Magic Circles Taught by Zondervan & Seeker pastor Mark Batterson

[billiefan2000]

Are Magic Circles Being Taught by Zondervan & Mark Batterson??


Watch this video and ask yourself a few questions:

Why would Zondervan, a Christian publishing company, be publishing a book and small group curriculum based on a story from the Jewish Mishnah?

What exactly is the difference between what Batterson and Zondervan are promoting and a Magic Circle?

Where does the Bible teach us to employ "Prayer Circles"?

Where does the Bible teach us that if we employ Prayer Circles that God will multiply miracles to us?

[LivnForChrist]

When he drew that chalk circle on the floor...that just looked Satanic.

That stuff is totally extrabiblical and should totally ignored.

[billiefan2000]

When he drew that chalk circle on the floor...that just looked Satanic.

That stuff is totally extrabiblical and should totally ignored.

I agree livn. not surprised at this though. the seeker church movement will promote anything and are anti-discernment

that is why so many seeker driven christians are so spirtually messed up

cause of folks like Batterson promoting false teachings

[GlennO]

Bill said:

I agree livn. not surprised at this though. the seeker church movement will promote anything and are anti-discernment that is why so many seeker driven christians are so spirtually messed up

Bill - Do you find many seeker-types here at the RF ??

It would be great if you could find an audience that would benefit from your constant feed of "discernment news".

As for myself your "discernment news" is as a continual dropping on a very rainy day.

[readyforhome]

Uhm, magic circles? I'm postitive the Bible is plain on the subject of witchcraft and people dabbling in magic. The old testament was REALLY clear, "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live." That if its not of God then its of Satan. Pretty cut and dried if you ask me.

[billiefan2000]

Bill said:

Bill - Do you find many seeker-types here at the RF ??

It would be great if you could find an audience that would benefit from your constant feed of "discernment news".

As for myself your "discernment news" is as a continual dropping on a very rainy day.

there are seeker driven and emergent types do watch these posts a lot.

the day false teachers stop leading people astray, will be the day I stop doing "discernment news".


btw: no one is forcing anytone to read my posts.

[BuzzardHut]

Bill said:

Bill - Do you find many seeker-types here at the RF ??

It would be great if you could find an audience that would benefit from your constant feed of "discernment news".

As for myself your "discernment news" is as a continual dropping on a very rainy day.

Members are not the only ones reading our pages; apostasy must be exposed.

[billiefan2000]

The Circle Maker


• Christian Not Welcome Sign in the Public Square
• Is God Going to Raise Up a Leader to Save Us From Capitalism?
• Mark Batterson's New Book "The Circle Maker"
• Sermon Review, Vision 2011, by Ritchie Miller, Avalon Church


Fighting for the Faith: The Circle Maker

[billiefan2000]

btw


local wca church in omaha nebraska known for pushing false teachers and being anti-discernment (a church that btw has a somewhat ironic name considering false teachers it has promoted)


did a sermon based on mark batterson's book the other day and promoted favorably the book





sad the willow creek association churches have thrown out DISCERNMENT

in the name of being apostate, I mean hip and cool and relevant

[morata rapia]

billyfan, I would say thank you for posting these things.

The "Church" has been infiltrated, and no one seems to see it, and those involved certainly don't see it.

This has been an ongoing process for a long time now and is now critical. It's mind boggling. It's deception at it's finest.

[billiefan2000]

billyfan, I would say thank you for posting these things.

The "Church" has been infiltrated, and no one seems to see it, and those involved certainly don't see it.

This has been an ongoing process for a long time now and is now critical. It's mind boggling. It's deception at it's finest.

ur welcome. and u are right about the state of the church





I know some WCA and other seeker/emergent type church's leaders for sure in my town of Omaha



are knowingly keeping people in the dark and only telling half-truths cause I have had people confront them
and they got angry (as some of them called it) about using those odmers info when it came to some false teachers



that and the far left anti-discernment pressure groups that work and spin online for many seeker and emergent and WOF folks they work for who try to cover-up or spin anything controversial about seeker and emergent and WOF folks

is another problem why many churches are in such a mess.



if a pastor needs a anti-discernment group to spin what he says, that should be a red flag, that pastor is a false teacher.





for some leaders in the churches, it is knowingly covering up the truth that is happening and to some extent, a willful ignorance on some covering up the truth.





others, they dont know the whole story about some folks being promoted cause they dont know there are those in their own churches knowingly covering up some facts on some false teachers

[Meg]

When he drew that chalk circle on the floor...that just looked Satanic.

