"Your witness..."

[Robert]

When we think of the word "witness", scenes of a courtroom come to mind, with attorneys questioning people on the stand, and a judge presiding over it. Every word is written down, every answer and comment carefully weighed by the judge (and jury if there), and how one conducts themselves on the stand is taken into consideration as well. All in all, the person being questioned is measured in several different ways to see if what they are saying is truthful or not, and many times, a witness id "destroyed' on the stand when their story does not "jive" with the facts at hand.

In ancient times, one's "witness" was very important; in matters regarding the law, a man could not be convicted unless two or three witnesses' testimonies agreed: "At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death." (Deuteronomy 17:6) One's witness against another was of such importance, it shows in the Ten Commandments: "Neither shalt thou bear false witness against thy neighbour." (Deuteronomy 5:20, emphasis mine) Lying could cost an innocent person their life! And like in modern courtrooms, every word was carefully pondered and weighed. (Yes, Jesus was sent to his death by a Sanhedrin that broke 18 or so Jewish laws, and two witnesses that conjured up a story against him.)


Just as in a courtroom then or now, our witness as Christians in this life is under constant scrutiny by those that see and hear everything that we say and do. People come to these forums from other places, and many are not Christians. Many are searching for answers to questions they have. many are seekers or curious. And others, having heard the gospel, are looking for a place to find out more, and perhaps some folks who have travelled the path that they themselves are now about to undertake. And what they see is our posts glaring back at them, for ALL THE WORLD to read....


Every time we post insulting remarks about leaders in office, every time we post about the newest "conspiracy" that WND or any of a dozen of quasi-news agencies slaps together in the boiler rooms that purport to be news offices, ant time we fall prey to fear, uncertainty and doom and post about "holing up" somewhere and stocking enough supplies for the next century (NO, I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT ANYONE HAVING A FULL PANTRY OR FREEZER IN THE BASEMENT), or about the latest guess or suggestion of the AC, our witness goes right out the window. The selfsame people who come here looking for the truth see these posts, and regard us as nothing more than conspiracy-mongers that preach love and forgiveness on one hand, but on the other, call for violence, refuse to pray for our leaders and downright disrespect the offices they hold, and show NONE of the "Christian Love" that we are SUPPOSED to be showing to the world!!!!


If YOU were one of those unsaved coming here and you saw some of what is posted, would YOU want to accept Christ?


A question to ask yourself while we are at it: If Christ HIMSELF were to read what we post here, would we be proud of it, or would we hang our heads in SHAME?

Unfortunately, he already DOES read what is posted here...

Every action and word that we say or write is likewise judged by not only those here on earth that encounter us, but by the Lord himself: "But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment." (Matthew 12:36) For believers, our time will be before Christ at the Bema seat: "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad." (2 Corinthians 5:10)


Is OUR "witness" something we can be proud of at the Bema Seat?



If we purport to have the Love of the Lord in us, and that we are saved by his grace, then we need to be demonstrating the fruit of the spirit. We are NOT saved by these works, but God has given them to us so that we may share them with the rest of the world as evidence of our salvation. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." (Ephesians 2:8-10)

In these closing hours before the Lord comes to take his children home to him, we cannot afford for ONE MOMENT to not use EVERY opportunity given us to spread his word. Every moment, 120 souls slip into eternity; DARE we not to use every bit of that time to be proclaiming his Gospel and precious message of salvation to every creature, as we are commanded in scripture? Yet, not only do our posts contradict what we claim to believe, but our very tone on this board has become cold and callous. Jesus tells us that:" And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold." (Matthew 24:12), and scriptures command us: "And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. "(Romans 12:2)


We have precious little time left; the Lord is closer than many think. This world has gone insane with the recent events happening around us. We need not go insane with it.


YBIC,


-Robert.

[PraisingHimAlways]

Great post, Robert - and I agree with you, 100%.

