Father' and 'Son' Ousted from the Trinity in New Bible Translations

[arapahoepark]

This is what we do to somehow appease Muslims to the faith, make it more palatable. Yet it tastes like vomit:

Apprising Minsitries does what we can to stay on the cutting edge of news and trends within the church visible during this time of growing apostasy.

Man-centered church growth techniques and misguided missions ideas have contributed much to confusion and timid tolerance.

With this in mind let me point you to ‘Father’ and ‘Son’ Ousted from the Trinity in New Bible Translations.

Therein Yahoo News contributor Hussein Hajji Wario, himself a former Sunni Muslim, informs us:

A controversy is brewing over three reputable Christian organizations, which are based in North America, whose efforts have ousted the words “Father” and “Son” from new Bibles. Wycliffe Bible Translators, Summer Institute of Linguistics (SIL) and Frontiers are under fire for “producing Bibles that remove “Father,” “Son” and “Son of God” because these terms are offensive to Muslims.”

Concerned Christian missionaries, Bible translators, pastors, and national church leaders have come together with a public petition to stop these organizations. They claim a public petition is their last recourse because meetings with these organizations’ leaders, staff resignations over this issue and criticism and appeals from native national Christians concerned about the translations “have failed to persuade these agencies to retain “Father” and “Son” in the text of all their translations.”

Biblical Missiology, a ministry of Boulder, Colorado-based Horizon International, is sponsoring the petition.

The main issues of this controversy surround new Arabic and Turkish translations. Here are three examples native speakers give:

First, Wycliffe and SIL have produced Stories of the Prophets, an Arabic Bible that uses an Arabic equivalent of “Lord” instead of “Father” and “Messiah” instead of “Son.”

Second, Frontiers and SIL have produced Meaning of the Gospel of Christ , an Arabic translation which removes “Father”in reference to God and replaces it with “Allah,” and removes or redefines “Son.” For example, the verse which Christians use to justify going all over the world to make disciples, thus fulfilling the Great Commission (Matthew 28:19) reads, “Cleanse them by water in the name of Allah, his Messiahand his Holy Spirit” instead of “baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.” Rev. Bassam Maday, an Arab American who runs Middle East Resources, terms these organization’s efforts as “a western imperialistic attempt that’s inspired by cultural anthropology, and not by biblical theology.”

Third, Frontiers and SIL have produced a new Turkish translation of the Gospel of Matthew that uses Turkish equivalents of “guardian” for “Father” and “representative” or “proxy” for “Son.” To Turkish church leader Rev. Fikret Böcek, “This translation is ‘an all-American idea’ with absolutely no respect for the ‘sacredness’ of Scripture, or even of the growing Turkish church.”

SIL has issued a public response stating “all personnel subscribe to a statement of faith which affirms the Trinity, Christ’s deity, and the inspiration of Scripture.” However, in the same statement, which is similar to Wycliffe’s, it claims “word-for-word translation of these titles would communicate an incorrect meaning (i.e. that God had physical, sexual relationships with Mary) [sic],” thus justifying substituting “Father” and “Son” in new translations. Calls and emails to Wycliffe and SIL to clarify their positions were not returned. Frontiers responded to calls with articles that critics have already dismissed as skirting omissions of “Father” and “Son” in new Bible translations. (Online source)

[arapahoepark]

Seems they are going for an Arian approach by dropping the clear language

[melanie]

A controversy is brewing over three reputable Christian organizations, which are based in North America, whose efforts have ousted the words "Father" and "Son" from new Bibles. Wycliffe Bible Translators, Summer Institute of Linguistics (SIL) and Frontiers are under fire for "producing Bibles that remove "Father," "Son" and "Son of God" because these terms are offensive to Muslims."

'Father' and 'Son' Ousted from the Trinity in New Bible Translations - Yahoo! News

[livin_in_the_Son]

Excuse me, maybe I'm confused, or read the OP wrong....but WHY would ANY bible translation care about offending muslims? If I'm not mistaken, muslims DON'T read the bible, and considering the tenets of their faith, would find the WHOLE BIBLE offensive!?! Please come SOON Jesus...this world has gone into the cess-pool.

