp is a house of awakening where hundreds from across the world gather to pursue the one true, living God. It began in 1998 when Karen Wheaton followed the Holy Spirit’s drawing back to her hometown, Hamilton, Alabama, and was alarmed by the apathy and sin that infected the youth of the city. A small prayer meeting with seven teenagers quickly grew into the international ministry the Ramp is today. Although young people primarily attend, the Ramp is not just a youth thing; it is a hunger thing. Countless numbers have been impacted, forsaking a lifestyle of sin to embrace a real relationship with Jesus Christ. Those awakened ones, once dead in sin, are now the revival and the movement intercessors have been praying for. The Ramp’s intent is to summon the youth of the nations to the reality of Jesus Christ and to equip them to impose His Kingdom.
Damon Thompson Quotes - Quotes
Associated with the USAA (United States Apostolic Alliance), on the following website. Not sure what became of that conference, but the birds of a feather aren't increasing my confidence, just making me more worried. Notice that the writeup about him is a cut/paste from his own website:"We need a breakdown of theoretical Christianity and a resurrection of practical Christianity."
“The quickest way to get Jesus to leave is to act like it’s no big deal when He comes."
“If the church was sensitive to seekers, it would not have shorter services…I’m a seeker…Seekers don’t look for shorter services…we get teenagers sitting here for four hours and they’re foaming in the mouth asking for more…when the Glory is there, you don’t care if it lasts all night.”
“I felt like the Lord spoke to me in that interaction, and He said, “It just doesn’t mean something when somebody is telling you you are beautiful because somebody else told you to tell them you are beautiful.” He said, “That’s usually how I feel in church. I don’t feel like there are very many people who have seen Me, I feel like there’s a lot of people telling me I’m beautiful cus somebody told them I should be telling”
"I’m telling you friend. If you would meet Him, we wouldn’t have to put forty programs together to try to teach you to follow Him. As much as I believe in discipleship, most of us in here didn’t get properly discipled. I try to tell leaders all the time, I say I can alleviate a lot of pressure from your life, by teaching you cannot disciple people that do not want to be disciple regardless of how great your disciple program is. And I could also teach you that you can’t stop people from getting discipled who want to get discipled regardless of how sorry your discipleship program is. That’s not a license to have a sorry discipleship program, but what it is is a revelation that when you get ready and you get hungry and you get serious about standing in God’s face, you don’t have to have a thousand people in the room, you don’t have to have the best youth building, you don’t have to have the highest budget, you don’t have to have the coolest music, you don’t have to have relevant pastors, you don’t have to have smoking lights. When you get ready to seek His face, early in the morning my song shall rise to Thee. Blessed are they that hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God, holiness without which man will see God.”
“If you want a real lover, His name is Jesus!”
“Bedroom Bible College"
"Your heart is not a merchandise. What’s your price tag (to turn off Jesus)? We’re a generation that is not for sale. I am not a sell-out. I am sold out. And I am no longer for sale."
"And what we’ve tried to do is cover the earth with the gospel of a man we don’t really know.
We have implemented all kinds of ridiculous, preposterous programs that try to get people to know a Jesus that we can’t really even describe.
And we have become like some kind of glorified salesmen that if we properly (sell the) product we are trying to push, then maybe you would be willing to give down your life, lay down your life for somebody that we said is incredible instead of just allowing you to experience it for yourself."
“As long as sickness is there, healing will be relevant. As long as there are demons in hell, deliverance will be relevant.”
“A generation will rise up if a papa will rise up, if a mama will rise up and invest in their lives.”
Why put the demon possessed, the ones slain in the Spirit, and the ones speaking in tongues in the corner? Holy Spirit is NOT on time out. (paraphrase)
“You think you’re in control and you’re going to find out you were never in charge anyways.”
“One of the stupidest thing we do in the church is stand still while God’s moving.”
“If you took money out of the equation, most people won’t be interested in large crowds.”
“I will not give up being right for being big.”
“We choose a life of illegitimate success instead of guarding the gold in the temple.” (on Hezekiah)
“If you will quit babysitting Christians, God will give you a generation that will shake the gates of hell.”