[open door]

Robert, I understand your post. However, there are many things going on in the world that Christians disagree on. For instance, there is a certain mind-set in favor of socialism as a form of government control - am I to support these posts when I will NEVER accept that type government? Am I to remain silent? I say scripture does NOT support socialism, so I speak against it. Same thing with using guns for self-defense. Many Christians were brought up being taught that guns are evil, so a mind-set against them. I say scripture supports the use of guns for self-defense, so I speak in favor of it. The list of issues go on and on. It is HOW we respond that is key. I admit that I fail in that regard, sometimes. One lady recently said tht we are not to quibble over words. That is very true. Paul taught that, not to quibble or argue over things of little import. However, on matters of doctrinal importance, we ARE to argue (contend) for the faith. I agree l00% that we should be mindful of our posts as they are a witness to the world, and do so in a kind manner. One last thing as to differentiate between an "opinion" and a "belief". Everyone has an opinion based on this or that. A belief, however, HAS to be based on one's interpretation of scripture. Let's stick to scripture.

[mattfivefour]

I think the point is, Troy, that whatever we discuss we should do it as Christians, in a manner described in the Word, and revolving around Christian principles. Yes, there are, as you say, many things in this world that sincere Christians may disagree on. Politics is one. But the MANNER of our disagreement must always be Christ-like ... and scriptural.

I believe it is to that point that Robert was trying to exhort us.

I agree with you regarding our discussions over important scriptural matters-- contending for the truth. But the MANNER again must be in the Spirit of Christ (as James so clearly puts it in James 3:13-18). But also remember that some posts here are not about doctrinal matters but about politics and world view, including hidden conspiracies, etc. While these may have interest for some, they are not important to a Christian's present or future life or their walk. We should therefore be careful as to exactly what non-Biblical topics we should bring up here and particularly, when we do bring them up, we need to be wise in the way we present the topic and the way in which we discuss and debate it.

And it all comes back to the point that I believe Robert is trying to make: let ALL be done here as a WITNESS to our Lord ... including—especially0151the way we handle discussions and disagreements.

Amen, Robert. Your point is well made. I pray those who read your post will understand the point and seek the help of the Holy Spirit in putting it into practice.

[open door]

I agree - just wanted to put some things out there, and for all to understand, and put into practice what they preach. Keep looking up.

[mattfivefour]

I agree - just wanted to put some things out there, and for all to understand, and put into practice what they preach. Keep looking up.

2: my dear brother :)

[mikalikat]

Robert, this was an awesome summary of what some of us have been discussing and will be re-reading this many times, as I hope we all do. This board has become hijacked by some lunacy and right now, in a world that teetering without Jesus, we need to make this board a haven of fellowship. People should come here and feel as though they have crawled right into the lap of our Savior and feel safe. I do find interesting the current politics and world events, as they pertain to prophecy, quite interesting and will continue to post what I think is pertinent, but no matter what we feel for the current president and his hangers-on, we must present our views in a much more humble, peaceful manner. There is nothing wrong with having a full storehouse of food and supplies. However, we don't need little Ruby Ridges popping up all over the place. What does that say to people viewing the threads out of curiousity-that our God cannot handle what we are going through?

Let's make this board once again what it started out to be--a place for fellowship and bringing the lost to Christ, a place to encourage one another and not strike fear into the hearts of people already confused or afraid by this world.

[DespizdNRejectd]

I think the most damaging thing we can do to our collective witness is what happens in pretty much every online community I've ever seen: Christians tearing each other apart over secondary issues. We try to censor each other until we all look like clones or cult members (e.g. "You shouldn't talk like that..."). The Body is not to be a homogenized glob or a wheel with identical spokes. But I know that some unbelievers enter a Christian board just to start a fight and then sit back and laugh as we battle each other instead of the true Enemy.

There is entirely too much back-stabbing, coercion, control, double-standards, and self-centeredness in the Body today. We demand no one ever offends us, in ignorance of "love keeps no record of wrongs". We gore fellow believers for being negative, harsh, "unloving", etc., exhibiting all those characteristics ourselves in the process. We are so paranoid about how the world views us that we become petty control freaks who think unbelievers have the right to dictate our behavior and personalities, as if they are experts on Christian living.

We have to get over ourselves. We need to stop trying to please everyone and just focus on our own witness. If we have a problem with the behavior of another believer, we should take it to them in private messages instead of being like a family that likes to conduct its internal squabbles in the front yard in plain view of all the neighbors. The worst practitioners of these things are those who hate it so much in others.