That stuff is totally extrabiblical and should totally ignored.

I had the same reaction. Didn't watch the whole thing, but I did clearly hear Batterson say its not enough to "just read the Bible". I will now be boycotting Zondervan.

[KR McKay]

"Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons…" - 1 Timothy 4:1

"But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed." -- 2 Peter 2:1-2

"How long will this be in the heart of the prophets who prophesy lies? Indeed they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart, who try to make My people forget My name by their dreams which everyone tells his neighbor, as their fathers forgot My name for Baal." -- Jeremiah 23:26-27

"And the LORD said to me, “The prophets prophesy lies in My name. I have not sent them, commanded them, nor spoken to them; they prophesy to you a false vision, divination, a worthless thing, and the deceit of their heart." -- Jeremiah 14:14

"Thus says the Lord GOD: “Woe to the foolish prophets, who follow their own spirit and have seen nothing!" -- Ezekiel 13:3

[KR McKay]

When he drew that chalk circle on the floor...that just looked Satanic.

That stuff is totally extrabiblical and should totally ignored.

I was half-expecting him to go ahead and put a pentagram inside the circle...

[morata rapia]

ur welcome. and u are right about the state of the church

I know some WCA and other seeker/emergent type church's leaders for sure in my town of Omaha

are knowingly keeping people in the dark and only telling half-truths cause I have had people confront them
and they got angry (as some of them called it) about using those odmers info when it came to some false teachers

that and the far left anti-discernment pressure groups that work and spin online for many seeker and emergent and WOF folks they work for who try to cover-up or spin anything controversial about seeker and emergent and WOF folks

is another problem why many churches are in such a mess.

if a pastor needs a anti-discernment group to spin what he says, that should be a red flag, that pastor is a false teacher.

for some leaders in the churches, it is knowingly covering up the truth that is happening and to some extent, a willful ignorance on some covering up the truth.

others, they dont know the whole story about some folks being promoted cause they dont know there are those in their own churches knowingly covering up some facts on some false teachers

The cleverness of the deception process is nothing less that genius. It is one thing to have groups that spring up, some for many years now and very established. But this is within what was once "solid ground"...and nothing less than a genius plan. It is difficult to even comprehend until you actually see it and experience it, or rather experience those of it. It is well hidden, those that don't tell the truth knowingly, and those who are sincerely blinded and believing.

[billiefan2000]

side note:


FFTF radio did a Sermon Review recently of the sermon "Circle Maker: Desperate Measures" by Mark Batterson


http://0352182.netsolhost.com/F4F020912.mp3

Fighting for the Faith: Hide Your Kids, Hide Your Wife



it is a worth hear/ open plea to (the folks at Lifegate Church of Omaha and other churches) who are doing sermons based on Batterson 's teachings

to listen to, that gives a fair and balanced review of Batterson's teachings

[peacebringer]

Actually, I think this post and concerns are a bit reactionary. Note, I have not read Circle Maker or Soul Print so cannot speak to the content. My guess is anyone else reacting as not. The concern in title starts with "seeker" pastor. Now I have read Primal and Wild Goose Chase and both are sound theologically and call for greater commitment and pursuit of God. Primal is a worthwhile read.

Now given the concerns outlined hear, took a perusal of Amazon reviews- there are some positive with good points and some negative. There are reasons to see that he is pushing toward persistance and importance of prayer and some where emphasizing big and self. I guess difficulty starts with the drawing from the Jewish legend and his own spin and stories which can be viewed negatively. Overall, this may be the work and thoughts of man who has good intentions and desire to stir prayer but as we all can get things muddled up in self.