“Jesus didn’t die halfway for you, why do you get to live halfway for him?”
“Real Christians get in this Book till it becomes an obsession. Real Christians get in the Word until it becomes a part of the very fiber of their being. They begin to eat of it until they are what they eat. It consumes their thoughts. It consumes their activities.”
“The answer for a nation in moral recession is a burning church, and the answer for a church that’s not burning is a burning man.”
“The dryer something is, the easier it will burn.”
“The reason why Jesus’ power was never in question was because his communion (with God) was never inconsistent”
The moment your Christianity becomes controversial is the moment it actually becomes Christianity.
If God's presence is always available, why do I engage Him occasionally?
I’ve found that when my love walk is right, everything else goes fine.
We’re too much like the fools on the road to Emmaus: able to tell Jesus’ story, but unable to recognize His presence.
"You’re crowd sensitive…
Cause the seekers don’t wanna come to church for forty-five minutes. Cause the seekers want to hang out at the youth group after the parents get offended that the youth meeting is going on [for so long] and standing in the back room wondering how long they’re going to be in there…[but if your child was] playing soccer, you’d stay until the fourth overtime, but let the altar call go an extra thirty minutes and all the parents start freaking out.
…
We {as in the church} don’t want godly kids, we want good kids. Good kids make straight A’s, good kids don’t get pregnant before they get married, good kids make up their bed, do their homework, and they’re obedient and I never embarrass me in front of my church friends. Godly kids are waking up at three in the morning with the sound of intercession coming through the wall…We don’t really want godly kids, we want good kids. We want well-behaved kids with good manners…that are pleasant. You don’t want godly kids, godly kids will mess with you. You’ll go home one day and they’ll have thrown your DVD’s out.
…
I believe in being seeker sensitive. I believe we got to build churches that are truly sensitive to the true seekers. Why don’t we call them upper class yuppie sensitive churches instead of seeker sensitive churches? {he is speaking in the South} That’s what they really are…Cause I have never met a seeker that comes from the presence of God and looks at their watch and says you better be done in forty-five minutes. If I invite you to my house, and the first thing you do is look at your watch to determine how long you have to stay, you will never get invited back. Matter of fact, I’m just gonna tell you the truth, I’ll tell you to leave right now. If you walk into my house, sit at my table, and look at your watch and say “how long is this going to take?” First of all, you don’t know what an honor it is to get to be in my house so you dishonored my house. I wonder how God feels when people start [saying] “it’s twelve and this guy’s not finished yet and start zipping their Bible out.”
…
God talks about seekers in the Bible. And they weren’t seeking forty-five minutes services. They were seeking His [face]. “If My people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray, and turn from their wicked ways and seek My face.” God talks about seekers. “Seek ye first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things will be added to you.” He says “seek Me while I may be found.” The Bible says those who believe in Him must come believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him. We are going to raise up a seeker sensitive church that is filled for a seeking generation, that say “I’m not leaving until He comes and I don’t care if it’s noon, or three in the afternoon, or six at night. If we have to stay in the building and pray through the night. We have come for Jesus and we are not going to settle for church without Him.” I am tired of the Kingdom without the King. There is no Kingdom when there is no King. I don’t care how many Kingdom books you write or Kingdom sermons you preach. The essence of the Kingdom is the presence of the King. The thing that makes His dominion available is that His presence would be available. And we have tried to release His dominion without being willing to seek His face. Seekers. The Bible says the Kingdom of Heaven is like a woman who lost a coin, and start moving everything around to find what she lost."