It was the Pharisees who didn't like Jesus hanging around with "sinners". It was the Pharisees who kept telling Him and his disciples what they should not do or say. It was the Pharisees who considered their own Savior a bigger danger than "Rome". And like the Pharisees, we throw under the bus any believer that doesn't have our own "package".

It is all of this that turns people from the Gospel, not in showing that we are, after all, human like they are. When unbelievers tell us we shouldn't say or do something, we have every right to ask them what makes them authorities of Christian life, and the worst thing that can happen when we do is that fellow believers stab us in the back for not bowing low before said unbelievers.

Peace among Christians is not found in external conformity on every plane, nor in erasing differences in personality and style. It is in focusing on Christ instead of self and its hurts; in uniting over the essentials of the Gospel; in remembering that our enemy is Satan and not each other.

[pistache]

Robert, this was an awesome summary of what some of us have been discussing and will be re-reading this many times, as I hope we all do. This board has become hijacked by some lunacy and right now, in a world that teetering without Jesus, we need to make this board a haven of fellowship. People should come here and feel as though they have crawled right into the lap of our Savior and feel safe. I do find interesting the current politics and world events, as they pertain to prophecy, quite interesting and will continue to post what I think is pertinent, but no matter what we feel for the current president and his hangers-on, we must present our views in a much more humble, peaceful manner. There is nothing wrong with having a full storehouse of food and supplies. However, we don't need little Ruby Ridges popping up all over the place. What does that say to people viewing the threads out of curiousity-that our God cannot handle what we are going through?

Let's make this board once again what it started out to be--a place for fellowship and bringing the lost to Christ, a place to encourage one another and not strike fear into the hearts of people already confused or afraid by this world.

I couldn't agree more.

As believers we have a duty in our speech to demonstrate

• love (that means no name-calling of those we dislike)
• joy (true contentment in all our circumstances)
• peace (resting and dwelling predominantly on the Word, and not on news)
• longsuffering (trusting in Christ and patience when uncertainties arise)
• kindness (building and exhorting one another up in Christ)
• goodness (enjoying wholesome fellowshipping as a united Body)
• faithfulness (committing our forum, our families, our friends, the unsaved, our countries, and our governments to the Lord in prayer)
• gentleness (not being quick to incite fear based on the latest "reports")
• self-control (using discernment and prayer before posting)

It is my prayer that Jesus would find glory in our forum, and that He would not be disappointed in what we post in His name.

[mikalikat]

Excellent points, everyone. Now, let's get to work.

[readytogo]

Excellent post, Robert--again!!!

[readytogo]

As believers we have a duty in our speech to demonstrate

• love (that means no name-calling of those we dislike)
• joy (true contentment in all our circumstances)
• peace (resting and dwelling predominantly on the Word, and not on news)
• longsuffering (trusting in Christ and patience when uncertainties arise)
• kindness (building and exhorting one another up in Christ)
• goodness (enjoying wholesome fellowshipping as a united Body)
• faithfulness (committing our forum, our families, our friends, the unsaved, our countries, and our governments to the Lord in prayer)
• gentleness (not being quick to incite fear based on the latest "reports")
• self-control (using discernment and prayer before posting)

It is my prayer that Jesus would find glory in our forum, and that He would not be disappointed in what we post in His name.

Excellent points, Pistache! Just wanted to quote them again!

[Robert]

Robert, I understand your post. However, there are many things going on in the world that Christians disagree on. For instance, there is a certain mind-set in favor of socialism as a form of government control - am I to support these posts when I will NEVER accept that type government? Am I to remain silent? I say scripture does NOT support socialism, so I speak against it. Same thing with using guns for self-defense. Many Christians were brought up being taught that guns are evil, so a mind-set against them. I say scripture supports the use of guns for self-defense, so I speak in favor of it. The list of issues go on and on. It is HOW we respond that is key. I admit that I fail in that regard, sometimes. One lady recently said tht we are not to quibble over words. That is very true. Paul taught that, not to quibble or argue over things of little import. However, on matters of doctrinal importance, we ARE to argue (contend) for the faith. I agree l00% that we should be mindful of our posts as they are a witness to the world, and do so in a kind manner. One last thing as to differentiate between an "opinion" and a "belief". Everyone has an opinion based on this or that. A belief, however, HAS to be based on one's interpretation of scripture. Let's stick to scripture.