At any rate, the person who gave at a 3 start review intereviewed him: Crossleadership Interviews Mark Batterson on his book The Circle Maker

In order to give this sound discernment, there would need to examine the material and indicate what is sound and what is not sound.

[paul&katie]

Sorry making “magick” circles is heretical.

The Unbiblical "Circle Maker" Mark Batterson - Empowered By Christ

The Unbiblical "Circle Maker" Mark Batterson


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It seems that the newest Christian or better put unchristian heretical fad has just debuted earlier this November. What exactly is this new wonderful fad that I'm talking about? It's a better way to get your prayers answered put out by Mark Batterson entitled "The Circle Maker”. As you will see below in the attached video promoting "The Circle Maker” study series, the quickest way increase your blessings is to draw a circle pray in it. In this article we will be looking at and examining what Mark Batterson is promoting in this new study series. I have attached to this article the promotion video found on YouTube for this series so that you too can hear it for yourselves what un-biblical and unorthodox method of prayer Mr. Batterson is promoting in this two-minute and 40 seconds of heresy.



Right out of the gate within the first 30 seconds of the video we are introduced by Mark Batterson to Honi the Circle Maker. One might be asking who is Honi the Circle Maker and why haven't we heard of him before in my Sunday Bible study or better yet my Bible? The reason we have not heard of Honi before in our Bible text is because he is not found in the biblical canon of Scripture. So where did Mr. Batterson get Honi the circle maker from? Well Mr. Batterson had to look to sources outside the canon of Scripture, or the Orthodox codex, to find the Honi, which by the way is only a ledge. To be more specific Batterson had to turn to the Jewish teachings of the Mishnah for his information. The Mishnah is a Jewish oral version of Torah, which is basically equivalent to a story book version of the Torah. The Mishnah is erroneously full of errors and is not highly regarded as accurate within Orthodox Jewish teachings. This why we will not find the Mishnah’s teachings being used as a translation or teaching codex for the Torah. Now the question has to be asked at this point; if Mr. Batterson is getting his information from a non-traditional biblical source, one that is not found to be accurate, then how can we be expected to be praying to the God of the Bible? Answer, we can't. His whole premise is flawed from his beginning in its teaching because he is using an outside un-biblical source to dictate what he 'feels' is a correct method of praying. The unbiblical sloth of Mark Batterson only gets worse as we hear at approximately 40 seconds into the video we are told that "we will learn how to pray in a new way and dream big". Mr. Batterson why do we have to learn how to pray in a new way? I believe we were instructed on the proper way to pray in Matthew 6: 9 – 15;

This, then, is how you should pray: “Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us today our daily bread. And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one. For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.”

Here we see the proper biblical way to pray and nowhere are we instructed to draw a circle around us and pray. Once again in the light of Scripture Mark Batterson’s teachings fail.

Batterson points out at about 48 second mark that we can not just to read the Bible; “we have to circle God's promises and we need to pray wisdom into our lives and that we have to pray circles around our children for power.” Again, the question is; which Scripture and the Bible is this? Oh yeah that's right there isn't any to support Mr. Batterson's erroneous claims.

At the 1:07 mark we are told; “our job is to draw circles in the sand and if we draw the circle God will multiply the blessings and miracle”. I always thought his Christians our job was to preach the great commission and proclaim our Lord Jesus Christ as our Savior, not draw circles in the sand. I guess Mr. Batterson has down a special formula for prayer prayer that God forgot to tell us about in the bible and needs Batterson to explain it to us. I wonder if Mr. Batterson is willing to take what he's preaching and put to the test. Maybe he should go to a dying cancer patient and draw a circle around them and pray for the cancer to be healed. What will he do when they cancer patient is not healed? Maybe he would blame it on the fact that circle wasn't drawn well enough.

At the 1:36 mark we are told; "that our prayers are like time capsules, we never know when or where they will be answered.” Well what we have here is new age mysticism. Our prayers are not like time capsules just waiting to be opened up and have her blessings poured out upon us. God hears the prayers of His elect instantaneously. What Mark Batterson actually is doing here is playing down on the omniscience of God and His sovereignty by saying that God actually did not know what we would've prayed for.