[readyforhome]

I find the very thought of this offensive to me. When is this kowtowing going to stop? I agree with the above statements. Why should anyone be worried about offending Muslims with the Bible when they don't read it? Don't they have the Koran? Quran or however they like to spell it. They can keep these new Bibles to themselves. I won't be reading it. I already have two copies here at home.

[FaithInChrist]

I posted this on my facebook a bit ago. I am just shocked. Taking away the wording of The Father and the son lessens the relationship between God and Christ in the Trinity. The words they use translate into Allah, The Messiah and Holy Spirit. The relationship is gone. I do not understand why The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit is offensive. Apparently it is American "Christians" who have made these changes and not requests that have been made from the areas these Bibles are going. Shame on those publishers, shame, shame, shame.

[mattfivefour]

More emergent seeker-sensitive nonsense. That is man's way. God's way is quite different. The FULL gospel is to be preached, not some watered down version. Paul didn't remove terms offensive to Jews or Greeks,: he preached it all. Otherwise he would not have been beaten, jailed and stoned. The gospel is not man made, it was God delivered (Galatians 1:11-12). How DARE man think he can improve upon it!!! The gospel of Jesus Christ as laid out in the bible is the very power of God. (Romans 1:16) Who is man that he thinks his wisdom is greater than God's? Or that by removing items from the gospel he is not also removing its power?

SHAME on Wycliffe!!! They should know better. Unfortunately they get many of their leaders from the major seminaries that are now so infested with false teachers who love in their puffed up intellects to cast doubt on the veracity and reliability of scripture as it is written. Too bad, because Jesus defeated Satan in his flesh every time by the words "It is written."

[mikhen7]

More emergent seeker-sensitive nonsense. That is man's way. God's way is quite different. The FULL gospel is to be preached, not some watered down version. Paul didn't remove terms offensive to Jews or Greeks,: he preached it all. Otherwise he would not have been beaten, jailed and stoned. The gospel is not man made, it was God delivered ( Galatians 1:11-12). How DARE man think he can improve upon it!!! The gospel of Jesus Christ as laid out in the bible is the very power of God. (Romans 1:16) Who is man that he thinks his wisdom is greater than God's? Or that by removing items from the gospel he is not also removing its power?

SHAME on Wycliffe!!! They should know better. Unfortunately they get many of their leaders from the major seminaries that are now so infested with false teachers who love in their puffed up intellects to cast doubt on the veracity and reliability of scripture as it is written. Too bad, because Jesus defeated Satan in his flesh every time by the words "It is written."

I know a lady that just finished her linguistics at Wheaton U and is planning on working for Wycliffe. I cannot preach, speak, or study Scripture with her because anything you sayto her she rips to pieces even to the point of completely invalidating what we read in the Bible. It sounds to me, as emergent as it may be, that these folks have lost sight of the Great Commission. Only Christ can bring salvation to a soul and only His Word as delivered to us can slice an dice the heart turning a person toward God through faith in Christ and repentance of sin.

It seems there new mission is to reach numbers but not souls. Even the dyed-in-the-wool Muslims will be able to see through the smokescreen just as evolutionists do when some try to make the Bible line up with evolution. I have seen many an evolutionists making a laughingstock of Christians who do this. It will all backfire in the end.

Think about the Magi from the east. Where did they get the Biblical wisdom? They new the King would come from Israel. Their teachers (possibly-most likely, disciples of Daniel were their instructors) did not cloak the truth. They new a King would be BORN and SON would be given! Praise God in Heaven!!!


God Bless!!!

[Chris]

I was thinking about this as my mother emailed me about it. In Islam the prominent saying is something along the lines of "Allah has no son and Mohammed is his messenger". Of course this is nothing but Grade A "buffalo bagels" as Mohammed was not a prophet, just a pedophile.