Damon Thompson « End Times Prophetic, Prophecy, Visions, Dreams, Revelation, Christian Blog
Also checked out the "Celebration Church", linked to from Mr Thompson's website. Examine these two pdfs, their daily declarations. Classic WoF, blab and grab, but seeing as how it looks uncomfortably like something Steven Covey or Robert Schuller would say, I'll call it what it is, sorcery.
http://www.mycelebrationchurch.info/...9/02/daily.pdf
http://www.mycelebrationchurch.info/...scriptures.pdf
Also looked at the link to Karen Wheaton's ministry and read this:
Another critical article of Mr Thompson.....note the responses section and the hysterical accusations and condemnations.Karen Wheaton is a seasoned Christian minister whose music and preaching has provoked listeners to pursue God in passionate worship for many years. Her first exposure came on the PTL Club in 1978. As a young lady of only 18 she traveled with the Spurrlows in the Festival of Praise, and by 1980 she launched her solo ministry, traveling with her own band and back-up singers, singing and preaching the gospel across the nation. Throughout the ‘80’s Karen had the privilege of serving alongside ministers such as Jimmy Swaggart, Benny Hinn, Marilyn Hickey, and Charles and Frances Hunter as they held crusades and conferences all throughout the world. In 1988 she joined the TBN family and has been a part of that impacting television network ever since.
Throughout the ‘90’s Karen continued to work with other ministers such as Rod Parsley, T. D. Jakes, and many others, while increasingly traveling on her own as doors opened to sing and speak at various churches, prisons, and women’s conferences. In 1998 the emphasis of her ministry took a surprising turn as God called her to move back to her hometown and begin to work with the youth of the community. Though she continues to travel and minister, her efforts are primarily focused on the youth center she founded called the Ramp in her hometown Hamilton, Alabama. Along with other ministers such as Damon Thompson, Dutch Sheets, and Lou Engle, Karen is intent on awakening a generation. Over 1,100 young people gather at the Ramp each month to be transformed by the presence of God and equipped to win their cities.
http://thispilgrimland.com/?p=418
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Ok, thanks for your kind words of warning, pastorjdh, and for motivating me to look deeper into Mr Thompson and friends. That instructive little journey confirmed the concerns I had from the rest of the posts in this thread, and added a few more. It's been a while, btw, since someone played the Pharisee/hypocrite/paranoiac cards on me, thanks for the inspiration and edification!
In reference to the gifts of the Spirit, this is one area where it is important to be extra careful seeing as how the coming of the antichrist is to be accompanied by many lying signs and wonders. Also, gifts are just that, gifts......there is no Biblical support for you to declare this, which in effect is you questioning folks' salvation if they don't have them:
I won't be brushed off so easily, and when the subject of this thread associates himself with the Hinns and Jakes then he can expect even closer scrutiny. This also includes you, seeing as how vigorously you defend the man.If our God is not healing the sick, driving out demons and filling us with the supernatural gifts of the Spirit then our God is not the one of the New Testament; or, perhaps we have yet to really know the God we say we believe in.
Rather than address things that have been covered in many other threads on this forum, and other websites, I have questions for you. You stated:
Is it permissible to use questionable theology or even error to motivate people? How does that match being led by the Spirit, or is this motivation more aking to driving people aka according to Mr Warren's purpose?So called Kingdom now theology or any variant thereof may not be completely accurate but it does a whole lot more to motivate people to pursue God and the progress of His Kingdom in the Earth than the theology of a bunch of lukewarm believers sitting around waiting on the rapture and doing nothing for Jesus. This is coming from a pastor who strongly believes in the rapture and who also enjoys and appreciates the ministries of Dutch and Damon.
Further, it has been my experience that the doctrine of the Rapture is not a popular one, and the folks that profess to believe it are most unlikely to be the lukewarm sort. In fact, motivating folks by fear and guilt to do works, rather than rely purely on faith and the invisible leading by the Spirit, and maybe even motivated through love and gratitude, is a hallmark of the nicolaitans and gnostics that claim special knowledge and authority over "regular" believers, the laity.
The question I have to you is, are you here to fellowship with folks that share the love for The Lord Jesus Christ's promised return to whisk away His Bride, or are you here to win converts to the WoF/Charismatic sect, defend the purveyors of it, and/or sow dissentions and wrangling?