OD,

I am not against anyone defending themselves or owning guns, but I am against the "gun nut" mentality. Matt summed up what I said best, brother. I just notice our witness here at RF being tainted badly by some of the more questionable posts that come up.

2:


Note: my apologies for using a word that offended a fellow christian. It had been retracted.

[DespizdNRejectd]

I don't mean to pick either, but isn't labeling some posts as "loonier" part of the problem?

[mikalikat]

No, it's not. He was using it in the context of this discussion, and no where else. Robert is trying to point out that those who would pull up stakes and head to the hills to live off of nuts and berries while anarchy explodes down in the valley are free to do just that, and not stir up emotions and pull us away from out witness as Christians.

[DespizdNRejectd]

And all I'm saying is that whatever labels we dish out, we should be prepared to accept in return. If it's truly "your witness" we're talking about, then we need to know why labeling is okay, or whether it would be better to simply state why we think a given course of action is ill advised.

Is labeling certain ideas okay here, and is everyone allowed to do this?

[mattfivefour]

And all I'm saying is that whatever labels we dish out, we should be prepared to accept in return. If it's truly "your witness" we're talking about, then we need to know why labeling is okay, or whether it would be better to simply state why we think a given course of action is ill advised.

Is labeling certain ideas okay here, and is everyone allowed to do this?

There is nothing wrong with "labeling". Paul labeled. Peter labeled. John labeled. Jesus labeled. But labeling has to be scriptural and in the context of sound doctrine. Posts that express alarm and fear and lead others into fear are not of God ... and they need to be dealt with scripturally ... and also in love. And if they deserve a label, so be it. But note the labeling being referred to here is hung on the topic or the treatment of the topic, not hung on the individual. (Though false teachers, wherever they may crop up, must be labeled as such; so too apostates and those who seek to divide and destroy.)

[readytogo]

There is nothing wrong with "labeling". Paul labeled. Peter labeled. John labeled. Jesus labeled. But labeling has to be scriptural and in the context of sound doctrine. Posts that express alarm and fear and lead others into fear are not of God ... and they need to be dealt with scripturally ... and also in love. And if they deserve a label, so be it. But note the labeling being referred to here is hung on the topic or the treatment of the topic, not hung on the individual. (Though false teachers, wherever they may crop up, must be labeled as such; so too apostates and those who seek to divide and destroy.)

:iagree

[DespizdNRejectd]

I agree that Paul et al labeled, and that it's okay. But my point here is that whether something is loony or not is not in the same league (as well as making sure we all get to label equally!). Labeling false teachers is important, but how is one's response to impending global economic collapse in the same boat as false teaching?

We read that when the Israelites were wandering, and they were given manna, the ones that gathered a lot had enough and the ones that gathered little had enough. In this time, I believe each of us must do as the Spirit prompts us; there is no "one size fits all" response that is right or sane, and thus there is no response that must be wrong or insane.

If the concern is over fear mongering, let's remember that the gospel message itself is labeled as such by many. Did not the same Paul who labeled also use fear at times? Why then is fear wrong but labeling not wrong?

Too often topics like this are a moving target with ever-changing boundaries. There is no firm line between fear mongering and healthy warning, between teaching that is false and that which is merely unpleasant to our ears. We need to define and explain why those who feel strongly about giving what they see as legitimate warning is unacceptable, while warning people about hell is okay.

And I still believe that if something is not allowed because it's fear mongering, then just say so. Why label it as loony? How does that not reflect on the person posting it? Would you like someone to call your posts loony, and accept their disclaimer that it's nothing personal?

These are questions each of us must face; there is no need to respond.

[mattfivefour]

Did not the same Paul who labeled also use fear at times? Why then is fear wrong but labeling not wrong?

When did Paul use fear? Other than to correctly warn against despising or neglecting the salvation Christ paid for.