But it seems to me that these Bible sellers are appeasing the Islamists because the Bible is clear that God has a Son in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. It is central to the Christian faith. Jesus died for our sins on the Cross, was buried, raised on the third day, and now sits in Heaven with the Father. The Islamists don't like this because it is contrary to their beliefs and it is absolutely mindboggling that these 3 prominent publishers would pander to pagan religions by changing something so central to our belief. It is to me another sign of the apostasy that is going on and will continue to go on until the Lord comes for us. May that happen soon because this cess pool of a planet we live on is just sickening.

[readyforhome]

This does remind me of the more "politically correct" version of the Bible that I had already heard about. Where things got changed from fishers of men to fishers of people. Though this is the same thing, men meaning mankind. But whatever, people are doing whatever they can to disparage and discredit the Bible, Jesus and Christianity. Be it Pagans, atheists or otherwise.

[Meg]

Here's the link to the petition. I signed.

Education Petition: Lost In Translation: Keep "Father" & "Son" in the Bible | Change.org

[Meg]

Matthew 24:24

24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible.

[mikhen7]

Here's the link to the petition. I signed.

Education Petition: Lost In Translation: Keep "Father" & "Son" in the Bible | Change.org

I signed it as well. Thanks Meg for posting!!
God Bless!!!

[mattfivefour]

I signed it, too.

[LivnForChrist]

I signed it as well Meg.

[arapahoepark]

I know a lady that just finished her linguistics at Wheaton U and is planning on working for Wycliffe. I cannot preach, speak, or study Scripture with her because anything you sayto her she rips to pieces even to the point of completely invalidating what we read in the Bible.

I am truly lost here why does she rip it to pieces and how?

Btw, the Muslims will think less of us for doing such things anyway. To them scripture is so sacred to them, altering it is blasphemy. So they are thinking why would they change their own scriptures? We should have the same view, probably the only thing we can learn from them in this instance.

[mikhen7]

I am truly lost here why does she rip it to pieces and how?

Btw, the Muslims will think less of us for doing such things anyway. To them scripture is so sacred to them, altering it is blasphemy. So they are thinking why would they change their own scriptures? We should have the same view, probably the only thing we can learn from them in this instance.

Dear Brother, you are so correct!! To answer your first question and to be quite blunt, it is because that is what she has been taught in College. From what I have seen and witnessed,many of today's colleges and seminaries (NOT ALL, at least those that know there is a problem with some teachers) are in a rut because of tenure policies. Liberalism has been around a long time in the world but really picked up steam in American Christian universities in the 60's and 70's. What happened is it became Politically Correct to support evolution "theistically," free choice, and other unscriptural biases to include the Documentary hypothesis as a way to prove the Bible we have is really not inspired like we are told. They even go as far as taking myth such as "the Gilgamesh Epic" as more truthful that the creation and flood accounts in Scripture. They do this because, again, they do not believe in the inspiration of Scripture. They believe the Bibles authors borrowed what is written from pagan culture. It is a shame. I feel this is done because they really have never had an experience with God or they just are unbelievers in disguise. That said, it is easy for young adults (impressionable) who find going on to Bible college and seminary as a high ideal, become enamored with these scholars. As a result they graduate spewing forth the same stuff they were taught.

Josh McDowell wrote "Evidence that Demands a Verdict" vols. 1 & 2 to fight against this very thing. He has a new book out now called "The Unshakable Truth" that is also worth a read. Here is a link to some downloads -->Free Book Downloads-JMM I have not read them all but I have read a lot of his stuff and his testimony for becoming a Christian is amazing

When I went to College and took Seminary instruction, I knew ahead of time "Whom I believed" and no scholar this side of heaven could tell me anything otherwise. When Christ came into my life and Baptized me in the Spirit He made Himself so real to me that nothing will ever be able to shake my opinion otherwise. I believe every Word written that has been passed down through the ages to us today is indeed the pure truth. I have no time for those who choose to tear it down. I told my professors straight up at the beginning of classes that if I disagreed with theology I would respectfully state why and would back it up with clear contextual usage of the Scripture. They agreed that if I could back it up in a convincing manner they would not downgrade me. They held true to their promises and I graduated with very high scores even if they disagreed.

What I learned was what not to learn and in the process became more spiritually discerning than ever. God promises us that if we will faithfully trust Him and hold true to Scripture He will hold true to bringing favor into our lives.