It would really be nice to have been proven wrong in my suspicions, and have an assurance that Mr Thompson & Co are indeed trustworthy and reliable witnesses and teachers, and that the list of false teachers wasn't so long nor so widespread. The man's a wolf, so I'll pray he repents and doesn't harvest any more souls or wreck any more walks. There are enough mature believers on this site that I can count on to pull me up when I stray, and if I've stepped out of bounds I welcome correction.
Last edited by micah719; September-10th-2010 at 06:09 PM. Reason: added another link
Citizen
Re: Damon Thompson
And there are Micah!
Now, for a couple of things...
1) it is not the gifts that a person receives from God, or how many sick are healed, or how many wonderful works that are done by that person that denote whether they are saved or not. What determines whether one is saved is that they have placed their trust ALONE in Christ for their salvation.
"For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. " (Ephesians 2:8-10, NASB)
2) Healing, gifts, and all that mean NOTHING if the soul is gong to burn in hell. And as Christ admonishes us:
"And He summoned the crowd with His disciples, and said to them, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross and follow Me. “For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake and the gospel’s will save it. “For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world, and forfeit his soul? “For what will a man give in exchange for his soul? “For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will also be ashamed of him when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels.” (Mark 8:34-38, NASB, emphasis mine)
We need to be careful that we do not desire gifts (such as the ability to heal) as a means to glorify ourselves; because whatever tawdry little "glories" we manage to garner here on this planet will mean NOTHING before the Bema Seat.
What we gather here is no indicator of our standing with the Lord; there are many who are saved who do not have health or riches, and there are those who are clearly of the world who are rich beyond the dreams of avarice. If money and health were the signs of one's standing with God, then there would be many in this world who would be a testimony that God's choices in that matter did NOT jive with his word!!!!
And we know this to NOT be true.
Like Micah, I also wonder what your purpose is here: usually, those that join here don't parade the name "pastor" in their user names for all to see. In fact, the best pastors I have known in my life (whom are on this board and to whom I defer when i have questions) never proclaimed themselves such in their names, but instead let their testimony and their love for God attest to that fact.
an adopted son of The Most High God John 6:37-40
Re: Damon Thompson
If Mr Thompson is "the farthest from the so called WOF movement that you can get", then why does he link to them from his website?
Ok, pastor, I'm not going to dissect your last post right now, I'm on a break from my split shift and need rest for the second half, but hopefully I'll get a chance later tonight.
Yeah, I'm here to hang out with siblings in Christ, and part of that is to warn them when I see wolves prowling about. It isn't loving to fail to warn when danger threatens. Also, this thread was started as a request for information and opinions about Mr Thompson, and seeing as how it has festered so long without conclusion I thought it would be worth the risk and trouble to join in.
From my researches last night it is plain to see that Mr Thompson raises concerns in others too, and they have attempted to contact him but can't get through the screen. It is also evident that he has supporters and defenders that are very keen to label anyone not bowing before their idol as pharisees, hypocritical, judgemental, hateful, immature, deluded, paranoid, ignorant, self-seeking, legalistic, unsaved, and even demonic (some of those are from other members of the Thompson fan-club, but thanks for rounding out the repertoire of condemnation and insinuation. Are you a disciple of Alinsky by any chance? Whatever, he would be pleased to see you apply his methods so well).