At the 2:00 mark Mr. Batterson says; “ He wish that your small group would turn into a prayer circle, that each one of you would start praying for one another.” That is all fine, but why do we need your book and DVD series to do this? Should we not as a small group already be praying for each other and doing this in accordance to Scripture not in accordance to your booking and DVD series? I don't think we need your mysticism and unscriptural prayer method to pray for each other in our small groups or Bible studies.


In the end of the video Batterson says he will be praying for us. Well I too will be praying for you Mark Batterson that you will repent of this heretical teaching and get back to solid biblical exegesis of the word of God or that he will leave the pulpit altogether and quit making a mockery of the precise communication method that God gave us to talk to Him, Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

As you can see from this promo video Mark Batterson and his "The Circle Maker" DVD and book series is nothing more than new age mysticism wrapped in a feel-good unscriptural methodology for prayer. If I was attending a church that was promoting this material I would be having a strong and him talk with the pastor or small group leader and pointing out the unscriptural practices of this prayer method. The question can be raised if we are not praying biblically will God here our prayers and if god does hear our prayers is it the God of the Bible that is hearing our prayers?

[peacebringer]

Sorry making “magick” circles is heretical.

The Unbiblical "Circle Maker" Mark Batterson - Empowered By Christ

Please provide details of how what is being written, talked about, or described is a "magic circle" Was it simply the drawing a circle on ground in chalk illustrativelly? The challenge here, is if you want to proclaim what someone is writing or teaching there needs to be sound examination of why that is so. What is Pastor Mark Batterson actually teaching? Is it deviate from scripture, is it pointing to other than Jesus? Does it deviate from word of God.

Now I have now watched the promo video complained about as well as the first video session found here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFDgf...3F56A982&lf=iv
Now, having said that, I find him using the "Circle" metaphor a bit heavily. He draws from a story found in the Talmud, Book of Legends of Honi, who engaged in a bold "prayer" drawing a circle and proclaiming to God he wouldn't leave until it rained. Here is the description from Wiki: Circle drawing incident- On one occasion when God did not send rain well into the winter (in the geographic regions of Israel, it rains mainly in the winter), he drew a circle in the dust, stood inside it, and informed God that he would not move until it rained. When it began to drizzle, Honi told God that he was not satisfied and expected more rain; it then began to pour. He explained that he wanted a calm rain, at which point the rain calmed to a normal rain.

So does that sound like a magic circle?



Now, it is not presented a a forumla, but rather a metaphor for engaging in prayer. My problem is it emphasizes the common tendency of self focused prayers. That being said, we are directed to present requests to God. To ask things of God. We are directed to ask boldy. In video, he ends with a challenge to engage in praying for whatever at least once a day for 21 days. He references praying over and through God's promises. His goal is for people to establish a prayer habit.

Let me ask you this, do you "circle" anything in your life, such as important dates on calander or scriptures that are meaningful to you? Are you engaging in "magic circles" when you do that? In essence the "metaphor" of circling is that of placing importance on something. It is making a commitment, recognizing the value.This is the methaphor.

Now my impression without actually purchasing and examing the book myself is that Mark had thoughts and revalation based on story and takes it in turn to teach others the importance of being self-aware of needs and desires as well as God aware of who he is and what He promises and to grow in that. It is promoting people relating to God.

So forgive me if I don't jump on the "oh no a 'seeker sensitive pastor is referring to witchcraft and making magic circles" I don't see it.
Rather, I see a man, communicating what He understands and what he has learned and communicating to others. Is his communciation 100% sound, not really, but he paints a picture of things important in a way others can easily understand. And that is something Mark Batterson tends to do well, take complex thoughts and communciate them in way easy for others to understand. Perhaps that is what makes him "seeker sensitive."

So without reading the book, I have to disagree with the response and reactions here. DOn't see it.

[WalterNZ]

No No No

Now the scary thing about this is we need to watch the spread of this kind of disease I call it..

Bottom line...

ITS NOT BIBLICAL!!!!

end of story