Wycliffe translators and others are not all bad. It seems in this case that the wrong people are in the positions of leadership and the decisions being made are not from a pure hearts love for God. We need to pray for them. Last year I had a run in with a Greek Professor from a very popular Seminary in IL. I was at a Mens evangelistic event and dinner and he sat down across a table from me. I had a friend who I was sharing Christ with and we were enthusiastically looking at some Scripture. The Bible I was using was a NKJV. Out of the Blue this professor (Who I did not know) started ripping my Bible to pieces. He said why in the world am I trying to read from that piece of trash. He then reached over looked at my NT and pushed it back at me across the table. I said something to the effect of "I beg your pardon." He said I am a Greek professor, Dr. so and so and that translation comes from faulty manuscripts full of error. I said, "Oh really, What one do you read?" He said, "NIV?" and went on about how it is the only correct version. I then, as nicely as I could, said, "Well the manuscript that version is based upon is only partially complete. Most of the text (uncial) was used by monks to start fireplaces in St. Catherine's monastery. So how can you tell me it is the correct version?" I then proceeded to tell him I studied Greek in college as well. He was taken back, because I knew of the history of the MS and did not have a come back, he just walked away. But it is people like that that can ruin students if they are themselves unsure of what they believe. Personally, I think there are too many translations in English and it has become a money making game by publishers. When I read from a version of Scripture part of the congregation cannot follow because their translation words it so differently, Some even miss the reading all together trying to find where I am at. Some may disagree, but I think Satan can use that to his advantage. All of that said it depends on who you read when you take a stand upon which version to use. More and more light has been shed upon the opinion that the Alexandrian MS Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Vaticanus (used in NIV) may not be the oldest and that Byzantine texts are found to be just as old making some suggest the two cited may be heretical since 5000+ MSS of the Byz. exist compared to two of the two mentioned.

Sorry to get long-winded and even go off-topic some, but I hold the Scripture very dear to my heart and defiling it in anyway turns my stomach, so what Wycliffe is doing God will judge.

God Bless!!!

One last thing, "Can I use the NIV to lead someone to Christ?" Certainly I can. I was just using it as an example of controversy. cp. Acts 8:35-38 for one example.

[Robert]

I signed the petition as well.

And as for what these publishers are doing to scripture; those running these firms have made a bad mistake:

"And He was saying to them all, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross daily and follow Me. For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake, he is the one who will save it. For what is a man profited if he gains the whole world, and loses or forfeits himself? For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when He comes in His glory, and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels." Luke 9:23-26, NASB, emphasis mine)


For what it is worth: trying to appease someone is merely telling them what they want to hear. The basis of the Gospel requires us to tell folks the very thing they don't want to hear: that without Jesus Christ, they cannot approach God and thus have no way to heaven. This means, good works, magical underwear (sorry Mormons), magazine subscriptions (sorry JW's), donations, "being a nice person", following all the Mosaic laws and last of all, following Mohammed and memorizing the Qur'an won't do a thing to save you.

The Gospel is a scandal and an offense to wicked man: it shows the "emperor" to have no "new clothes" and is naked, rains on man's parade, wakes his guilty conscience from its' self-imposed slumber and prods his tainted soul with the red-hot poker of conviction from the Holy Spirit that is meant to send him before his knees before the One True God....


... and this is where Jesus Christ finds us when He knocks on the door of our hearts and wants to come in.

[IamPJ]

I signed the petition also.

[mattfivefour]

Also, as a Turkish Pastor in Izmir wrote when he signed the petition: “I am a Turkish Pastor and I don't wan't to use this wrong translation in my church. How dare they can publish such a wrong translation and distribute it in my country? Already Muslims in my country believe that the Bible is changed by men and these mission agencies are making it harder for us!” This is true. One of the tenets of Islam is that man has changed the true wording of God's Word and that is why God gave the Qur'an So by chang9ing His Word in the present Wycliffe is actually lending credence to the Muslim claim that it was also done in the past. Has none of them at Wycliffe stopped to think of that???