On the subject of gifts of the Spirit again, I recall writing that these things are dangerous to use as evidence of salvation or authenticity, and I said why. This is not a declaration that all such things are false, nor are they all true, just a big caution to discern which Spirit gave those gifts, for what purpose, and who is benefiting from them. I'll add to that the scariest Scriptures of all, where The Lord declares to those that cast out demons in His Name, healed the sick, prophesied in His Name and did many mighty works and even called Him Lord, but He never knew them and commanded these wicked to depart to perdition. That clearly warns that works and signs and professions are not guarantees of salvation. Keep in mind also His warning that many would come in His Name, declaring He is Christ, but would lead many astray. So, it takes more than someone saying nice stuff about Jesus or claiming to heal folks to convince me they really are a brother. As a point of interest, how many folks throw away their wheelchairs and guidedogs, or have visible evidence of being healed at these wonderful gatherings? The Lord healed folks with dropsy and leprosy and withered limbs, so that nobody present was in any doubt what just happened. That sort of evidence seems to be conscpicuously lacking from the kinds of miracle workers I come across in these little mole-hunts I get dragged into. And what of prophecy, how is it that Paul wrote in his letter to Timothy that the Scriptures are complete, yet now we need specially anointed folks giving new revelation and anointings and empowerings? And what of the glaringly obvious dominionist references, that Ramp website is clear as a bell as to what they are doing. Wow, are they going to be disappointed when The Lord raptures them right in the middle of such important work. Maybe He'll leave them down here to finish the job. Or maybe not, seeing as how He builds it, brings it with Him at His return and gives it to His children. All born-again believers get raptured, there is no merit scale to see who earned the priviledge of going. Even those that are genuinely saved but don't believe or know about the rapture are going, wow, what a kind, gracious and forgiving God we have. Anyone left behind was not a member of the Bride, and that means lost as hell. So, thanks for the attempt to sow fear and condemnation, but no, you're wrong and that trick isn't working any more. I had to point that out since there will be others reading this.
On those points, please don't mention Mr Thompson as a brother of mine; I wish he were, but on the evidence I've seen so far I'll err on the side of caution and either wait until clear evidence to the contrary is presented, or the man comes on this forum/thread and introduces himself and convinces me. Until either of those things happen; if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, looks like a duck, well, its a duck, and I'll say so. I would love to be shown that I'm wrong, but trying to intimidate and isolate me by threats and insults and insinuations isn't going to do anything more than make me look at him and you all the more closely and point out exactly what is such a worry.
Now, I hope to get around to answering your earlier post later, and also ferret about in the circles Mr Thompson frequents to see which of his friends or colleagues bears your initials, because I'm getting more and more curious as to who you are and what you're up to here. It's going to be tedious to pick apart that post, as well as supply Scripture references to show why Mr Thomson & Co are such a worry to me to make me even bother participating further in this thread.
As to having unity, that is solely based upon the Person of Jesus Christ, not on doctrine....but what folks are teaching gives a good indication of where they really come from. The first demon possessed man The Lord met was in church, remember, and he said nice things about Him. Seeing as how these are very dangerous times, and wolves in sheeps clothing look like sheep, being cautious is Biblically wise. As I stated before, if I'm wrong say so, I crave correction, but leave out the bully tactics please. This isn't the first stoush about Mr Thompson, so excuse me if I skip the "formalities" that I see paraded on other sites and speak rather more plainly than I usually do. That said, I need sleep; this aged care lark is no picnic. See you later.
Moderator
Re: Damon Thompson
Yes, they stand in opposition to what we all view as a soft, easy message that purports to be the gospel but isn't. But rather than preaching a true gospel, they preach another false one. Just listen to their sermons and read their writings. Like the Mormons, much (sometimes nearly all) they say sounds oh so good. In fact it is scripture. But then the subtle deception slides in. Remember it was Mr.Thompson who in his mountaintop sermon says John's gospel is not really a gospel but a revelation and that in it God is revealing that He is not monotheistic. And that was only one of the errors that he spoke in that sermon. And do you recall the great "The Call" event of July 7, 2007 (in Nashville as I remember) in which Karen Wheaton, Rick Joyner, and others joined Dutch Sheets? A statement from Dutch and Rick used jointly in their advertising for this event said, "THE TRUE SOLDIERS OF THE CROSS ARE MOBILIZING. THE CHURCH IS ABOUT TO BE CLOTHED WITH A BEAUTY THAT IS BEYOND THIS WORLD!" This Rick Joyner is the same guy who teaches that there is a portal between earth and heaven through which you can travel back and forth! I recall in one of these transports to Heaven he recounts that he met with the apostle Paul. Paul apologized to him for having failed in his ministry and not having done all God wanted him to do! Say what??? The one who finished the course (2 Timothy 4:7) and on whose hands there was the blood of no man? Yet he failed? He did NOT finish his course?There are false prophets abounding in the body of Christ who are crying peace, safety and love for everyone. They are preaching a soft, easy message and deceiving millions who want to be deceived. People like Damon Thompson stand in direct opposition to them and thank God for it.
As to the Ramp itself, have you not read the current statement on their constantly revamped website that says, ""The Ramp’s intent is to summon the youth of the nations to the reality of Jesus Christ and to equip them to impose His Kingdom"?
My friend, if you wish to associate with these preachers and their message, then use the free will that God gave you. But please do not come here and try to promote them or defend them. There is far too much error in that crowd, and not peripheral error. I mean fundamental error that will lead the Church away from its role and entangle it in a false purpose, a false practice and a false proclamation.
In conclusion, I noticed that in one of your posts above you state: "I look forward to the rapture of the church and strongly believe most will not be counted worthy to make it out on the first boat...." cripture is clear that if you are "in Christ" you are saved, you are His, and it further makes clear that all who are His go in the Rapture. Only those who are NOT His do not, can not, go. Either we are saved by grace through faith in Christ, either He did the work, or His work is insufficient and we must add to it. By your statement, then, you are clearly stating your belief that salvation is by works. And please do not resort to Luke 21:36 where Jesus says "pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things". The oldest and best manuscripts do not have the aorist passive indicative (καταξιωθῆτε) of καταἀξιόω "to be, or to consider, worthy" but the present active subjunctive (κατισχύσητε) of κατισχύω "to have strength against, to be strong against." This latter fits better with the totality of the salvation and sanctification scriptures which teach us to stand, rather than this one variant καταἀξιόω which teaches us we need to be worthy.
But even if you insist that the TR should be followed, that all other texts are in error, then that still does not alter the issue. IF we are worthy, HOW are we worthy? Scripture is clear that the only worthiness, the only holiness, the only righteousness that we possess is that which we have IN CHRIST. He alone is worthy, He alone is holy, He alone is righteous. So if we are in Him, then indeed we are worthy ... and will be so accounted.
It is all of faith, and none of works. All of God,and none of me.
Finally, and with respect, may I suggest you consider removing the "pastor" in your user name? There are a number of pastors here on RF. None of them uses the title. To call oneself pastor gives the impression of trying to command a certain respect and authority, but actually only gives others the impression of pride in the title ... the very antithesis of the attitude commanded us in Scripture (Philippians 2:3). If you would like it changed, please pm me with the name you would like and I will change it for you.
In Christ.
Matt
-------"You are not your own; you are bought with a price." —1 Corinthians 6:19b-20a
------
Citizen
Re: Damon Thompson
AMEN!
an adopted son of The Most High God John 6:37-40
Re: Damon Thompson
Work changed my schedule at a moment's notice, so it's back to work again at 6:30 am tomorrow, another split shift. I could make the effort to deliver on what I hoped in my last post, but I'm a wreck as it is and tomorrow is going to be another grinder. Anyone mind if I put it off a couple of days until I can make a proper job of it? It seems this is a topic of some importance, and worthy of airing out good and proper. Adrian's post above stated a lot of what I was going to say anyway, so I'll pray and sleep on it and consider what, if anything, I have left to say.
Pushing anger and ill-feeling far away, recognising that the evil one must be chuckling about the bloodletting and potential for mischief in this thread and the continued deceptions sown by the group we're discussing, and hoping we can resolve this and rejoice together in The Lord and His glory. In the Family of God, admitted and joined by grace through the gift of faith in The Lord Jesus Christ, we are not to shoot our wounded, we are to extend the offer of repentance and amnesty to the members of the other family, but traitors and infiltrators and impostors are not going to get an easy ride, seeing as how they deliberately seek to destroy souls and neutralise the defence. Peace be with you, see you soon.
Administrator
Re: Damon Thompson
We've got the username all worked out now.
Fleethewrath2come
Re: Damon Thompson
Holy Moly, I could CRY in frustration
Damon, again is a GREAT speaker, but his gifting and skills are only to be aligned with the true calling...
God, called a Balaam's donkey to do what Damon does
He preached IN FRONT of a youth group but never addressed them, His target audience was the TV
SAD but true
not that his message was that bad, but his method was OBVIOUS,.....let me preach to the tv monitor's
total JOKE
and SAD
it would be like Michael Jordan hosting a youth bball camp and acting like he was hanging with youth but then playing like his audience was adults
Damon want's to preach to the choir then act like he's on the front lines
then Go to Mardi Gras
Or to Spring Break and preach that way, THEN .....make sure his message aligns with scripture
He can hang with TBN for sure, but unfortunately .....can he hang with scripture??
He don't YET
Romans 13:11 This is all the more urgent, for you know how late it is; time is running out. Wake up, for our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed. 12 The night is almost gone; the day of salvation will soon be here.
Fleethewrath2come
Re: Damon Thompson
Jeff,
I can understand your "zealous allegiance" VERY well
I was so there once, and I mean very there
was "baptist born and raised" and very devoutly so
In 1989, introduced the Holy Spirit "baptism" ..as a Prodigal came home
Carman, Rod Parsley, Dwight Thompson, Momma Parsley, Lester Sumrall
I could list quite a list and go on for hours, I was SENT to Bible School in Tulsa Ok....My first "Sermon" was preached in Tulsa
was sucked in, hook, line an sinker
I mean I was "in" DEEP
got to preach at some big big conferences....
once preached in Grand Island,NE and over 300 people came forward to accept Christ
Went to Brownsville,Fl during it's peak
but in the midst of all that I witnessed the REAL and the UN-real
I do NOT care how gifted or bold you speak from BEHIND a pulpit
It's NOT your eloquence or entrance but rather your realness
Damon, as gifted as he seems, and I don't judge him by any of that
but I am called to judge his allegiance
If you can endorse Benny Hinn?? or Rod Parsley?? or Kim Clement??
then I HAVE to take issue
Benny Hinn's a false prophet, PERIOD,
Kim Clement, FALSE PROPHET.......PERIOD
IF You preach like John the Baptist, but ENDORSE false Prophets......what does that make YOU???
Last edited by soundingthealarm; September-12th-2010 at 11:52 AM.
Romans 13:11 This is all the more urgent, for you know how late it is; time is running out. Wake up, for our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed. 12 The night is almost gone; the day of salvation will soon be here.
Administrator
Re: Damon Thompson
Jeff, I think you need to move on from the username issue.I appreciate your response and your lack of questioning my motives. It shows a level of maturity that is not seen often among critics. Perhaps you could have left out the comments about my online ID but I can understand your recommendation. I could say the same thing about the picture of you suited up connected to your post. Perhaps you wanted people to see your age and dignity so they would respect you more or perhaps you just threw a picture of yourself on here without a second thought as I did my long time ID. You also have moderator under your name. I doubt you have thought about that but it gives you status and can be intimidating to some. Maybe you should use a separate ID just to moderate so no one will think you are prideful or trying to intimidate when you are participating in discussions. I try not to read into stuff like that too much and to be honest don't really care about all that.
We are saved by grace through faith, not works, lest any man boast. The thief on the Cross did not have time to do good works, etc. There's a difference between justification and sanctification. Justification is a one moment event. Sanctification takes place over time. Justification (or union) is when you get saved, sanctification (or fellowship) is the process of living a more godly life after being saved. Sanctification is of itself not a part of Justification.If this scripture is dealing with the rapture and escaping the great tribulation as most believe it is then it does not matter whether you say you need “strength” to escape or “worthiness” to escape. Either way it would contradict the notion that all professing believers will escape the tribulation no matter how they are living their lives when it transpires. There are certainly no scriptures to support such a notion.
Are you OSAS or OSnAS??
Our righteousness is not of our own, God's righteousness is imputed to us by grace through faith in Jesus. Again, it is important to understand justification (or union) and sanctification (or fellowship).I believe wholeheartedly that only true faith and true faith alone can access the grace to be delivered from the power of sin and death but true faith produces true righteousness and true works and truly will get us ready to meet the King who is coming for those doing His will and no others.
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